ALPA/USAPA Thread for the Week with a Poll 3/16-22

[oldiebutgoody]

As someone stated above, USAPA left the PHX roadshow early. I am curious to find out why. Unable to stand the heat one would guess...

Anything new on this?

 

[traderjake]

Logic, integrity and reason (note you should not place a comma after the next to last list item) are all the east pilots have to offer.

Making an East Reserve First Officer senior to a West Captain is not logical.

Making a furloughed East pilot senior to working West pilot is not reasonable.

It's stealing another man's job, which is something a person with integrity does not do.

 

[sharktooth]

Making an East Reserve First Officer senior to a West Captain is not logical.

Making a furloughed East pilot senior to working West pilot is not reasonable.

It's stealing another man's job, which is something a person with integrity does not do.

Logical, reasonable and integrity would be to assign a list by length of service with complete protections for existing expectations.

If USAirways were defunct you might possibly have a case. Since they were due, by Parkers admissions, to outlast HP, as well as the fact that USAirways made more money per seat mile than HP, would lead me to suspect that the strongest carrier was US and they saved HP from certain liquidation. So, by HPs pilots own reasoning, DOH/LOS should prevail.

The east offers DOH with complete protections. The west offers basically a staple, certainly not "relative seniority".

Which would US take when bought by Mesa ten years down the road, DOH or relative seniority? Which scenario would you wish for your legacy to prove your point?

 

[nostradamus]

"I found the America West Airline drug trafficking trial fascinating. Patrick Thurston, Vice President of Operations, America West, Bob Russell, Chief of Pilots, and Carl Wobser, a captain, all pleaded guilty to multiple counts of narcotics trafficking. "

"The three AMERICA WEST pilots had all plea bargained out."

Integrity lesson from a america west pilot

 

[nostradamus]

"They are now crying because they didn't get their way," he said in an e-mail. "They made their decision to work at USAir; I made mine to work at America West, which, by the way, has historically been the LOWEST paid airline in the U.S. The East pilots have been paid far and above what America West pilots have been paid over the same period of time doing the same job."

America West pilots to brethren at US Airways: Be thankful

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

Fellow pilot,

On March 19, 2008, USAPA conducted a road show at the PHX airport. The scheduling of this road show was in furtherance of our goal to fairly represent the entire US Airways’ pilot group while, at the same time, complying with our constitutional mandate to pursue seniority integration on a date of hire basis.

We wanted to provide West pilots with the opportunity to meet the USAPA interim officers face-to-face. We did not expect to sway votes, but we did hope to convey the message that, while many West pilots may disagree with USAPA, they should not be afraid of us.

In order to give the West pilots a sense of control over the process, USAPA’s officers made very brief opening presentations and dedicated the remainder of the four-hour meeting to answering questions from the West pilots. Moreover, in order to avoid any charge that USAPA was manipulating the process, we allowed the AWA MEC Communications Chairperson to moderate the meeting.

To put it bluntly, we were sharply disappointed with the level of discourse. USAPA officers explained that the concept of date of hire seniority was a core union value recognized by most of the airline industry’s labor unions. Unfortunately, these explanations were met with profanity, shouts of “scab,†and an insistence that East pilots owe their jobs to the West pilots.

At one point, the self-styled “moderator†of the discussion – the AWA MEC Communications Chairperson – exclaimed that no one in the room would pay dues to the USAPA. USAPA’s interim officers patiently explained that such a course of action would not be in the West pilots’ self-interest and would leave them powerless in any future contract ratification vote. But, at this point, it became clear that the same pilots who would shout the epithet “scab†could not be considered true unionists since they had professed their intention to become non-members. USAPA terminated the meeting at approximately 1:30 p.m.

USAPA will continue to hold out the olive branch to the West pilots based on our belief that the attendees at the March 19 road show were not truly representative of the entire West pilot group. In any event, on April 17, we expect the National Mediation Board to certify USAPA as the exclusive collective bargaining representative of the entire US Airways pilot group. USAPA’s policy will be dictated by its constitution and by those pilots who participate in USAPA’s democratic process.

 

[nostradamus]

How america west saved themselves. Facts, links, no opinions. Click here.

facts

america west airline, first in line for government provided loans taking advantage of 911.

Shows up for bankruptcy sales, ATA DAL.

Let the buyer beware.

They wrote the book on excuses. Incompetent speculators.

Morality is decided by their personal gain. This is not right.

The hand is faster than the eye.

 

[Leonidas]

Anything new on this?

Seeham asked for a police escort to the bathroom, that answer your question?

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Watching those usapa boys sneakin around asking for cops everywhere they went, along with their overall demeanor, made me think of a dog who knows he's doing something wrong. The only difference being I've never seen a dog able to ask for cops. An all inclusive union my rear, they know what they are up to.

That being said, I don't think all usapians are bad, that Philly 330 captain seemed to be an decent sort that really wasn't out to harm anyone, and he most likely means well. Bradford on the other hand, well.........guess I better stop here or its the cornfield.

 

[LGA Fleet Service]

america west airline, first in line for government provided loans taking advantage of 911.

Speaking of facts, I seem to recall another airline, based on the "Profitable East Cost" bellying up to the government trough as well.

Only one of the so called 'Legacy Carriers' to get an ATSB loan IIRC.

 

[CaptChill]

FYI:

A prime example of "don't confuse me with the facts... my mind is made up!"

For months AWA pilots have bitterly complained that USAPA had not conducted a "road show" out west. (Haven't heard any complaints about the "Magical Mystery Bus Tour" not making it to the western bases though). The interim officers of USAPA and hundreds of volunteers are not being compensated in any manner whatsoever (flight pay loss), are flying full schedules, and have devoted thousands and thousands of hours to give the pilots of US Airways a choice in representation.

When USAPA was finally able to conduct a Road Show in PHX, instead of conducting themselves in a professional manner, asking important questions and then really listening to the responses, the AWA pilots in attendance hurled every imaginable inflammatory insult and generally behaved in a totally disgraceful manner.

We have seen first hand the selective enforcement by ALPA of their own constitution and by-laws, the greed driven, power hungry LEC and MEC reps who have completely ignored those whom they claim to represent, we've seen National place one of our major LEC's into Trusteeship just days before appointments of MEC Chairman, V-Chairman, and important committees, all done to protect those that do ALPA's bidding from being removed from their positions, we've witnessed the destruction of our pilot's careers, pensions and any hope for the future at the hands of ALPA... NO MORE!...

Westy's listen up... For the majority of East pilots who support USAPA they do so because of decades of ALPA's malfeasance, avarice and their repeated failures to fulfill their fiduciary responsibilities and to protect and fairly represent the pilots of US Airways..

My prediction... USAPA will win this representational election, with or without the AWA pilot's support. AWA pilots can continue to behave in a despicable manner, or can get involved and learn (if they will shut their mouths long enough...) that USAPA is about protecting the West and East positions equally... and bring a bright new day and hope for ALL US AIRWAYS PILOTS!


BUT AGAIN... DON'T CONFUSE ME WITH THE FACTS... MY MIND IS MADE UP!

 

[nostradamus]

Speaking of facts, I seem to recall another airline, based on the "Profitable East Cost" bellying up to the government trough as well.

Only one of the so called 'Legacy Carriers' to get an ATSB loan IIRC.

Yes, that legacy carrier used their loan to pay off the america west loan.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Yes, that legacy carrier used their loan to pay off the america west loan.

Ahhh - another "fact" is born.....

Jim

 

[700UW]

Wrong, the two loans were still seperate after the merger and US refinanced and paid the loans off and they are now held by private banks.

 

[sharktooth]

Wrong, the two loans were still seperate after the merger and US refinanced and paid the loans off and they are now held by private banks.

If the loans are paid off, then why is anyone still holding them? Did someone forget to visit a friendly courthouse? <_<