The "dvd" From Awa-former

[Travelpro72]

If I had to fly in and out of LAS or PHX day in and day out I would pull my hair out. Those terminals, ESPECIALLY LAS are horrible. I hate that damn terminal we moved into in LAS. It's like a flashback to the 70's. Yes PHL is no better but at least I know I'm boarding a flight out of that snake pit to someplace possibly fun. Hopefully we the "NEW" US can do something with those airports. Can we say, "DUMPS".

 

[desertgal]

OK, I'm also here laffin my ### off at some of these posts, but then I am brought back to earth when I remember I am a former HP FA.

AND, I am embarrassed I have to ask, cuz usually I consider myself well-informed;
What is the deal with the DVD? Is it something afa66 sent to USeast members?
I clicked a link to see the video, but the estimated download was 1hr 15min, so forget that. (I have dial-up)
I read my updates from afa66, but don't remember seing anything about a DVD.

Please, PLEASE, I have mentioned this before, PLEASE don't assume that ALL HP FAs are big seniority cry babies!
I seriously doubt the BOD will go for changing the policy, but if they did, I'm not sure I would be entirely comfortable with the 'free' seniority.
I can't imagine it would be too pleasent working with one or more east FAs who were 'robbed' of their seniority.

And, put me on the list for CLT. When my kids are big, I'm outta here!
A 20yr fence on PHX would NOT be to my benefit.
AND furthermore, I do not want to wait 20years before I can fly with US east folks!
I'm actually EXCITED to be part of a 'big' multi-base, international carrier.

 

[PITbull]

And to add to my post on the previous page:

The f/as who fly International fights in PHL and CLT will lose between $350-$700 per month by flying out of PHX in 2007 ONLY IF and I mean IF there is growth to warrant any type of vacancies in PHX. And IF AWA Council 66 screams for a long term fence for PHX, none of those f/as, and I mean not a one will be able to fly our International flights out of CLT or PHL and make that kind of money. Is this truly what the AWA f/as want for every single one of their members?

Get educated on the issue so you know if you even have an arguement at all!

 

[usair_begins_with_u]

Get educated on the issue so you know if you even have an arguement at all!

Good luck.... <_<

 

[desertgal]

PITbull,

THANK YOU for that information!!
Our mec has not given us ANY INFO regarding USeast seniority. They have left us to speculate and freak out since May.
(well, I"M not actually freaking out, but many are)
I try to be the Devil's advocate, I try to calm and reassure the scared ones, but without the facts, as you presented, its comes across as just more speculation.

ALSO, I want to bring up a point,
With all the HP talk of 'relative' integration, I find myself wondering, Relative to what? The PIT base? The CLT base? The PHL base?
I just don't see how 'relative' could be accomplished 'fairly'.

 

[goodgirl37]

And to add to my post on the previous page:

The f/as who fly International fights in PHL and CLT will lose between $350-$700 per month by flying out of PHX in 2007 ONLY IF and I mean IF there is growth to warrant any type of vacancies in PHX. And IF AWA Council 66 screams for a long term fence for PHX, none of those f/as, and I mean not a one will be able to fly our Intenational flights out of CLT or PHL and make that kind of money. Is this truly what the AWA f/as want for every single one of their members?

Get educated on the issue so you know if you even have an arguement at all!

[post="311024"][/post]​

HERE HERE !!! VERY TRUE statement, Can't have the cake and eat it too, SO figure out what you want next week AWA b/f you truly make a fool of yourselves!! Do the research and the proper math as PITBULL has shown you how to do...

 

[MAABoss]

LY,

You are so on point. With regard to f/as wanting to go into a base, no one can go into a base unless there is an opening in that base. Vacancies are created by either growth of the airline, increase of time in the base, or attrition. That's it.
With regard to seniority, I am just simply amazed at how uneducated the HP f/as are on this issue. I think that their leadership has an obligation to a) understand the issue fully by discussing U-East list, how many f/as are above the 23 year mark, how many f/as are based on the west coast, how many fa/s from U-East bases actually live in Arizona. Then the AWA MEC needs to go out an educate their members.

To the HP f/as:
Off the top of my head, here is what I KNOW...we have approx. 8,600 f/as (including the invols) on our seniority list.

Out of that list only 222 actually live on the west coast. 22 f/as actually live in Arizona. Out of this list 193 are based in PHL and out of the 22 who live in arizona, 17 are based in PHL.

We have approx. 4,300 fa/s that are active. Currently we have 733 f/as on VFLR whose seniority on this furlough remains and appears to be where they left reflecting on our list, HOWEVER, when recalled some far off year in the future, and if all 733 return, they will return at the new hire senioroity (year 1). There are more VFLRs going to be offered in 2006 with this exact same contract furlough provision. We know for sure that the company owes AFA at least a min. of 323 more VFLR offers for 2006. For 2005, we have approx 400 scheduled to go out on ERI (retirment by the end of Dec). And between now to 2007, many more f/as will either retire or go off a VFLR and resignations. Bottom line, OUR LIST is decresing from top to bottom.

Part of our 8,600 f/as include 1,692 Involuntary furloughees and were furloughed in 2001. Their seniority ranges from 6 months to 5 years. They are treated the exact same way contractually that AWA treats their involuntary furloughees. The difference here is that AWA recalled all their furloughed f/as. WEll that's great. But to argue that the 600 f/as that were hired off the street from 2002 to 2005 at AWA should some how receive preferential treatment and now the entire AFA policy has to changed is the most ludicrous argument I've heard coming out of that DVD.

Tell me this? The only way any f/a can get to a base is by growth, and obviously from what i've cited above, our seniority would NOT impair or disenfranchise the majority of the f/as in PHX. Those f/as living on the west coast is about .01% of our entire roster. And those 222 plus 22 in Arizona in 2 years will decrease even more because most of them are our most senior f/as on our roster.

So the argument here remains with the other end of our list which are the INVOLS. And AWA, according to the DVD has to do with their 600 f/as on thier list and that they would be at the bottom??? I can tell you that many more than 600 at the bottom of our list in every single one of our mergers was pushed further down that list...and U never ever approached AFA Delegates with an agenda to change the constitution. When U purchased Piedmont in 1988, We fixed the Empire's seniority who were stapled to the botom from Piedmont. We followed our Allegheny/Mohawk merger agreement and AFA Policy and restored their seniority to DOH. Does anyone here think for one second that the original US Air f/as were not effect by this???? US Air was on a hiring spreee every single month from Feb. 1981 through 1992.

Frankly, I am shocked, simply stunned that the HPf/as have not been fully educated on this issue. I can see that they have not because no figures were presented in that DVD EXCEPT the 600 hirees from 2002 to 2005 from AWA.
YOUR MANAGEMENT WANTS YOUR FOCUS ON THE AFA DOH ISSUE INSTEAD OF FOCUSING YOUR ATTENTION AND MIGHT ON FINISHING YOUR SECTION 6. U-East will help you with this issue and that is where the energy should lay.

The U-East CANNOT displace, shove, flush, bump f/as out of PHX, so that just can't be one of the arguments at all!

[post="311018"][/post]​

Pitbull
Why exactly did they want you out of the MEC, again?? That information was pretty impressive for "off the top of your head"!
Where is the current MEC and all his knowledgeable comments?

Sorry....strayed off topic.

 

[PITbull]

PITbull,

THANK YOU for that information!!
Our mec has not given us ANY INFO regarding USeast seniority. They have left us to speculate and freak out since May.
(well, I"M not actually freaking out, but many are)
I try to be the Devil's advocate, I try to calm and reassure the scared ones, but without the facts, as you presented, its comes across as just more speculation.

ALSO, I want to bring up a point,
With all the HP talk of 'relative' integration, I find myself wondering, Relative to what? The PIT base? The CLT base? The PHL base?
I just don't see how 'relative' could be accomplished 'fairly'.

[post="311028"][/post]​

des,

And those are good points you bring forward.

I just feel so bad for the anxiety this has caused the HP f/as.

Its just so unnecessary. This information is the information from our merger committee and I am sure its the information that your merger committee must have as well. These are simple facts, and they will change as time marches on between now and 2007 when we are finally integrated. With a more aging airline, you have folks who are not only retiring, but leaving on the programs we have in place to balance the population of workers.

Its just plain and simple mathematics. Obviously from the DVD I reviewed, the majority of the HP f/as have just no clue and have created this "fear" with no foundation.

 

[PITbull]

Pitbull
Why exactly did they want you out of the MEC, again??  That information was pretty impressive for "off the top of your head"!
Where is the current MEC and all his knowledgeable comments?

Sorry....strayed off topic.

[post="311030"][/post]​

I know this information from what was reported out by our new MECP and obviously the info he received from collecting data from the company.

With regard to the attempted recall of Teddy, it was based on the fact that she was leaving on a VFLR in DEc. and that she should not be the MECP to go into the discussions on the merger integration if she would not be here to see it all the way through. What no one asked or no one had posed the question is that if she pays her union dues, she can hold her position and seat. There is no flight pay loss, but she can hold the seat.

Back on topic...if the new management and CEO wanted to really balance the population quickly, they have it in their power to do so. They can offer medical coverage for the older workers who are of retirment age right now. Give them active rate medical until 65 and you may potentially bring our list down even further. Most older f/as stay for the medical because they are not 65 yet. This is just one simple solution. The CEO brags about having $2.5 billion in cash, but than expects AFA do change OUR POLICY for a simple remedy that they could fix if it was truly THIS CEO's focus as he has written in many addresses to the employees.

Trust me...its not his focus.

With regard to the INVOLS on OUR list, its just unfounded to change an entire policy of DOH and then take it back to retro Jan. 1 so that 600 f/as from AWA will not be disenfranchized. From the DVD, their solution (which they have not outlined at all in the agenda item to the BOD) is to change DOH to what, exactly? place our invols when "recalled" at the bottom of the list?????

What is up with this noise?

 

[Light Years]

PITbull,

THANK YOU for that information!!
Our mec has not given us ANY INFO regarding USeast seniority. They have left us to speculate and freak out since May.
(well, I"M not actually freaking out, but many are)
I try to be the Devil's advocate, I try to calm and reassure the scared ones, but without the facts, as you presented, its comes across as just more speculation.

ALSO, I want to bring up a point,
With all the HP talk of 'relative' integration, I find myself wondering, Relative to what? The PIT base? The CLT base? The PHL base?
I just don't see how 'relative' could be accomplished 'fairly'.

[post="311028"][/post]​

Desertgal, I think most feel like you do or would if they had the facts. Nice to see a level head!

Come on out to CLT! We'll all have a great time as the new U.

 

[Bear96]

The Sally Struthers thing was absolutely hilarious!

But, you U/East folk are still missing the picture (maybe deliberately; I'm not sure). I don't think the U/West F/As are concerned about everyone rushing in and bumping them out of PHX. As has been mentioned many MANY times (yet which still seems to be ignored by U/East F/As), the real issue is the FURLOUGH problem.

I would think the U/West F/As would be happy with a scenario like this:

Let's say the merger never happened. Then say U announces a furlough of 10% (or 20%; take your pick) of F/As. If you would have been furloughed under THAT scenario, you should also be on the chopping block should the NEW U announce a furlough of 10% (or 20%) of F/As.

The way it stands now, someone who would have been furloughed in the former scenario at the un-merged U would keep their job in the latter scenario with the new U, while an ex-HP F/A gets the axe instead.

(And don't get me wrong -- I don't see the bylaws being changed -- as I've said before, it will be done DOH. It's just that I think some U folk are being awfully tacky about the whole situation and totally ignoring the legitimacy of the ex-HPers feelings.)

 

[TheNewLowFare]

Now that some of this information has been posted, I am not as worried as before.
I don't like to hear rumours and secrets since it puts fears and uncertainty in our minds.

By the way, I have worked with those flight attendants in the video. Don't make fun of them, they are very nice, laid back and easy to work with.

 

[Travelpro72]

and will now be known for a long time to come as "The two ladies from the video". Facts should have been made available to the masses from the HP MEC. They have so far neglected on spewing the facts to their members. If there were some clarity so many over at US-west wouldn't be ready to poo poo in their pants over the DOH seniority integration. Hopefully this will spread to our brothers and sisters at US-west. I'm looking forward to this being behind us all.

 

[Light Years]

Even with zero growth at Airways East, there may not be any furloughees by the time the actual full on integration is done. East is like Shady Pines. Alot of those ladies aren't going to be there in a couple of years. Of the 1700 or so invols, probably only half would return anyway. 300 or so did MAA so assume that maybe 500 total would come back.

 

[firstamendment]

IF AFA is smart they will do what the by-laws say DOH.. Or there will be no AFA - We will decertify and go to Teamsters simple as that .. and we will take AWA with us kicking and screaming all the way...

[post="310988"][/post]​

Let the decertification begin!! US East waaaaaaaaaay outnumbers US West and then the independent US union will rule and your crybaby senority whinning and fencing will do Buh bye!! What a bunch of sour ass whiners. Lets see, football game is over. Now lets go back and change the score. Real classy, US West. GROW UP!! :angry: