West F/A's wants a seperate contract ?

[BoeingBoy]

The certificates were merged and approved by the FAA, no proving runs were necessary as they were part of the fleet all ready.

Actually, the US & PI certificates weren't merged when US started taking the 737-400 deliveries. So how many proving runs did they have to do before putting the 400 into service?

Jim

 

[700UW]

The 737-300 and 400 are same plane type, you know that.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Oh.....like the A319, A320, and A321???

Jim

 

[700UW]

Probably so.

But answer this, if they have NEVER flown it before, isnt there more then just sim time required?

 

[BoeingBoy]

Frankly, I don't know if there's enough differences to even require that (one of the side-effects of fly-by-wire). Or enough to require differences classroom training - probably web-based in that case.

My point was two-fold.

1 - HP wouldn't need proving runs to add the A321 to their certificate. Of course, new A321's won't be here till mid-2008 unless they're from somewhere besides the revised order.

2 - If the company's timeline is anywhere close to accurate, there won't be separate HP and US certificates by next summer - all the airplanes will be on one certificate. Again no proving runs required for HP to fly the A321 (or 767/330, for that matter)

Jim

 

[Dog Wonder]

Frankly, I don't know if there's enough differences to even require that (one of the side-effects of fly-by-wire). Or enough to require differences classroom training - probably web-based in that case.

When U took the 321 into their fleet no proving runs were required due to commonalities with the 319 and the 320.

 

[SKY HIGH]

The East contract should remain status quo as you voted until it is up for renegotiation in 2012. Our contract is the only one up for negotiation right now and why should we allow for everything we bargained for before to be hijacked by a larger work group and radically changed? We can bargain ourselves for better pay and better sick time.

Your'e seriously WHACKED. YOU CAN BARGAIN FOR BETTER PAY AND SICK TIME????......Just who's contract DID YOU have better in this industry????????? UAL? NW? AA? DL? WN? CO?.............the answer----> NONE. You Dougie worshippers------Kool aid, is ready!!!!

 

[Twicebaked]

Doug Parker said he doesn't have a problem with seperate contracts, so the west f/a's are planning on collecting signatures and presenting it to the union.

Collecting signatures??? You wouldn't have a leg to stand on...even if you had all signatures from East and West.

You cannot say all the East nor all the West. I have met several West f/as that DO NOT want a fence as they want to transfer to the East. There will be NO fence...next!!

Have you talked to ALL the flight attendants on the East??? I for one know plenty that want to give up the bid sheet and do scheduling the West way...again, next!!

Have you taken a good look at your contract??? I would gladly keep my $32.00 an hour as opposed to your $24ish an hour for the same years of service....next!!!! Your contract is nothing special....becareful what you wish for...

Jumpseat bi@#*ing is not a representation of all of the membership...just those that have nothing else to do.

Don't speak for all the West flight attendants....you will make them look bad.

We are in this TOGETHER...stop "fencing" yourself off from the East.

You should come over and try it...it IS a much better airline with a much better route structure. You will see.

US West F/As are allowed to work as much as we can. We have no caps, US East does. Paycut for us in the west!

Wrong!!! ETB allows as much time as you want (pay no credit). 105 hours at $32ish an hour or $24ish an hour???? Who would be taking a paycut??? The East!!

Our contract is the only one up for negotiation right now and why should we allow for everything we bargained for before to be hijacked by a larger work group and radically changed? We can bargain ourselves for better pay and better sick time.

Yea, you sure proved that! When was the last time you negotiated a contract? Um never??? AWA also had the WORST contract in the industry (excluding exress)....so, go right ahead.....go at it on your own!

Oh my God, are you actually serious?!? Our most senior FAs from Class 1 who began with this airline before we even had planes would be in the middle of your seniority lists (at best) at almost any domicile on the East. The only exception is probably LaGuardia and I doubt very seriously they would want to leave PHX and their high yield turns to go to precious LGA to work the Shuttle. 🙄

Hey, I feel for her...but, things could be worse. Anyone remember what happen to those TWA flight attendants??? I am sure they would take middle of the list than...what is it... wait...GONE!!!

If you listen to the Webcast of August, you can hear DP stating he would not have any problem having two separate contaract.

Well, if you listen to his many other web-cast you would here that he stated "AWA did NOT buy US Airways.." but you people seem to ignore that. You only hear/see what you want.

 

[SKY HIGH]

Unity? We aren't seeing it over here folks. Last night walking down the B concourse in Phoenix to go check in I passed an East crew, smiled and said hello (a common practice of courtesy that comes naturally between us "westies"), only to get a look of disgust from them like I was a panhandler on the sidewalk. Not the first time either. Yeah, I really want to team up with this group for a single contract!

sky high states: Geez, sorry. WE THOUGHT YOU WERE MATTHEW GARDNER. LOVED YOUR (touchy/feely)LETTER about the Merger.



an opinion, always!

 

[Twicebaked]

You don't make jack because that is what your membership voted for while your were in BK - twice.

Still make more than you!

If anyone seriously believes that a single contract is going to bring us together as one big happy family then I think they may be fooling themselves. Yes, I do know that separate contracts are not going to bring unity either. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.

Damn this thread hijacked me!!!! :angry:

YOU my friend need to remember this..... EAST IS NOT YOUR ENEMY!!!!! Whatever comes out of this negotiation YOU and everyone else (East and West) need to remember...East didn't screw the West or vice versa!!! We as a collective group would have done the best that we possibly could for the benefit of both groups!
Are you going to lose something? YES!! Are we?? Yes
It is the company taking from you and me...not you taking it from me or me taking it from you! IT IS THE COMPANY!!!!!!!!!!!
If you do not change your view on how this works you are either going to have a short career or you will have a long one of anguish.

 

[HP_JACK]

Yes you did open a can of worms with this topic. You are posting about 10 people's opinions who are not even educated on this subject. Those people who posted on the AFA66 board about wanting to keep a single contract HAVE NO CLUE! But what I do have a clue... is that both of our unions need to get together and both compromise for the best contract because soon we will be ONE!

 

[FlyUs]

(Sigh)

This is the sort of thing that I have been silently reading on here for the last few months to bring me to where I am today on my decision for a separate contract. Why do I want to team up with this kind of mentality that really has only one goal in mind and that is to stab us in the back.

I showed this to a coworker last night who is NOT a regular on this board and she couldn't believe it! Then she reads a few more threads I show her and now she is ready to negotiate a separate contract, too. I'm not kidding.

Trade sides, if you can, for just a moment, and imagine that we were the more senior, dominant workgroup. Imagine all that we did on here was say that we were going to take away your Transatlantic flying, invade your bases, and we are better than you only because we have been around longer.

If you want unity, and for those of us on the West to trust you and stand side by side with you then you have to earn it through thoughts and actions. With jabs like the one above, however, you just aren't going to find a lot of us wanting to jump ON the bandwagon...instead you will find us, more and more, wanting to stay separate for as long as possible. Save me the rhetoric that this is only the behavior of a random few. We are seeing it everywhere, both on and off the job.

Unity? We aren't seeing it over here folks. Last night walking down the B concourse in Phoenix to go check in I passed an East crew, smiled and said hello (a common practice of courtesy that comes naturally between us "westies"), only to get a look of disgust from them like I was a panhandler on the sidewalk. Not the first time either. Yeah, I really want to team up with this group for a single contract!

Now, that aside, and I feel much better for venting, thank you. I just wanted to let everyone know that I have taken initiative to discuss this issue of separate contracts with our MEC and it looks like they are going to remain bound and tied with the Mediator and stay on the path of a single contract. So, to even debate this issue now is, well, moot. Congratulations East, looks like you get control of our contract, too.

Had the chance the other night to work PHX-DEN. We worked the flight in from PIT and had almost 2 hours to check out the new hub. Myself and the crew walked around for a while in terminal A and ran into quite a few US west crew members. Just about everyone I walked by smiled and said hello. Only one flight attendant snubbed me, lol. Over all, I have to say I'm feeling real positive about the merger and looking forward to working with you guys out west. Was very skeptical at the beginning but for the first time in years I feel like these guys out west really do know how to run an airline.

 

[xoxo]

First of all, how dare you say that we don't care about our own over here. We know that our RVs are treated like garbage by scheduling and the company. Our reserves and new hires are treated with respect and dignity over here by their fellow crewmembers. We KNOW the sacrifices they make - past, present and future! As I recall, some of the things I heard on these boards that were said between crewmembers when the MidAtlantic recalls came back to East made my blood boil! Especially when they were assigned to your sacred Transatlantic flights.

HA HA!! are you kidding? Have you asked any of the recalled f/a's that came from MidAtlantic how they are being treated? Maybe you should before you say how great your f/a's treat each other(if you can find any recalls left) since alot of them quit because of the way they are being treated.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

You are a bitter fool. You are giving in to the "awe shucks" bullshiit of DP. This new company has done everything the old AWA way and you guys STILL arent happy!! I can't wait to take my 20 yrs and transfer to PHX just for spite!!! You guys want dirty..well damnit you got it!!! I am sick and tired of the pissing and moaning from the west. We are negotiating one contract and ALL of us will have a yes or no vote. You people out west LOVE to play victim. There is NO reason to not stand TOGETHER and take the BEST of BOTH contracts but someone is either scaring you or feeding you a line of BS!! Where are the voices of reason out WEST?!! I am SOOOOO over you people and YES, I say that in the MOST derogatory way!!!
:down: :down: :down: :down: :down: :down: :angry: :angry: angry:
Angry? HELL YES!!!

Wow, you really need a new job, or a rubber room. Its just a job, not even one that pays well.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Probably so.

But answer this, if they have NEVER flown it before, isnt there more then just sim time required?

No. There is no sim time required for a qualified A320 pilot to fly the 321. We did some differences ground school at home (as I recall.) My first flight on a 321 was an equipment substitution from a 320. Neither my F/O, nor I, had taken any other 321 specific training besides the home-study ground school. The flight was a non-event since the 319,320, and 321 are really the SAME airplane.

Aside from that, what would sim time accomplish? I don't think there is a 321-specific simulator in existence anywhere in this universe. All the simulators are built as 320's.