US Pilots Labor Discussion

[fodase]

DFR II cannot be filed until a ratified contract is in effect. The Ninth actually did rule on that and ripeness needs a ratified contract. Who says, then, that the entire contract would be put on hold by an injunction? If the only point of contention in DFR II is Section 22, why wouldn't the judge simply place an injunction on the section in dispute?



There was no "Bradford's testimony" in DFR I, so how could it be used against us? Are you somehow aware of what Bradford will testify to in DFR II? Goodness gracious me! The sky is falling down!



Move off DOH to what? The Nicolau? Fat chance.
Something in between? That would accomplish ZILCH! It is quite clear that DFR II will commence unless the Nicolau is enshrined in Section 22. It only takes ONE affected pilot to file DFR II. With that in mind, unless the courts order USAPA to use the Nicolau for Section 22, then east pilots could conceivably file DFR II against USAPA if they were to use the Nicolau since the C&BLs require DOH.



Glad you're not the guy with the bugle. Sounds like your favorite tune is "Retreat."

This is great! A complete ignorance of the facts just like most easties. At least Piedmont sees the big picture, or at least he is starting to see it. I'll only respond to your point about the injunction we will file because it is something I am familiar with. Contract with doh is ratified at 12:00 at 12:01 we file an injunction to stop it from taking effect, and yes, getting the injunction is a slam dunk because of the 9th and the addington.

 

[A320 Driver]

You clowns crack me up! You don't even know what the 9th ruled on. You were convicted on merits but thrown out on ripeness alone, no merits were even looked at by the 9th

I'm no lawyer, but I think it should have been thrown out on procedure. Who ever heard of a judge discussing remedies for a guilty verdict before one was brought in?

Not me...I think the 9th was being kind.

Driver <_<

 

[cactusboy53]

Piedmont- there was a day when even ALPA knew and tried to get the west to avoid going to the wall with the Nic. They knew it wouldn't work. They also were very clear that it was an internal union dispute, and a bargaining position. Negotiable. There was room for compromise. ...BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, WHINE, WHINE, WHINE, COMPLAIN, COMPLAIN, COMPLAIN... Personally, I am up for the battle and I really don't care what they say. I read the 9th ruling. It is very clear. I also read the LOA 93 pay restoration language, and it is very clear. I stand by both. Leonidas will be the worst decision they ever made to back. Nicolau will be something they should have looked at like a bank truck going down the road with the doors open and money flying out. It ain t ever going to amount to anything.

Wow. That is a bunch of typing, a bunch of piss & vinegar, and not a great deal of sentence or paragraph structure.

Tell you what Swanny; all the grandstanding in the world is not going to change the seniority list from the one that Mr. Parker has on his desk right now.

You may have read the 9th's ruling (with Mowrey's Cliff notes nearby), but you truly didn't understand it. If the company's lawyers believed the way that you do, then we wouldn't be having this little discussion. We would be marching right along to a new contract with your lottery ticket (Date of Hire). The FACT that the company sees this as a legal threat would show a blind man that there is serious legal peril.

I'm glad you are "up for a battle" (legally speaking, of course). You have chosen the WRONG group to bully on. We will ultimately prevail. We are funded and stand firmly on legal, ethical & moral grounds.

USAPA = Is this egg on my face, or am I seeing YELLOW? Oh wait, it's both....

 

[Metroyet]

This is great! A complete ignorance of the facts just like most easties. At least Piedmont sees the big picture, or at least he is starting to see it.

Yup. The AOL mailings are starting to take root. This is why Kim jong clearydouche is so afraid of them.

 

[A320 Driver]

If the company's lawyers believed the way that you do, then we wouldn't be having this little discussion. We would be marching right along to a new contract with your lottery ticket (Date of Hire). The FACT that the company sees this as a legal threat would show a blind man that there is serious legal peril.
[/quote]

Only peril this company is worried about is facing an $80 million+ pricetag for a pilot contract. (minimum of $120 million minus 40 million in synergies).

What is it going to take to convince you that this company does NOT want a pilot contract...not until they need one to sell the joint.

Driver B)

 

[luvn737s]

Only peril this company is worried about is facing an $80 million+ pricetag for a pilot contract. (minimum of $120 million minus 40 million in synergies).

No, the company would be worried if USAPA was voted off the property, because then they would have to begin negotiating in earnest.

Of course when they do, they will propose a cost neutral "pie" that can be split up with pay, benefits and work rules however the pilots see fit, plus a small signing bonus to make the pill go down easier.

A unified pilot group would worry management, and they know we are so far from that it's relegated to the realm of the theoretical.

Cleary lets Parker sleep easy. And every pilot here is paying him to do that.

 

[sumadarson]

Even the gods of aviation, united pilots and alpa are having trouble with their cba. Evident in the may 13th update, for 767 jetz united pilots, spinning their wheels. Hopefully a united pilot can post on this board soon and tell usairways pilots how to handle themselves, when they stop bending over.

"" A Message From the Master Chairman, Captain Wendy Morse

CAL-MEC Chairman Captain Jay Pierce and I met with the Joint Negotiating Committee this week in Boston. Next week, Captain Pierce and I will meet with senior management to further discuss the framework of expediting the agreement. While several proposals were passed across the negotiating committee table this week, we still are not in the ballpark of reaching agreement on most of this week’s passed sections. It is clear that it will take an approach from a higher level of management to get to a Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement anytime soon.



As I briefed you last week and as has been reported in our nation’s newspapers, the management of this company rewarded themselves coming into the merger with millions of dollars. If I were a senior executive being rewarded out of the chute, I would make very sure that I rewarded the employees as close to simultaneously as possible so as not to be viewed as standing in the front of the chow line ahead of the starving troops. To do otherwise fails to recognize the corrosive culture created in ignoring the simple fact that leadership is demonstrated by example.



It is imperative that we get to the right contract, right now, and I will continue to pursue this requirement vociferously.""

 

[luvn737s]

Here's a suggestion. Move off DOH and you will: De-fang the next DFR. Tip the balance of sentiment in PHX (the silent majority, not the small phalanx of hoplites who call themselves AOL). Secure the support of the majority of pilots for the efforts of the NAC. Short circuit the entire DJ process. Get all of this done before Christmas.

I agree that if a modified Nic * was placed in a contract with reasonable pay and benefit improvements (reality has to take hold at some point) that it would pass. And DFRII would probably not have sufficient financial backing to get off the ground if the margin for passage was in the 80+% range.

* However, the modifications would be retroactive to the date of the merger and many if not all of the benefits accruing to the east would likely have already occurred (i.e. fences).

 

[sumadarson]

united airline pilots, with the expert advice of alpa, proudly displays their progress in negotiations.

zilch.

 

[BoeingBoy]

united airline pilots, with the expert advice of alpa, proudly displays their progress in negotiations.

zilch.

And exactly how much progress has USAPA accomplished in 3X the time??? Poor Nos, up to his lying ways again...

Jim

 

[aquagreen73s]

And DFRII would probably not have sufficient financial backing to get off the ground if the margin for passage was in the 80+% range.

You're absolutely wrong. One quarter of the support is needed for DFR II, and the reason is that most of DFR II is already bought and paid for thanks to DFR I. 300 pilots at 3 grand a piece could easily cover it, up through the 9th and still have some left over. Believe me, I've run the numbers.

 

[traderjake]

deleted

 

[traderjake]

the only trouble is the west group is to stupid to figure all this out they are wasting so much money for nothing and destroying the careers of their pilot group, they could have been enjoying some of the growth we have here on the east

"to stupid"?

 

[traderjake]

deleted

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

united airline pilots, with the expert advice of alpa, proudly displays their progress in negotiations.

zilch.

Looks like MNGMNT is using their own form of "PATTERN BARGAINING" imagine the next round will be furloughs of UNITED pilots in 6 mos.! MM! Our boys at ALPA, next words out of MOAKS mouth will probably be." maybe the airline industry would be better off with a smaller or even non-existent CAL/UNITED!" Sound familiar to the EAST, you bet! MM!