allstrike
Veteran
- Oct 12, 2005
- 759
- 4
yes they could arbitration doesnt stop any other talks if they agree to talk.
Planning on a new TA ? (fleet )
- Thread starter freedom
- Start date
yes they could arbitration doesnt stop any other talks if they agree to talk.
Hadenough
Senior
I guess we can expect another proposal before the arbitrator makes a ruling.
redeye
Senior
- Aug 17, 2007
- 263
- 0
If the IAM brings us a new agreement without going back to the negotiating table,
does that not demonstrate the IAMS's intention to low ball us until we bite? :down:
allstrike
Veteran
- Oct 12, 2005
- 759
- 4
Yep it could be,but they will have an excuse for sure.Any one know how to sue a union for misrepresentation.
727_4_Ever
Member
- Oct 23, 2006
- 48
- 0
I realize this thread is to tell what we look for in the next T/A but first let me say why I think we should ask for these things as some people think we should have accepted the first T/A because we need to keep the company going and if we get TOO MUCH it’ll put us under. Treating employees fairly doesn’t put companies under.... BAD MANAGEMENT does. First of all any contract that is brought back to us better not be an industry leading low in anything. Don’t even consider bringing back a contract that is the bottom of other negotiated contracts let alone below the non-unionized deals that Continental and Delta have. We’re paying dues for something and deserve better from an airline that’s rolling in the money. I’ve read people on this board saying you can’t get everything etc. etc. Well apparently we can’t especially when the IAM apparently never asked. I’ve read that we should have taken this T/A to help keep the airline from going back where we were in bankruptcy and that the East is just being greedy. No we shouldn’t have taken this for that reason. We should get a worthwhile contract and force management to manage us to profitability instead of beating down it’s employees to profitability. Start getting rid of the executives who can’t run an airline and get new blood. An example is the decision to remove 1st class seats from our 321 fleet and add more coach. Fine if you can sell the seats but when the question was asked about a weight problem with these additional seats on the cross country flights here was management’s answer: Yes adding these seats causes a weight problem because of head winds going cross country. We will have to stop and fuel on some flights and if we know of the head winds ahead of time we’ll just bump passengers and leave with empty seats to prevent having to stop. UNBELIEVABLE!!! So if we put people in these seats for extra money then we will probably have to stop and fuel. Well the extra landing and take-off fees will more than eat up any good these seats did. But wait….we can plan ahead and leave the people off and not stop….Ok so now you don’t have the extra revenue you were shooting for and you gave away some free tickets in the process. This is the management we’re dealing with. If someone came to me with this brilliant plan they could leave their ID on the desk as they exited the room. Utilize the correct aircraft for the correct routes. This is just one example of the boneheads running this place. So to make up for these decisions we need to all work for much less than our peers at other well managed airlines??? NO!!! Instead let’s get some real managers and make money the right way.
Now as for what I want to see in the new T/A in no particular order. First off leave the profit sharing ALONE. It stays and won’t be touched. Profit sharing is non-negotiable. The execs aren’t giving theirs up. The 60 day rule eliminated. No reference to it at all. It should never have been in there in the first place. If you furloughed you come back where you should be and it doesn’t matter where you come back. No more contracting out. Bring back freight and mail handling in stations. (This would actually make them a ton of money as contracting it out cost us millions in lost freight when they did it. An example of stepping over a dollar to pick up a dime.) Fleet service does the work on any A/C over 60 seats. No matter what these A/C say on the side they’re counted as mainline flights. No future dates where the company can contract out our work. They wouldn’t want the dates in there if they didn’t plan on doing it. It’s our work and it stays our work. No Class 1,2 cities. Everyone who works fleet service is treated the same. No allowing the company to pit us against each other. Employees can use sick time for FMLA whether for themselves or a family member. Employees will be paid 100% for their sick days. We have an attendance policy to deal with people abusing the system. People who are sick need to be paid for the time. As for the person on a thread who said partial pay is industry standard. Tell me where. I know people at other airlines and none of them receive partial pay for sick time. In fact they couldn’t believe we had that as they’ve never heard of it. We need to accrue at least 10 days a year and no limit on carryover. Unlimited bank. Also you can use banked days as credit towards retirement. Holidays go to west contract accrual. Holiday pay is 8 straight hours if you’re off. If working you still get the 8 straight but get time and one-half for what you work. OT on a holiday is double-time. This to would help the company as they wouldn’t have a problem with missing people on a holiday and no problem getting people to cover if someone is out. Vacation chart in the T/A looked good with the new accrual rate but it was missing an additional week at 25 yrs. Add that in there. Insurance will lock at what it costs now for the duration of the agreement and the requirement to us Caremark will be eliminated. Get your prescriptions filled where you want. Pension…..The increase was needed but instead of a dime later how about .25 cents now and a dime in say 2011. That later stuff….I call in Wimpy as in Popeye. Remember Wimpy? I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today. All the snapback etc. that was to take effect later was Wimpy. Part-time ratio remains as is and grievance will go forward. Any time the company violates our contract they should not be able to negotiate the consequences away. Maybe they’d stop abusing the contract if they knew they would not be able to negotiate away violations. Same with the CIC. Not negotiable. Let’s let an arbitrator decide. Win or lose at least we’ll know and the company will understand they can’t just violate contracts at will. Now for OT. The snapback to double time needs to be now not in 2012. Also no modification to the double time to only be on 7th day. Instead it is as in the past to include not only 7th day but also after 8 hrs. time and half on first day off you are in double time and any scheduled 8 hr. work day you would be in double time after 4 hours time and a half. As for the payscale, let’s lay an offer on the table for our management and executives. We’re not the largest airline in the US. Southwest now is. They’ve passed AA. Our executives and management will get paid no less and no more than their peers at Southwest. This includes bonuses, options, etc. etc. This should be sufficient for them as we’re a smaller airline and our executive/management performance is way below that of Southwest’s so they should be grateful to earn that much. In exchange fleet service at US will work for no more or no less than their peers at Southwest except top out agents will get $1.00 an hour less than Southwest since we’re not as big as them. We don’t want to be as greedy as our execs will be. This will help us to maintain profitability while our execs learn how to run an airline without these BK contracts we now have. As for the duration of this deal it doesn’t matter as we’ll be UA soon enough. We’ll never see another renegotiation. Sorry to ramble so long and I’m sure I’ve missed something. This is a good start though. I’m sure after reading this you’ll think I’m crazy but actually I just never visited the kool-aid stand and don’t plan to. Don’t drink pool water and don’t drink kool-aid from the castle.
Now as for what I want to see in the new T/A in no particular order. First off leave the profit sharing ALONE. It stays and won’t be touched. Profit sharing is non-negotiable. The execs aren’t giving theirs up. The 60 day rule eliminated. No reference to it at all. It should never have been in there in the first place. If you furloughed you come back where you should be and it doesn’t matter where you come back. No more contracting out. Bring back freight and mail handling in stations. (This would actually make them a ton of money as contracting it out cost us millions in lost freight when they did it. An example of stepping over a dollar to pick up a dime.) Fleet service does the work on any A/C over 60 seats. No matter what these A/C say on the side they’re counted as mainline flights. No future dates where the company can contract out our work. They wouldn’t want the dates in there if they didn’t plan on doing it. It’s our work and it stays our work. No Class 1,2 cities. Everyone who works fleet service is treated the same. No allowing the company to pit us against each other. Employees can use sick time for FMLA whether for themselves or a family member. Employees will be paid 100% for their sick days. We have an attendance policy to deal with people abusing the system. People who are sick need to be paid for the time. As for the person on a thread who said partial pay is industry standard. Tell me where. I know people at other airlines and none of them receive partial pay for sick time. In fact they couldn’t believe we had that as they’ve never heard of it. We need to accrue at least 10 days a year and no limit on carryover. Unlimited bank. Also you can use banked days as credit towards retirement. Holidays go to west contract accrual. Holiday pay is 8 straight hours if you’re off. If working you still get the 8 straight but get time and one-half for what you work. OT on a holiday is double-time. This to would help the company as they wouldn’t have a problem with missing people on a holiday and no problem getting people to cover if someone is out. Vacation chart in the T/A looked good with the new accrual rate but it was missing an additional week at 25 yrs. Add that in there. Insurance will lock at what it costs now for the duration of the agreement and the requirement to us Caremark will be eliminated. Get your prescriptions filled where you want. Pension…..The increase was needed but instead of a dime later how about .25 cents now and a dime in say 2011. That later stuff….I call in Wimpy as in Popeye. Remember Wimpy? I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today. All the snapback etc. that was to take effect later was Wimpy. Part-time ratio remains as is and grievance will go forward. Any time the company violates our contract they should not be able to negotiate the consequences away. Maybe they’d stop abusing the contract if they knew they would not be able to negotiate away violations. Same with the CIC. Not negotiable. Let’s let an arbitrator decide. Win or lose at least we’ll know and the company will understand they can’t just violate contracts at will. Now for OT. The snapback to double time needs to be now not in 2012. Also no modification to the double time to only be on 7th day. Instead it is as in the past to include not only 7th day but also after 8 hrs. time and half on first day off you are in double time and any scheduled 8 hr. work day you would be in double time after 4 hours time and a half. As for the payscale, let’s lay an offer on the table for our management and executives. We’re not the largest airline in the US. Southwest now is. They’ve passed AA. Our executives and management will get paid no less and no more than their peers at Southwest. This includes bonuses, options, etc. etc. This should be sufficient for them as we’re a smaller airline and our executive/management performance is way below that of Southwest’s so they should be grateful to earn that much. In exchange fleet service at US will work for no more or no less than their peers at Southwest except top out agents will get $1.00 an hour less than Southwest since we’re not as big as them. We don’t want to be as greedy as our execs will be. This will help us to maintain profitability while our execs learn how to run an airline without these BK contracts we now have. As for the duration of this deal it doesn’t matter as we’ll be UA soon enough. We’ll never see another renegotiation. Sorry to ramble so long and I’m sure I’ve missed something. This is a good start though. I’m sure after reading this you’ll think I’m crazy but actually I just never visited the kool-aid stand and don’t plan to. Don’t drink pool water and don’t drink kool-aid from the castle.
Hadenough
Senior
727
Does not sound like rambling to me......Well stated and a good place to start....This would change my no vote to a yes
Does not sound like rambling to me......Well stated and a good place to start....This would change my no vote to a yes
727_4_Ever
Member
- Oct 23, 2006
- 48
- 0
Tomorrow is the day. Will we see the results of a very large NO vote or can they somehow put a spin on it? I agree that if they have another T/A ready right away that means they didn't negotiate it at all as it was already there. We need to watch this very closely and stick to our guns. The IAM needs to listen to the people and demand what's right.
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