US Airways Pilots' Labor Thread 7/14-7/21 NO PERSONAL REMARKS

[traderjake]

I continue to be amazed at USAPA's counsel and I don't mean this in a good way. Seham and the members of his firm are, in my opinion, an embarrassment. They clearly are way outside the mainstream in their views and they are all objectionable in the way they practice law in front of at least this court. .... They don't know when to shut up and have, in my opinion, made matters even worse.

No competent lawyers were willing to represent USAPA.

 

[cleardirect]

Excellent report HP-FA. Thank you for taking the time to post the information.

It sounds to me like Seham/usapa is feeling the desperation and finality of the situation.

 

[traderjake]

(When did this forum become Twitter, BTW?)

Right after your 3,000th post.

 

[ClueByFour]

Refresh my memory. What was the west's compromise position again, during negotiations or at Wye River?

You mean, after they'd negotiated to an impasse and then had the Nicolau in hand?

Once arbitration was agreed to (or, more accurately, once Nicolau had the case and the panel was charged) that's it. There was no reason at all for the West guys to do so much at Wye River as drink the free diet coke.

Wye River was a massive mistake on ALPA's part, in that it could have very easily resulted it ALPA losing essentially the same DFR case that USAPA just lost.

 

[Bear96]

You mean, after they'd negotiated to an impasse and then had the Nicolau in hand?

Once arbitration was agreed to (or, more accurately, once Nicolau had the case and the panel was charged) that's it. There was no reason at all for the West guys to do so much at Wye River as drink the free diet coke.

Good point, as usual, but it will be lost on the Easties.

To this day they refuse to recognize or acknowledge that the time to compromise and negotiate was before arbitration.

 

[Waketurbulence]

Refresh my memory. What was the west's compromise position again, during negotiations or at Wye River?

It was the fact that our position was "relative seniority", which as it turns out is the fairest method, and not a pure staple of the east below the West.

I'd say that was a serious compromise.

Wye River was irrelevent and a complete waste of time. It should have NEVER happened.

 

[HPDriver]

It was the fact that our position was "relative seniority", which as it turns out is the fairest method, and not a pure staple of the east below the West.

I'd say that was a serious compromise.

Wye River was irrelevent and a complete waste of time. It should have NEVER happened.

We had to go so as to "amuse" ALPA. It was just a show, nothing more.

And I see the east posters are coming out in droves to spin today's hearings.

 

[captainJack]

And I see the east posters are coming out in droves to spin today's hearings.

Both of them? Does two constitute "droves"?

 

[aquagreen73s]

Having said that, if the West would have made any capitulation toward the east at Wye, the West members harmed by any change from the Nic would have had a DFR against ALPA for nearly the same reason the West won against USAPA. I believe Prater, Freund and others knew this when they talked of "mutual" solutions. They wanted the West to come up with some compromise, but the West reps were in absolutely no position to give anything up, less they be ostricized and/or sued.

It's debatable whether the three Wye River reps had the authority to negotiate away the Nic, but the MEC members are the agents for the West which means they could have agreed to whatever the three reps came up with and then the West membership would have had no recourse against ALPA.

That was the idea behind Wye River. It was set up perfectly to get the West to concede Nicolau and then insulate ALPA from a DFR. Thank God the MC held their ground.

 

[Megasnoop]

QUOTE (HPDriver @ Jul 17 2009, 02:43 AM)
And I see the east posters are coming out in droves to spin today's hearings.

Both of them? Does two constitute "droves"?

I assume that was HPDs attempt at humor. I haven't counted any East posters since today's festivities.

"You should always go to other people's funerals, otherwise, they won't come to yours." Yogi Berra

 

[Hate2fly]

QUOTE (HPDriver @ Jul 17 2009, 02:43 AM)
And I see the east posters are coming out in droves to spin today's hearings.




I assume that was HPDs attempt at humor. I haven't counted any East posters since today's festivities.

"You should always go to other people's funerals, otherwise, they won't come to yours." Yogi Berra

Megasnoop,

We will get to see if the Judge tries to take away the east section 6. Lets assume he does......what happens to the west flight attendants they just filed for section 6. This is going to get really interesting!

Keep your eye on the prize!

 

[HPDriver]

Megasnoop,

We will get to see if the Judge tries to take away the east section 6. Lets assume he does......what happens to the west flight attendants they just filed for section 6. This is going to get really interesting!

Keep your eye on the prize!

Your S6 wasn't taken away but was merely adjusted to include the west as well along with Nic which, by the way, the company stated is the only list they recognize.

As for the west FA's, they have nothing to worry about. There situation is unrelated and irrelevant to Addington.

You east guys should be more worried about the competence of your lawyers.

 

[Hate2fly]

Your S6 wasn't taken away but was merely adjusted to include the west as well along with Nic which, by the way, the company stated is the only list they recognize.

As for the west FA's, they have nothing to worry about. There situation is unrelated and irrelevant to Addington.

You east guys should be more worried about the competence of your lawyers.

Look the day our legal team showed up in the Judges courtroom we knew what the final result would be! It has been a hostile environment from the very first meeting with the Judge. He doesn't like us and we don't like him. So on to the 9th we go.

 

[Barrister]

All you need to know is that no Judge on the Planet can force you to vote for a contract that you don't want to accept. And Parker will NEVER sweeten the pot enough to make that happen. Look for a deal soon involving fragmentation. Maybe the East some and the West well......how are those RPMs and yields looking out there. If the East is losing money how do you think the West is doing.

When age 65 kicks in (in just 2 1/2 years) 250 a year will move up and get raises. We can wait ....can you??
Look at it this way. How would you feel if the age 60 had not changed. During this whole fiasco 600 MORE east guys would have moved uo....and the West.....that is our whole point. Assuming we are here in 2 years might be time to sit down and talk........remember it ain't just the F/Os who are hot about NIC.

Please look at this clearly...just how long do you think the appeal will take.....and how long for a contract to EVEN VOTE ON will take. Pull up a chair this could take awhile.

It doesn't matter what we think it is what the judge thinks and he clearly wants to nail the East....but see para 1 anove.

 

[Barrister]

All you need to know is that no Judge on the Planet can force you to vote for a contract that you don't want to accept. And Parker will NEVER sweeten the pot enough to make that happen. Look for a deal soon involving fragmentation. Maybe the East some and the West well......how are those RPMs and yields looking out there. If the East is losing money how do you think the West is doing.

When age 65 kicks in (in just 2 1/2 years) 250 a year will move up and get raises. We can wait ....can you??
Look at it this way. How would you feel if the age 60 had not changed. During this whole fiasco 600 MORE east guys would have moved uo....and the West.....that is our whole point. Assuming we are here in 2 years might be time to sit down and talk........remember it ain't just the F/Os who are hot about NIC.

Please look at this clearly...just how long do you think the appeal will take.....and how long for a contract to EVEN VOTE ON will take. Pull up a chair this could take awhile.

It doesn't matter what we think it is what the judge thinks and he clearly wants to nail the East....but see para 1 above.

Oh and one more thing....by the time you get the majority and vote USAPA out....800 more guys will have moved up.....and the new union getting up to speed and getting a proposal on the table....makes me feel old just thinkin about it. I can see this thing dragging out another 5-10 years...assuming we stay in business.