Replace AFA joint negotiations committee now

[JAMAKE1]

US Airways AFA TA vs. Industry Contract Comparison

United

• UAL had very similar contract to USA in 2000 and until they went into bankruptcy.
• In 2005 they reached a bankruptcy agreement that topped out in 2008 at $39.35.
• Recently reached a TA that on DOS starts out at $43.73 and tops out at 46.86 thirty six months after date of signing.


It appears to me the AFA TA would have made the F/As the highest paid F/A’s in the industry with the best work rules and scope in the industry.

For one thing, those UAL rates you quoted, apply to domestic rates of pay. International rates of pay (including Alaska, Hawai'i, Mexico, Caribbean, but not Canada) are $47.45 with a top-out $50.05 after 36 mos.

Secondly, USAir has the best work rules in the industry? Really? UAL reserve call-out is 4 hrs. UAL duty rigs are 5/10/15/20, meaning 5 hrs min for a 1-day; 10 hr min for 2-day; 15 hr min, 3-day; 20 hr min, 4-day. Holiday pay is 5 paid holidays (New Years, Birthday, July 4th, Thanksgiving, Christmas). UAL reserves are paid a reserve over-ride of $1.80/hr. UAL F/A's have 100% deadhead pay/credit. UAL F/A's have 100% trip protection.

I am quite curious how to see how the above compares with US that makes you claim that US F/A's have the best work rules in the industry?

 

[JAMAKE1]

Well if they can't afford market rates maybe it's time to close the joint down? It would certainly address Doug Parker's desire for industry Consolidation. Just not in a way that he prefers and despite the Kool Ade drinkers protestations to the contrary he ain't Jesus!



Are the F/A's operating from an emotional or illogical place? I certainly don't know, however a 75% NO vote from 90% of the group speaks volumes to the fact that right or wrong they are now a united organization.

Indeed.

Would you like to spend the rest of this thread with me pointing out that YOUR union can't agree on where to have lunch much less take on the Company. 4500 pages of grade school immaturity and you have the balls to criticize the Flight Attendants? 4500+ pages of "You Suck", NO YOU Suck", "Yes but you suck more". Very adult behavior don't you think. Given the actions of YOUR work group I think it highly insulting that you'd drag out the "If you don't like it quit" mantra.

BRAVO!

 

[USA320Pilot]

I really don't get the piint that if people are so unhappy at US Airways then why do they work here? It's a person's choice to work here or move on and if you're unhappy then a person should leave. Why be unhappy? This makes no sense at all and is like hitting one's head against a wall.

I continue to find it interesting that people refuse to answer my questions. How come?

Sparrow asked, "In a prior post I said the time has come to pick a side! Which side are you on USA320pilot, Which side are you on? There are no neutrals! Are you on the side of those whose primary concern is the prices at the Supermarket or those who worry about the prices on the Stock Market? Tell us which side are you on?"

I'm on the side of all US Airways stakeholders: Shareholders, Customers, and Employees alike. I'm not on the side of "fighting because I'm angry", which does nothing but to continue to make things worse. Life is too short to live in a state of anger.

The F/A vote will increase US Airways' profits and will increase each employee's profit sharing (assuming the company makes money this and in future years), which is good for the majority of the company's stakeholders.

Again, I agree with Mike Flores, Deborah Flores, and the JNC that "there is no better (Company) offer, the Company has been consistent on economics, the TA was the Company's final offer, and the Company is willing to reach a deal, but also willing to walk away if not within range of economics."

Therefore, what are the F/A's going to do now to make their lives better?

 

[700UW]

You need come up with a new mantra, instead of if you dont like it quit.

Your not a FA, you dont work under their CBA and you certainly dont have the pulse of what they are thinking.

Your a scared man, must suck to live in fear.

Its their CBA and its their choice, when are you going to grasp that concept.

if 90% of them voted and 75% of them voted no, then it be and let them figure out.

The sky isnt falling yet chicken little.

Look in your own backyard, your so called group is the laughing stock of the industry and Doug is laughing all the way to the bank.

Funny thing is your always complaining about the IAM, CWA and AFA and their members, if you dont like them and complain, why dont you just quit?

Take your own advice!

 

[737823]

Wrong again

FA Pay Rates

And the linked page indicates that US (PM-US Air "East") and HP (PM-America West "West") FAs are lagging the industry by a wide margin especially the West FAs. FAs at AA, CO, DL, WN, and soon UA (they recently ratified an agreement). It's clear the AFA negotiating committee at US Air doesn't have what it takes and the FAs should consider other representation. Would you like to see your "brothers and sisters" on the FA seniority list represented by your very own IAM? Would you produce an industry leading contact? Still waiting for links to educate myself on your awards, accomplishments and successful grievance.

Josh

 

[700UW]

If you so smart, since you never worked in the aviation industry and never negotiated anything under the RLA.

Why dont you hire on as an FA and do a better job?

Easy for you to throw stones when you actually have no clue nor any idea of what is going on.

I dont have to prove anything to you, go back to your cubicle and foreclose on someone's house.

It takes two parties to negotiate, and the RLA is a big hinderance.

And the CBA that CO's FAs are working under who are the 2nd highest paid in the industry behind WN was negotiated by the IAM and I was on their NC also.

So keep trying.

 

[EastUS1]

I find it interesting that people cannot answer questions and instead appear to operate from a mode of anger or as a deer in headlights.


Therefore, for those F/A's who voted "no" because this is "about a fight" how are you going to impoorve your lives and that of your family by voting "no" on the TA? What's next for the AFA and its members?

1) Some of us simply have a much lower tolerance level for immediate and overly enthusiastic wavers of white flags and/or further offers of endless banality.

2) "how are you going to impoorve your lives and that of your family by voting "no" on the TA?" Sigh! Let's start with "Negotiations 101". How can conditions improve?...well...I've little doubt this concept may afford you some severe shock but; it's not always unwise to seek better than any used car salesman's first offer....

3) "What's next for the AFA and its members?" Who ever knows or can know "What's next" in this life for any? For the FA's: My guess would be a better offer from the company. It's certainly NOT the case that management, through the excess goodness of their pure hearts, have previously been at all interested in obtaining a contract....period. Whatever issues are in play with them, likely being concerns for positioning for merger-mania, they seem suddenly interested in closing one....Why?..and spare us all any BS about, as has been so laughably claimed by management "because it's the right thing to do"....Sure thing....ummm...for HOW many years now?

If the briefly covered above points are so seemingly obscure or perhaps even incomprehensible to you....well...what's the possible point in any further conversation? Refer to 1) above.....

 

[737823]

If you so smart, since you never worked in the aviation industry and never negotiated anything under the RLA.

Why dont you hire on as an FA and do a better job?

Easy for you to throw stones when you actually have no clue nor any idea of what is going on.

I dont have to prove anything to you, go back to your cubicle and foreclose on someone's house.

It takes two parties to negotiate, and the RLA is a big hinderance.

And the CBA that CO's FAs are working under who are the 2nd highest paid in the industry behind WN was negotiated by the IAM and I was on their NC also.

So keep trying.

Isn't it compelling Bob Owens (a respectable union guy) blames the IAM for the concessions train beginning in 2002? You want me to educate myself on the IAM, US Air, and other unions so why not provide the links?

Josh

 

[700UW]

1983 TWU began concessions, better go reread bob's posts, he had to restate that.

And if you want to research the info is out there.

US filed chapter 11 bankruptcy, better go read section 1113, the unions didnt have a choice, just like AA's unions dont have a choice now.

 

[737823]

Flying BOS-DCA Wednesday. What should I expect from the FAs? Is morale at an all time low or will I have a happy, cheery crew? Many of the shuttle FAs I seem to have are great, I just worry given the rejection of this awful TA.

Josh

 

[Harry Callahan]

USA320 IMO the f/a group done the right thing in rejecting this pos contract. They expect all of us to work for crap wages, maybe the place should just close down. I'm sure a man of your means would have no problems

Harry.

 

[USA320Pilot]

USA320 IMO the f/a group done the right thing in rejecting this pos contract. They expect all of us to work for crap wages, maybe the place should just close down. I'm sure a man of your means would have no problems

Harry.

Harry,

The company offered the F/A's a contract that cost the airline more money. Is it better to work for less or more?

The F/A vote will increase US Airways' profits and will increase each employee's profit sharing (assuming the company makes money this and in future years), which is good for the majority of the company's stakeholders.

Again, I agree with Mike Flores, Deborah Flores, and the JNC that "there is no better (Company) offer, the Company has been consistent on economics, the TA was the Company's final offer, and the Company is willing to reach a deal, but also willing to walk away if not within range of economics."

Therefore, what are the F/A's going to do now to make their lives better while working at US Airways?

Nobody is willing to answer my questions above. Harry, will you?

Thanks.

USA320Pilot

 

[flybynite]

Flying BOS-DCA Wednesday. What should I expect from the FAs? Is morale at an all time low or will I have a happy, cheery crew? Many of the shuttle FAs I seem to have are great, I just worry given the rejection of this awful TA.

Josh

Not to worry....you'll have a great crew

 

[flybynite]

In my personal opinion, a lot of this was Facebook driven. Yep, a whole lot of opinions, with no facts to back them up. I'd lay bets half of the f/a's didn't even read the TA but instead went with the BS that was flying all over the FB pages.

I've never seen so many misinformed people in my life.

Used to..people would read the darn thing. Apparently not any more. I was horrified at the stupid, wrong, misinformed crap that was passing as fact on Facebook.

I've never seen so much jibber-jabber, junior high school #### in my life!!!

 

[737823]

Not to worry....you'll have a great crew

Thanks! Hopefully it will be a good flight

Josh