AMFA getting it done

[Vortilon]

You guys crack me up with this comparison of wages and why this Union is better than that Union etc. How about looking at facts here. In the last 10 years AA has lost $10.07 Billion, yes that's a B for Billion. SWA, conversely, has made $3.63 Billion over the last 10 years. If you had AMFA at AA for the last 10 years your pay would still suck. You know, companies don't negotiate big pay raises when they are losing money. And, before you claim I want a certain Union, I work at another airline and don't care which Union wins. AMFA is blowing smoke up your arses if they are telling you they could have done better. It is easy to make claims, very hard to back them up.

Really, another alias TROLL. I like that line: " I work at another airline yada yada, and I don't care who wins" Nice try! Is that you Ed Kosiatek?

 

[saywhat]

Really, another alias TROLL. I like that line: " I work at another airline yada yada, and I don't care who wins" Nice try! Is that you Ed Kosiatek?

You are funny. How about disputing my facts, $10.07 Billion loss versus $3.63 Billion profit. I know, don't let facts get in the way of AMFA's wool they are trying to pull over your eyes.

 

[WNMECH]

You guys crack me up with this comparison of wages and why this Union is better than that Union etc. How about looking at facts here. In the last 10 years AA has lost $10.07 Billion, yes that's a B for Billion. SWA, conversely, has made $3.63 Billion over the last 10 years. If you had AMFA at AA for the last 10 years your pay would still suck. You know, companies don't negotiate big pay raises when they are losing money. And, before you claim I want a certain Union, I work at another airline and don't care which Union wins. AMFA is blowing smoke up your arses if they are telling you they could have done better. It is easy to make claims, very hard to back them up.

AMFA is not promising that.
Only that the members will be in control.
What happens then will be for the members to decide.

However, the other side is claiming that the sky will fall if AMFA gets in.

So who is doing the lying?

 

[saywhat]

AMFA is not promising that.
Only that the members will be in control.
What happens then will be for the members to decide.

However, the other side is claiming that the sky will fall if AMFA gets in.

So who is doing the lying?

I don't know what the TWU is telling you guys but you are claiming AMFA is not saying or hinting that pay would be better if they were voted in? So, vote AMFA and you will have a voice!!!! But, by the way, you will still have same sucky pay and benefits is what AMFA is preaching to the members?

 

[swamt]

You guys crack me up with this comparison of wages and why this Union is better than that Union etc. How about looking at facts here. In the last 10 years AA has lost $10.07 Billion, yes that's a B for Billion. SWA, conversely, has made $3.63 Billion over the last 10 years. If you had AMFA at AA for the last 10 years your pay would still suck. You know, companies don't negotiate big pay raises when they are losing money. And, before you claim I want a certain Union, I work at another airline and don't care which Union wins. AMFA is blowing smoke up your arses if they are telling you they could have done better. It is easy to make claims, very hard to back them up.

You mentioned that " companies don't negotiate big pay raises when they are losing money." AA paid out bonuses, free stock, and "atta boys" to their upper management every year for the last 10 years, and yes most of them were nego while losing Billions. Your right, no one knows how AMFA "would have done" if they were there. However, I would definately contend that AMFA would have fought for a better results for their members and would have nego better deals rather than caving so quickly into the company demands and concessions, the TWU "agreed" to everything the company wanted. They've been doing for decades. You know I work for another airline too. But I do care who the AA guys vote in for their representation, as this very well could be the begining of a true "mechanics union" thru-out our industry. If our mechanics could become all AMFA, then our work group would be just as strong as the pilots groups, and the airlines know this, hence, while Doug Streeland was so adament about getting AMFA out of his airline. It's fine that you don't care, we have alot yous here at SWA. It is sad, but all of us should care as this will affect all of us eventually...

 

[WNMECH]

AMFA national should not get all the credit for good raises at SWA, but they should not get blamed for the decisions that memberships make at other carriers either.

How many times does it have to be explained?
AMFA gives all the decision power to the membership.
You vote on everything.
You are accountable for your own mistakes and successes.

Unlike the other unions who control everything with appointed officers.

I prefer the freedom to choose.

 

[swamt]

I don't know what the TWU is telling you guys but you are claiming AMFA is not saying or hinting that pay would be better if they were voted in? So, vote AMFA and you will have a voice!!!! But, by the way, you will still have same sucky pay and benefits is what AMFA is preaching to the members?

AMFA is not garrenteeing anything. Some non-AMFA supporter were trying to spread that AMFA was promicing "industry leading pay" but this was just another scam by all the TWU/teamster folks. As posted above already, AMFA is promicing to allow the AA mechanics run their very own union, make their own decisions, and have a democratic and transparent union where all the local and National officers are held accountable for every move they make. AMFA also promices observers at the table during nego. This little perk on it's own is worth more than anything (at least here at SWA) we were tired of the teamsters "behind closed doors deals" never having input at anytime, they would just bring out stuff to vote on and say the usual, that's all we could get you better vote yes. They can do that brother. You know the rest...

 

[saywhat]

AMFA is not garrenteeing anything. Some non-AMFA supporter were trying to spread that AMFA was promicing "industry leading pay" but this was just another scam by all the TWU/teamster folks. As posted above already, AMFA is promicing to allow the AA mechanics run their very own union, make their own decisions, and have a democratic and transparent union where all the local and National officers are held accountable for every move they make. AMFA also promices observers at the table during nego. This little perk on it's own is worth more than anything (at least here at SWA) we were tired of the teamsters "behind closed doors deals" never having input at anytime, they would just bring out stuff to vote on and say the usual, that's all we could get you better vote yes. They can do that brother. You know the rest...

So having a craft and class Union isn't saying that you could dictate wages based on your craft? You guys need another gimmick, the flat truth of the matter is that promises are being made and the insinuations are there that AMFA will make everything better. The reality is that the health of the Company you work for is going to dictate what you can achieve money and benefit wise.

 

[WNMECH]

I don't know what the TWU is telling you guys but you are claiming AMFA is not saying or hinting that pay would be better if they were voted in? So, vote AMFA and you will have a voice!!!! But, by the way, you will still have same sucky pay and benefits is what AMFA is preaching to the members?

I don't know about this hinting.
But the TWU, IBT and IAM paid reps on here are saying outright, loud and clear, that AMFA wants to outsource all the overhaul jobs at AA.
They point to the NWA strike as something bad, and that the same results would happen again if AMFA is voted in.

The hinting and lying are not coming from AMFA.

 

[saywhat]

AMFA national should not get all the credit for good raises at SWA, but they should not get blamed for the decisions that memberships make at other carriers either.

How many times does it have to be explained?
AMFA gives all the decision power to the membership.
You vote on everything.
You are accountable for your own mistakes and successes.

Unlike the other unions who control everything with appointed officers.

I prefer the freedom to choose.

You like the freedom to choose. So, you are elected Union representative and you hear that many employees are wanting dues to be cut in half. You let the members decide without any interference? Or, do you try to squash that vote knowing it would hurt the Union? Take your B.S. somewhere else and quit lying. You, if you were a smart representative would try to squash that vote so that the Union would have money to service the membership. Pie in the sky is what AMFA seems to be selling.

 

[Rusty]

You like the freedom to choose. So, you are elected Union representative and you hear that many employees are wanting dues to be cut in half. You let the members decide without any interference? Or, do you try to squash that vote knowing it would hurt the Union? Take your B.S. somewhere else and quit lying. You, if you were a smart representative would try to squash that vote so that the Union would have money to service the membership. Pie in the sky is what AMFA seems to be selling.

Would you rather have a union that the members could decide union dues rates, or would you rather have a union that unelected leaders could dictate union dues rates?

At SWA the ibt was going to raise thier rates to 3x without a membership vote shortly before they got the boot.

 

[swamt]

You like the freedom to choose. So, you are elected Union representative and you hear that many employees are wanting dues to be cut in half. You let the members decide without any interference? Or, do you try to squash that vote knowing it would hurt the Union? Take your B.S. somewhere else and quit lying. You, if you were a smart representative would try to squash that vote so that the Union would have money to service the membership. Pie in the sky is what AMFA seems to be selling.

WNMECH is not lying. Obviously you are here to try to discredit. Good luck your going to need it. You are trying to use a hypatheticall sitsuation to twist up AMFA. Let me tell you a real like situation that did occure at SWA and is the very same example you speak of. AMFA National LEC wanted to raise our dues from 2.0 X's base pay, to 2.25 X's base pay. They listed their reasons for doing so, and explained how the new division of funds would work with the new dues increases. The membership voted this increase down. We are still at 2.0 X's base. Nobody tried to squash the vote, simply put the National ask for it and the membership said no. What did the teamsters do when they wanted to raise their dues?? Did they put it out for a vote?? Did they ask the membership what they thought?? Did they explaint to the membership why they were increasing the dues?? Did they explain to the membership how the funds were going to be used?? The answer to all of these questions is NO!! The teamsters simply increased the dues to 2.5 X's base and premiums, with no vote from any membership. Your post is rubbish sir. Nice try. Now go join the Anomaly, Overspeed, CIO bus...

 

[saywhat]

Would you rather have a union that the members could decide union dues rates, or would you rather have a union that unelected leaders could dictate union dues rates?

At SWA the ibt was going to raise thier rates to 3x without a membership vote shortly before they got the boot.

A voice is good and that has generally been my experience with Unions. If people wanted to cut the dues to half or nothing than I think that voice went too far. I see an over simplification of what people supporting AMFA are doing on here when the reality of the matter is that they will not get better wages or benefits for anyone.

 

[swamt]

A voice is good and that has generally been my experience with Unions. If people wanted to cut the dues to half or nothing than I think that voice went too far. I see an over simplification of what people supporting AMFA are doing on here when the reality of the matter is that they will not get better wages or benefits for anyone.

If you are being told that AMFA will come in at AA and get then guys industry leading pay, bennies and work rules, someone is lying to you. Not going to happen over night. The contract improvements that AMFA will obtain for their members at AA will take years to accomplish what the TWU destroyed for decades.

 

[saywhat]

WNMECH is not lying. Obviously you are here to try to discredit. Good luck your going to need it. You are trying to use a hypatheticall sitsuation to twist up AMFA. Let me tell you a real like situation that did occure at SWA and is the very same example you speak of. AMFA National LEC wanted to raise our dues from 2.0 X's base pay, to 2.25 X's base pay. They listed their reasons for doing so, and explained how the new division of funds would work with the new dues increases. The membership voted this increase down. We are still at 2.0 X's base. Nobody tried to squash the vote, simply put the National ask for it and the membership said no. What did the teamsters do when they wanted to raise their dues?? Did they put it out for a vote?? Did they ask the membership what they thought?? Did they explaint to the membership why they were increasing the dues?? Did they explain to the membership how the funds were going to be used?? The answer to all of these questions is NO!! The teamsters simply increased the dues to 2.5 X's base and premiums, with no vote from any membership. Your post is rubbish sir. Nice try. Now go join the Anomaly, Overspeed, CIO bus...

That is not a bad thing generally, but if they asked for the increase it was possible they saw a possible shortfall looming. What sounds good today might be a disaster tomorrow. What if they were trying to line up more training, or a strike fund. Now, the membership would be harmed by not having trained people representing them or not being able to help members if a strike occurred. You guys are good politicians, are you leaders in AMFA or being promised something?