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US Airways Labor Discussion- The History of the Scope Clause at US
- Thread starter Richard
- Start date
The company has asked for turboprop relief, but the response was absurd.
a little CRJ900 history
The US Airways and America West collective bargaining agreements with ALPA will be modified to allow for a combined maximum of ninety-three (93) CRJ-900, or other aircraft within the seating and maximum take-off weight limits specified in Paragraph B above, to be operated in revenue service at any given time at Express Carriers except that for every two (2) aircraft in excess of the combined 360 aircraft (excluding EMB 190 aircraft) operated at both US Airways and America West, that are added to revenue service in the mainline fleet, the Company may allow three (3) additional CRJ-900, or other aircraft within the seating and maximum take-off weight limits specified in Paragraph B above, to be operated in revenue service at Express carriers.
----- CRJ900–Bombardier’s newest and largest version of the immensely successful CRJ family of regional jets drew its first sale in some two years in late January, when Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group agreed on a still-undefined mix of 20 CRJ700s/CRJ900s for its America West Express network. By early last month Mesa had taken 15 of the 86-seat airplanes claimed in earlier orders, but remained the only customer for a program Bombardier executives once advertised as a solid bridge between existing 70-seat RJs and the emerging class of narrowbodies poised to compete for the bottom of the mainline market. Still, nearly four years after the program’s launch at the 2000 Farnborough Air Show, the firm order tally showed just 25 airplanes, leaving many wondering whether the “sweet spot” about which they talked had turned sour before its time.
Introduced on the strength of a launch order for 10 airplanes from leasing giant GECAS, the CRJ900 drew its first airline customer in March 2001, when Mesa signed a letter of intent that included a firm order for 20 of the 86-seat jets and an option for another 20. Once its own prospects for placing the airplanes disintegrated, however, GECAS canceled its order. Mesa subsequently converted firm orders for five CRJ700s to a follow-on order for five CRJ900s, bringing the program total to 25.
Mesa placed the first aircraft–dressed in America West Express livery and configured in a two-class, 80-seat cabin layout– into service on a route between Los Angeles and Phoenix late last April. A year later, the Phoenix-based airline remains one of the last major carriers in the U.S. whose regional affiliates enjoy unfettered access to regional jets certified to carry more than 70 passengers. Despite widespread relaxation of limits on 50- and 70-seat jets at regional affiliates, the manufacturers’ early projections of more lenient capacity restrictions have yet to materialize, a fact that remains perhaps the CRJ900’s biggest obstacle.Such constraints again revealed their disruptive potential last July, when union pressure compelled US Airways to convert a firm order for 25 Bombardier CRJ705s to positions for 70-seat CRJ700s. Scheduled originally for first delivery to wholly owned US Airways subsidiary PSA Airlines early this year, the CRJ705–a planned 75-seat, 82,500-pound mtow version of the CRJ900–exceeds the 75,000-pound mtow, 70-seat limits imposed on US Airways regional affiliates by the mainline pilots’ union scope clause. Although it agreed to an exemption for the Embraer 170 and 175, ALPA’s US Airways division refused to grant further concessions for the Bombardier jet.
More recently, Air Canada told representatives from its mainline pilot union that it might replace half a proposed order for 30 CRJ705s with 15 Embraer 170s or 175s. In December Air Canada split a commitment for 90 airplanes between the two manufacturers, but ongoing negotiations over regional-mainline flying rights led the bankrupt airline to reconsider the planned fleet mix to place the Embraer jets with the mainline. It would then convert the remaining CRJ705 positions to an order for 15 CRJ700s, all of which it would assign to wholly owned regional subsidiary Air Canada Jazz.Meanwhile, in Europe, where scope clauses present virtually none of the market constraints they do in the U.S., the CRJ900 has faced an even tougher sell, drawing just a single firm order from France’s Brit Air for four airplanes, only to see it canceled a few months later.Of course, when Bombardier introduced the CRJ900, no one could have predicted the economic upheaval 9/11 would eventually produce, and the severe interruption in the flow of financing for new airplanes in virtually every seat class. Although its commonality attributes appeal most to regional airlines already flying CRJs, the 86-seat jet might have also filled a role at the lowest end of the single-aisle mainline range, surmised Bombardier. It has failed to deliver on that promise, however, as rival Embraer prepares to fill its first order from the emerging low-fare niche with the larger, 98-seat Embraer 190.
The CRJ900 reached the market some two years before the scheduled first delivery of the 78- to 86-seat Embraer 175, its closest competitor in terms of seating capacity and weight. Embraer promotes the 175’s more spacious cabin and baggage capacity as vital attributes for the longer routes it believes airplanes in that seat class will serve. Nevertheless, a tentative launch order from India’s Jet Airways fizzled last year, leaving Embraer with only a tentative commitment from US Airways to convert some positions for 70-seat 170s to 175s.In reaction to “competitive pressures,” Bombardier last year assigned more range to the CRJ900 with a so-called paperwork mod that increased its maximum reach to 1,914 nm. Dubbed the CRJ900LR, the variant promises a maximum takeoff weight of 84,500 pounds–4,000 more than the standard CRJ900 and 2,000 pounds higher than the mid-range CRJ900ER. Bombardier v-p Barry McKinnon explained that the company arrived at the extra range by apportioning the higher takeoff weights, thus expanding the airplane’s payload-range envelope without modifying the airframe.
The US Airways and America West collective bargaining agreements with ALPA will be modified to allow for a combined maximum of ninety-three (93) CRJ-900, or other aircraft within the seating and maximum take-off weight limits specified in Paragraph B above, to be operated in revenue service at any given time at Express Carriers except that for every two (2) aircraft in excess of the combined 360 aircraft (excluding EMB 190 aircraft) operated at both US Airways and America West, that are added to revenue service in the mainline fleet, the Company may allow three (3) additional CRJ-900, or other aircraft within the seating and maximum take-off weight limits specified in Paragraph B above, to be operated in revenue service at Express carriers.
----- CRJ900–Bombardier’s newest and largest version of the immensely successful CRJ family of regional jets drew its first sale in some two years in late January, when Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group agreed on a still-undefined mix of 20 CRJ700s/CRJ900s for its America West Express network. By early last month Mesa had taken 15 of the 86-seat airplanes claimed in earlier orders, but remained the only customer for a program Bombardier executives once advertised as a solid bridge between existing 70-seat RJs and the emerging class of narrowbodies poised to compete for the bottom of the mainline market. Still, nearly four years after the program’s launch at the 2000 Farnborough Air Show, the firm order tally showed just 25 airplanes, leaving many wondering whether the “sweet spot” about which they talked had turned sour before its time.
Introduced on the strength of a launch order for 10 airplanes from leasing giant GECAS, the CRJ900 drew its first airline customer in March 2001, when Mesa signed a letter of intent that included a firm order for 20 of the 86-seat jets and an option for another 20. Once its own prospects for placing the airplanes disintegrated, however, GECAS canceled its order. Mesa subsequently converted firm orders for five CRJ700s to a follow-on order for five CRJ900s, bringing the program total to 25.
Mesa placed the first aircraft–dressed in America West Express livery and configured in a two-class, 80-seat cabin layout– into service on a route between Los Angeles and Phoenix late last April. A year later, the Phoenix-based airline remains one of the last major carriers in the U.S. whose regional affiliates enjoy unfettered access to regional jets certified to carry more than 70 passengers. Despite widespread relaxation of limits on 50- and 70-seat jets at regional affiliates, the manufacturers’ early projections of more lenient capacity restrictions have yet to materialize, a fact that remains perhaps the CRJ900’s biggest obstacle.Such constraints again revealed their disruptive potential last July, when union pressure compelled US Airways to convert a firm order for 25 Bombardier CRJ705s to positions for 70-seat CRJ700s. Scheduled originally for first delivery to wholly owned US Airways subsidiary PSA Airlines early this year, the CRJ705–a planned 75-seat, 82,500-pound mtow version of the CRJ900–exceeds the 75,000-pound mtow, 70-seat limits imposed on US Airways regional affiliates by the mainline pilots’ union scope clause. Although it agreed to an exemption for the Embraer 170 and 175, ALPA’s US Airways division refused to grant further concessions for the Bombardier jet.
More recently, Air Canada told representatives from its mainline pilot union that it might replace half a proposed order for 30 CRJ705s with 15 Embraer 170s or 175s. In December Air Canada split a commitment for 90 airplanes between the two manufacturers, but ongoing negotiations over regional-mainline flying rights led the bankrupt airline to reconsider the planned fleet mix to place the Embraer jets with the mainline. It would then convert the remaining CRJ705 positions to an order for 15 CRJ700s, all of which it would assign to wholly owned regional subsidiary Air Canada Jazz.Meanwhile, in Europe, where scope clauses present virtually none of the market constraints they do in the U.S., the CRJ900 has faced an even tougher sell, drawing just a single firm order from France’s Brit Air for four airplanes, only to see it canceled a few months later.Of course, when Bombardier introduced the CRJ900, no one could have predicted the economic upheaval 9/11 would eventually produce, and the severe interruption in the flow of financing for new airplanes in virtually every seat class. Although its commonality attributes appeal most to regional airlines already flying CRJs, the 86-seat jet might have also filled a role at the lowest end of the single-aisle mainline range, surmised Bombardier. It has failed to deliver on that promise, however, as rival Embraer prepares to fill its first order from the emerging low-fare niche with the larger, 98-seat Embraer 190.
The CRJ900 reached the market some two years before the scheduled first delivery of the 78- to 86-seat Embraer 175, its closest competitor in terms of seating capacity and weight. Embraer promotes the 175’s more spacious cabin and baggage capacity as vital attributes for the longer routes it believes airplanes in that seat class will serve. Nevertheless, a tentative launch order from India’s Jet Airways fizzled last year, leaving Embraer with only a tentative commitment from US Airways to convert some positions for 70-seat 170s to 175s.In reaction to “competitive pressures,” Bombardier last year assigned more range to the CRJ900 with a so-called paperwork mod that increased its maximum reach to 1,914 nm. Dubbed the CRJ900LR, the variant promises a maximum takeoff weight of 84,500 pounds–4,000 more than the standard CRJ900 and 2,000 pounds higher than the mid-range CRJ900ER. Bombardier v-p Barry McKinnon explained that the company arrived at the extra range by apportioning the higher takeoff weights, thus expanding the airplane’s payload-range envelope without modifying the airframe.
Dont call me Shirley
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
- 3,270
- 306
A valid concern indeed. FWIW, I spoke with a woman who is an organizer for the CWA camaign at PDT; she assured me that the union would not let that happen.
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Banned
- #20
I should have been clearer - I meant old US wasn't interested in turboprop relief. It's not surprising that they're interested in bigger turboprops now that they have authority for an almost unlimited number of RJ's - 400+ in the East contract and less in the West contract (100+ I think but it's been a while since I looked at it), and I imagine that they would like to keep the total number from the East contract.
Jim
She can no more assure that then you and me
Unless it is put in the contract
So the pilots unions of the world allow 500+ aircraft to be outsourced at HP/US
BoeingBoy
Veteran
- Nov 9, 2003
- 16,512
- 5,865
- Banned
- #23
No, each contract specifies a different maximum number. They're not additive except for the large RJ's - the TA recognized the total that were being operated by both sides combined - but I'd be surprised if the company doesn't want the greater max number from the East contract. Plus, the contracts were negotiated and ratified by the pilots from the two sides - nobody held a gun to their heads and made them vote for ratification.
Jim
The combine contract and pilot unions of the airlines of the world have allow the deterioration of scope mainline flying language
Delta/Continental pilots have negotiated less express flying
US not so much
AMEN. this should be the bottom line on this topic!
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