US Airways Pilots' Labor Discussion 4/2-4/8

[Piedmont1984]

A union has a lawful "duty" to fairly represent it's members. The members under the law (not USAPA bylaws, but the actual law) don't have to lift a finger. Not a thing. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

There is a distinction between doing nothing and actively doing something to subvert, obstruct or impede the lawful CBA.

 

[EastUS]

If you believe this, the outcome of Addington will most likely make your head explode.

A union has a lawful "duty" to fairly represent it's members. The members under the law (not USAPA bylaws, but the actual law) don't have to lift a finger. Not a thing. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

My guess is that "documentation" of such never sees the courtroom, since the behaviors of the members (or class, for nonmembers) has absolutely nothing at all to do with the union's lawful duty to represent.

I'd simply note the west certainly better hope that not even so much as a whiff of their actual behaviors comes to the jury's nostrils...lest their noses explode

 

[fodase]

Which brings me to the bottom line on all this = How's it at all reasonable for anyone to ever want to see these groups actually operating flights together? If west safety is supossedly compromised by even the presence of an east jumpseater...well....???

No problem, the west pilot will simply have his fo removed.

 

[EastUS]

Three and a half years is baby #### where I come from.

We agree there. Where we differ is that you think it superior in value to, say, 20 years out east

 

[EastUS]

QUOTE (EastUS @ Apr 3 2009, 11:25 AM) *
Which brings me to the bottom line on all this = How's it at all reasonable for anyone to ever want to see these groups actually operating flights together? If west safety is supossedly compromised by even the presence of an east jumpseater...well....???

No problem, the west pilot will simply have his fo removed.

Perfect..and the predictable response from any true "Professional" 🙄 I ask again: Is there really ANYONE out there than can make ANY reasonable case for advancing the idea that combining these groups together operationally actually makes sense?...on ANY level?

 

[EastUS]

Oh, and back before I was downgraded I did return the favor and refused east pilots my js. Yes, eastus, I know, I'm the immature one.....

Indeed so, as I've been refused travel by the west, but will never deny even yourself a ride on any aircraft I'm responsible for. If one has ANY actual principals..it's necessary to adhere to, and act on them..period. Not all can be expected to behave in purely opportunistic and childishly, petty fashion, nor should ANY of us ever do so within our class and craft.

 

[ableoneable]

Indeed so, as I've been refused travel by the west, but will never deny even yourself a ride on any aircraft I'm responsible for. If one has ANY actual principals..it's necessary to adhere to, and act on them..period. Not all can be expected to behave in purely opportunistic and childishly, petty fashion, nor should ANY of us ever do so within our class and craft.

Here the ramblemaster makes a point, and a good one at that.

EastUS and I see eye to eye on this one. The jumpseat should never be abused this way.

I have never denied a jumpseat and would not do so even if I am denied a ride on east metal.

A guy would have to be an over the top A Hole to get a denial out of me.

 

[EastUS]

I hate to break this to the East but the Wests' Law firm is keenly aware of, and interested in this upcoming 70million dollar windfall. I wouldn't be so sure yet that it's going to be an "east only" bonus. Damages can be expensive.

Thanks for exemplifying the "Integrity" of the entire west position in an instant = "We did NOTHING to actually and honestly earn this, (which, although entirely based on earlier east sacrifices..is a "windfall")...but; Gimme! Gimme! Gimme!"

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

There is a distinction between doing nothing and actively doing something to subvert, obstruct or impede the lawful CBA.

🙄 You really don't get it, thanks for the jumpseat though. What an ethical bunch. Hopefully the court system will finally hold your lawful cba accountable for all its shenanigans.

 

[EastUS]

🙄 You really don't get it, thanks for the jumpseat though. What an ethical bunch. Hopefully the court system will finally hold your lawful cba accountable for all its shenanigans.

Thanks for all the systematic denials of jumpseats, in advancement of your "Righteous Position" of course...indeed = "What an ethical bunch" :blink:

Were I among your group; the very last thing I'd EVER be wishing for is for ANY court to hold anyone the least bit accountable for their "shenanigans"...Just an observation.

 

[EastUS]

POST DELETED BY MODERATOR

Speaking for just one "geriatric" myself...and regardless of your obvious disrespect, (which I'd overlook only by reason of your at least being costumed up like a professional aviator), and your personally, very clearly, just not knowing any better..you're always welcome on any jumpseat I've control over.

When you can explain to me just how fragile and why so many west nerves are, so that even safety's compromised by hosting an east jumpseater..we can speak of growing up.

 

[Richard]

Folks,

This thread is headed in the wrong direction....calling one side or the other "geriatrics" is technically an insult and is not permissible here.

Drop the name calling and stay on topic.

Thank you.

 

[tazz]

Here the ramblemaster makes a point, and a good one at that.

A guy would have to be an over the top A Hole to get a denial out of me.

This applies to every eastie I denied the js to. Like the one who told me to "F off", and the one who told me to "watch my back", and the one who told me "you will get yours when the court decides your stupid case".

 

[ClueByFour]

There is a distinction between doing nothing and actively doing something to subvert, obstruct or impede the lawful CBA.

Of course, the only attempt to prove that anyone has done anything to subvert, obstruct, or impede the CBA was tossed out of court.

That's a problem.

And, even if there existed actions to "subvert" the CBA, they are not relevant to the question of USAPA's failure to execute it's DFR. They'd only be ripe in a different action.

I'd simply note the west certainly better hope that not even so much as a whiff of their actual behaviors comes to the jury's nostrils...lest their noses explode

Let's say that Wake loses his mind, and that Team Seeham actually gets to introduce, say, the earlier federal suit into evidence. You see where it's going on cross, correct?

"So, (insert the witness here), was the lawsuit in question promptly dismissed with prejudice by the Court?"

Yeah, that'll make a real impression with the jury.

You guys really don't get it--the question is about the DFR. The rest is just noise.

USAPA and anyone who really believed the seniority land-grab it represents really needs to get legal advice from someone who is not Seeham. The most likely outcome is exactly where things were under ALPA and the choice will then be LOA 93 forever or Nicolau.

But nobody said the mob was smart.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Speaking for just one "geriatric" myself...and regardless of your obvious disrespect, (which I'd overlook only by reason of your at least being costumed up like a professional aviator), and your personally, very clearly, just not knowing any better..you're always welcome on any jumpseat I've control over.

When you can explain to me just how fragile and why so many west nerves are, so that even safety's compromised by hosting an east jumpseater..we can speak of growing up.

Oh please, you can dish it out but sure can't take it. You are pretty good at feigning indignation, I'll give you that. Feign a little indignation and then jump on your high horse. I suppose some people buy it, might as well keep doing it.

Deep down, you know clue by four is right, I think that is what is bugging you.