IAM Fleet Service topic 11/6-

[mike33]

Back and forth ....Forth and back ...Bottom line is " No Balls No Blue Chips " ( as they say in vega$ ). Say whatever you want and use all the examples you want. The bottom-line, is ur talking out ur ARSE unless you've been there and I don't see anyone from the west ( premerger) who has been there. So Get ready because it's comming . Represent all you want but it's still representation as you see it, not as it should be and that is the crux of the problem. If you could represent as MC represents then you will be 200 % ahead of the game. The company has more respet for 1 MC than all that he represents. Take Heed. You'll wish you had.

 

[orioleman]

I've been quiet about PRez mostly, and I think you're all a bit confused about his positions. He is a man that will support his members as required to the fullest extent possible. He has no qualms about representation for full or part time, hard workers or lazy shits. If you need representation, he will represent you to the fullest. He, as a Union leader, also was privy to some Company positions as well as his own opinions. As a leader he needs to analyze everything put before him and make decisions. If the Company says "We can't afford to do this", and he agrees based on his own review, how does that make him a Company man? Unless I'm mistaken, the opposing side in any discussion, challenge, arbitration, negotiation, or fight can occasionally be right, and agreeing with this isn't collusion or surrender. There are also times when a fight, legitimate as it may be, is sometimes unwinnable. These are the decisions Union leaders need to make, and the often involve things that hurt the most; pay and jobs.

PRez is a duly elected GC member by his peers. Part of this no doubt came from how PHX feels he represented them. Maybe, instead of critisizing the man for actually expressing his opinions, instead of holding the inside, you should learn what assets he brings to the table and use them in our common fight, which is with the Company, not each other.

neci,
duly noted thanks for your input and view.

Jester,
Thanks for your straight forward response.. Guess what I am looking or hoping for is the new tier of union leadership is educating and bridging the gap between the members and the officers of the district.

mike33 ,
good to hear from you and your dead on with your post. tell the BF hello.

 

[P. REZ]

Back and forth ....Forth and back ...Bottom line is " No Balls No Blue Chips " ( as they say in vega$ ). Say whatever you want and use all the examples you want. The bottom-line, is ur talking out ur ARSE unless you've been there and I don't see anyone from the west ( premerger) who has been there. So Get ready because it's comming . Represent all you want but it's still representation as you see it, not as it should be and that is the crux of the problem. If you could represent as MC represents then you will be 200 % ahead of the game. The company has more respet for 1 MC than all that he represents. Take Heed. You'll wish you had.

Mike33,

MC is a good guy and I have no problems with him but I assure you that PHX is not hurting with me as part of the GC. I am more than capable of handling issues here and I'm sure the company knows their in a fight when I come calling. You are another assuming things about west representatives. CL is more than capable too. I'm sure the company respects our abilities to fight with our background.

P. Rez

 

[rat tales]

[/color]

Janitor,

You are correct when you say that GC's are not above the democratic process. My comments stem from O-man calling ex-TWU corrupt etc. He claims he thinks he met me or CL and that we weren't good enough to take out his trash. Look at the LM 2 reports for the IAM buyout of TWU to go away in this merger. He claims he'll show Jester what Unionism is all about. Well, unless he has substantiated proof that we are corrupt and not supported by the membership in PHX then I don't believe he knows what Unionism is all about.

P. Rez

As you said earlier....call a rumor a rumor.

Rumor had it during the TWU days that you told Trotti and the TWU International
reps that there was zero, zilch, nada support for the TWU on the west coast, better
yet in PHX. Deny it!

This was in spite of your own people obtaining support petitions that you had
dismissed. Funnier yet, there were former AGC's who made fun of you back then
saying that you had in fact made deals with Canale to get an AGC job if you
handed the TWU over to him. They then called the TWU and told them of your offer.
In other words... they played you.

Vegas guys who were at the District Convention told us that they were standing at the
bar when you went up to Roach and said something like "Remember me..... I'm the guy
that handed you the west coast. They went ballistic when you said that.

Those LM-2 reports reflect a deal that you might possibly have helped strike with the
help of your e-board. That is probably why no matter how many Grievances you write
and how many people you represent, the west coast people will still think of you as a sell out.

There....its out there!

 

[orioleman]

Mike33,

MC is a good guy and I have no problems with him but I assure you that PHX is not hurting with me as part of the GC. I am more than capable of handling issues here and I'm sure the company knows their in a fight when I come calling. You are another assuming things about west representatives. CL is more than capable too. I'm sure the company respects our abilities to fight with our background.

P. Rez

not to be to particular on detail. But Who the Heck cares what the company thinks and who the company respects. Let me let you in on a little secret..

the good ole management sit with you and give you all the gloom and doom knowing you go back to the membership and break it to the membership

(hence mouthpiece). then after you leave the room . Dale and the boys shut the door and have a good laugh.. I bet Manager Mike C has alot of fun with you

since he's had to deal with some real UNION people back on the east coast.

one other question and then I'll step aside. with your STRONG leadership skills and cult like following . WHY then could PHX only muster 70 votes for district

officers during the election, what's your membership 1100 - 1200. Sounds like a REAL LEADER to me.. as Michael Jackson once told Paul McCarthy

"You keep dreaming"

remember one thing. "Strong Leaders have EVEN stronger followers"

 

[P. REZ]

As you said earlier....call a rumor a rumor.

Rumor had it during the TWU days that you told Trotti and the TWU International
reps that there was zero, zilch, nada support for the TWU on the west coast, better
yet in PHX. Deny it!

This was in spite of your own people obtaining support petitions that you had
dismissed. Funnier yet, there were former AGC's who made fun of you back then
saying that you had in fact made deals with Canale to get an AGC job if you
handed the TWU over to him. They then called the TWU and told them of your offer.
In other words... they played you.

Vegas guys who were at the District Convention told us that they were standing at the
bar when you went up to Roach and said something like "Remember me..... I'm the guy
that handed you the west coast. They went ballistic when you said that.

Those LM-2 reports reflect a deal that you might possibly have helped strike with the
help of your e-board. That is probably why no matter how many Grievances you write
and how many people you represent, the west coast people will still think of you as a sell out.

There....its out there!

rat tales,

The only thing I ever told Trotti and the TWU International was that it was a waste of their time to go to PHL because there was no interest there. I told them to focus on CLT. As for support in PHX for TWU, our International was well aware of the support for TWU.

As for being offered an AGC job by Canale, not true, I have said on here before that the only time I ever met him was when he came to a picket at corporate and he said he liked my sign. I introduced myself and we talked for one minute.

As for talking to Roach. I told him that I had met him in PHX when he came to visit and I laid in to him about RR and the fact that RR refused to put me on as a Union rep. Whichever LAS guy said that doesn't know what he is talking about. I did tell him that we were better off with the IAM because of the pension etc.

As for the LM 2 report, the numbers don't lie about the buyout and I had nothing to do with that. If you ask LAS people they will tell you that out of 7 members including myself with the TWU that only 3 ever considered keeping TWU. I was one of them so get your facts straight before you bash a Union guy. In the end the vote was 5-2 for the IAM and I was in support of the IAM because I believed with the 1700 furloughs on the east coast and the apathy about voting that we would be de-certified and have no Union. I wanted to have the TWU but the chance of losing Union altogether was too great. Our International tried for the marriage like the upstairs group but the IAM said no. The buyout was leaked and this caused the IAM takeover to be delayed by a month or so.

You can bank on this as factual

P. Rez

 

[P. REZ]

not to be to particular on detail. But Who the Heck cares what the company thinks and who the company respects. Let me let you in on a little secret..

the good ole management sit with you and give you all the gloom and doom knowing you go back to the membership and break it to the membership

(hence mouthpiece). then after you leave the room . Dale and the boys shut the door and have a good laugh.. I bet Manager Mike C has alot of fun with you

since he's had to deal with some real UNION people back on the east coast.

one other question and then I'll step aside. with your STRONG leadership skills and cult like following . WHY then could PHX only muster 70 votes for district

officers during the election, what's your membership 1100 - 1200. Sounds like a REAL LEADER to me.. as Michael Jackson once told Paul McCarthy

"You keep dreaming"

Dude, get a clue. I was not even a Union rep. at the time because RR was the chair and there was no GC. RR and I did not see eye to eye and he would not use me as a rep. I had no clue who most of the people running for office were. I did vote for RD, MC and NH. Those were the only names I knew of. As for being a mouthpiece for management, not even close. It is easy to listen to hearsay about someone but I challenge you to find out what I'm about and I assure you that you will think strong Union guy when you do.

P. Rez

 

[P. REZ]

Rat tales and Oman,

Let me give you guys a little background on politics. JN has been stating he will be an AGC for 3-4 years. Ask other people in LAS and I'll get you in touch with his ex-girlfriend who will substantiate this. If you are receiving these lies about me from him take it from the source. I also have been told by LAS people that he has bashed me to our DL. JN is a person on a mission and will do or say anything to get where he needs to be. Bank on it.

P. Rez

 

[orioleman]

rat tales,

As for talking to Roach. I told him that I had met him in PHX when he came to visit and I laid in to him about RR and the fact that RR refused to put me on as a Union rep. Whichever LAS guy said that doesn't know what he is talking about. I did tell him that we were better off with the IAM because of the pension etc.

Funny that's not what you tried to sell us in CLT . Actually I told you that No matter what you had to offer, Now way were you going to get close
to touching our Pension which we had to negotiate for in BK .


You can bank on this as factual

P. Rez

As far as WHO you only knew on the ticket. I do believe one of your ex TWU officer was on that ticket.. Guess as Prez you didn't even know who you
own officers were. I'm sure D.A sect treasurer will be disappointed you didn't strike a vote for him and the rest of the ticket. But hey dude thats whats so
great about democracy and voting its YOUR choice. So I do applaud you for at least taking the time to VOTE..

 

[orioleman]

Dude, get a clue. I was not even a Union rep. at the time because RR was the chair and there was no GC. RR and I did not see eye to eye and he would not use me as a rep. I had no clue who most of the people running for office were. I did vote for RD, MC and NH. Those were the only names I knew of. As for being a mouthpiece for management, not even close. It is easy to listen to hearsay about someone but I challenge you to find out what I'm about and I assure you that you will think strong Union guy when you do.

P. Rez

Didn't realize you had to be a union rep to be a strong union person and fight the fight. See Prez that's part of the problem people think that unless I'm on payroll
or hold a special title with the union then I'm not fighting the fight.. Let me give you a little background . I've been fighting the cause for many many years with out
holding any position . gee what a novel Idea . just a member wanting justice and fairness in the workplace.

 

[orioleman]

Rat tales and Oman,

Let me give you guys a little background on politics. JN has been stating he will be an AGC for 3-4 years. Ask other people in LAS and I'll get you in touch with his ex-girlfriend who will substantiate this. If you are receiving these lies about me from him take it from the source. I also have been told by LAS people that he has bashed me to our DL. JN is a person on a mission and will do or say anything to get where he needs to be. Bank on it.

P. Rez

I BET you can. I can be pretty ruthless sometimes . So I'm going to give you a pass on that subject and would suggest you move on down the line

cause you really don't want that chapter to come out. But hey I'm game if you are.

 

[ChockJockey]

cause you really don't want that chapter to come out. But hey I'm game if you are.

In this thread: people separated by great distances arguing points based on rumors they've heard and assumptions they've made about one another in order to sort out once and for all...uh...what exactly's at stake here again?

I'd suggest that if y'all insist on continuing this silly back-and-forth maybe you do so in PM form and spare the rest of us the embarrassment. PROTIP: nobody cares what WF in ORD said about JK in IAD at the CM's luncheon in ATL four damn years ago(unforgivable!); maybe you haven't noticed, but some in the membership have bigger concerns than the grubby dynamics of union politics, i.e., losing their jobs. Maybe out of respect for them and the positions you hold you could show your brothers in solidarity a little more tact.

:down:

 

[rat tales]

Rat tales and Oman,

Let me give you guys a little background on politics. JN has been stating he will be an AGC for 3-4 years. Ask other people in LAS and I'll get you in touch with his ex-girlfriend who will substantiate this. If you are receiving these lies about me from him take it from the source. I also have been told by LAS people that he has bashed me to our DL. JN is a person on a mission and will do or say anything to get where he needs to be. Bank on it.

P. Rez

ChockJockey is correct, PREZ broke his "Call a rumor a rumor rule"

And to set the record straight, the people that heard your statement(more than 1)
were average Joe's invited to attend the meet and greet to get to know the people
of the District and the International. For that reason I think their account of what they
heard seems accurate.

On the dynamics of union politics, ChockJockey, you must take into account the past
when looking to the future. You want to make sure you put the right people in place
who can affect our future in negotiations and the security of our jobs. If you don't
attend meetings and understand the process or are unwilling to participate, please
step aside.

Orioleman is telling everyone that there are elections coming up. The best way for a
person to get elected is when no one else knows and no one runs against him/her.
That was the Canale way, and I'm glad that in stations like CLT, it is a thing of the past.

PREZ, you seem to have bad blood with JN and this seems to have struck a nerve. From
what I have been told, he has remained very active with his "elected" position with the
District. Don't let your "position envy" lead you to petty name calling. He was one of
your fellow e-board members. Brothers in arms and all that...

 

[The Janitor]

Rat tales and Oman,

Let me give you guys a little background on politics. JN has been stating he will be an AGC for 3-4 years. Ask other people in LAS and I'll get you in touch with his ex-girlfriend who will substantiate this. If you are receiving these lies about me from him take it from the source. I also have been told by LAS people that he has bashed me to our DL. JN is a person on a mission and will do or say anything to get where he needs to be. Bank on it.

P. Rez

why are you so paranoid about JN? Do you not consider him a union guy because in a post 5 minutes ago you said one shouldn't be bashing union guys? He's an officer on the District eboard, elected by the membership. Rat Tails and Oman are presumably from CLT and apparently they are referring to what you yourself said to them in a TWU raid.
I did hear that your eboard sent you to the INTL IAM to work things out but you said you never talked to Roach and I'd have a hard time believing Roach wouldn't have been there.

Here's some backround on politics, you are thought of as a strong union guy that will at least be useful in negotiations but I seriously doubt your bashing an eboard member online is good politics for you, especially since your involving yourself in gossip. PXH is moving forward nicely so let's keep moving it forward without bashing eboard members.

 

[P. REZ]

ChockJockey is correct, PREZ broke his "Call a rumor a rumor rule"

And to set the record straight, the people that heard your statement(more than 1)
were average Joe's invited to attend the meet and greet to get to know the people
of the District and the International. For that reason I think their account of what they
heard seems accurate.

On the dynamics of union politics, ChockJockey, you must take into account the past
when looking to the future. You want to make sure you put the right people in place
who can affect our future in negotiations and the security of our jobs. If you don't
attend meetings and understand the process or are unwilling to participate, please
step aside.

Orioleman is telling everyone that there are elections coming up. The best way for a
person to get elected is when no one else knows and no one runs against him/her.
That was the Canale way, and I'm glad that in stations like CLT, it is a thing of the past.

PREZ, you seem to have bad blood with JN and this seems to have struck a nerve. From
what I have been told, he has remained very active with his "elected" position with the
District. Don't let your "position envy" lead you to petty name calling. He was one of
your fellow e-board members. Brothers in arms and all that...

No envy just facts and him bashing my name fact.