US ALPA/USAPA/West Thread for week of 3/22-29

[nostradamus]

I'll give you the same answer I give every pollster I even bother taking the time to talk to - if that's the only answers you'll accept then you're not interested in my opinion but rather seeking to prove a pre-established view.

Jim

Thank you for explaining the airline pilots association wilson polling process. Goodnight sir.

 

[BoeingBoy]

I'm obviously optimistic that a new union will at least establish a far better degree of pilot involvement for at least the forseeable future..which is as good as it ever gets.

I hope your optimism proves accurate. I'd only note what I said before - involvement originates with the pilots, not with the union. While the pilots, if involved, can mold the union, the union can't force feed involvement to the pilots. At best, it can only give the pilots the opportunity to be involved. Quoting myself on another subject, although I'm certainly not the original source, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

Thank you for explaining the airline pilots association wilson polling process. Goodnight sir.

I'll assume that you're enamored of polls then - black and white answers to questions about gray situations would fit your apparent black and white view of the gray world. It is apparently your view that all polling is equally biased, certainly a black and white view of "it is or it isn't", since you somehow extracted that conclusion from my gray reply that polls are biased. I made no distinction between barely perceptible bias and gross bias, yet you made my answer fit your "either/or with no in between" world. It must be frustrating living in a world full of if, maybe, sometimes, etc.

Jim

 

[700UW]

Roger Hall's information is wrong.

I was assigned by the IAM to the CO/IAM Flight Attendants concessionary negotiations.

While CO was not facing Bankruptcy at the time if concessions were not given, they would have.

ALPA, IAM, TWU and the IBT all gave concessions at CO after 9/11, just like the rest of the legacy airlines.

ALPA and the IBT approved them while the IAM FAs rejected them and had to go back into negotiatons and later ratified.

They recieved a new CBA in 2006, the IAM/FA CBA that is.

NYT

Continental said earlier this month that it could be forced to cut jobs, cancel plane orders and seek more concessions from workers if the contracts were not approved.

The company, which is based in Houston, proposed the cuts in November to help stem losses, which have totaled $871 million since 2000.

The airline says it is expecting a significant loss this year because an increase in jet fuel prices is driving up costs and rising price competition has pushed down fares over the past year. Three fare increases since Feb. 24 helped Continental and other airlines begin to increase revenue.

 

[Phoenix]

I'll offer that as a fine argument in favor of democratic proceedings. Despite our diamtrically opposed views otherwise..our voting records on those issues are identical. I do find it curious that you evidently now think it fully appropriate to staple said furloughed pilots below the most junior AWA new hire..but that's a never-ending source for debate.

I notice that ALPA is not the only one who is tossing lots of flak into the sky feeling an increased panic of imminent defeat, yet unable to figure out what to target... since it is sorta like a vote.. where each persons opinion matters. If one only pays lip service while living high on the hog, then they are in a world of hurt when they need a vote of confidence from the serfs.

And I suppose now that it is clear they can't win the hearts and minds, they might resort to ridicule and condescension.