US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Metroyet]

The reality is that AOL's information is now circulating among the east ranks and being discussed in cockpits, crew rooms, dinner tables, and layovers as we speak, and there is nothing any of you can do about it. The truth got out, immune to USAPA's censorship, and that REALLY burns your behinds!

JetZ, once again hits the nail on the head. The above is the singular reason for Cleary's latest lie ridden tirade. Instead of publishing their own info, countering AOL with cogent arguments, Baby Doc Douchbag Kim Jong Cleary simply goes to DEFCON 5...wildly throwing haymakers in all directions, (behind a desk of course). Those with Narcissistic Personality Disorder tend to behave in this bizarre fashion.

Why not simply make the better Argument?

Because they can't. Which is why USAPA is the connsumate failure; which is why their days are numbered. Go to www.cactuspilot.com and check out how many days of lost QOL and Pay improvements this East fueled fiasco has cost all US Airways pilots. It's staggering.

 

[im back..!!]

BS, If you'd.....oh why bother - you won't get it anyway...

Jim

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Of course USAPA isn't doomed by a glossy mailer. They're doomed because they are a complete failure. Recall that USAPA won the election by a mere 3% of the vote. That was 3 years ago. No contract. Not even close. Every single "supremely confident" statement regarding their legal footing has been shown to be a lie. That's bad. If you're life's goal is to stay separate ON LOA 93 than I guess you're winning. USAPA has been 100% effective if you pay them for no other reason than to fly off half cocked into immature temper tantrums. That's not what I'd want in my union. I'm no Cheerleader for ALPA, Prater deserves to be punched in his generous t*ts for what he did to the America West pilots. Prater also got fired.

Honestly, do you think USAPA could maintain a 3% lead if there was another election today? Not a chance IMO. Therefore USAPA is doomed. 😀 They'll implode all by themselves. Something which is already happening in an uncontainable fashion.

When the LOA93 grievance finally shows up; it will be interesting for you to find out what the BPR knew, and when they actually knew it. It will explain their latest immature tirade and attempted diversion.

Talk about immature tantrums, Where's the CARDS? LOA 93 has no bearing! MM!

 

[A320 Driver]

Of course USAPA isn't doomed by a glossy mailer. They're doomed because they are a complete failure. Recall that USAPA won the election by a mere 3% of the vote. That was 3 years ago. No contract. Not even close. Every single "supremely confident" statement regarding their legal footing has been shown to be a lie. That's bad. If you're life's goal is to stay separate ON LOA 93 than I guess you're winning. USAPA has been 100% effective if you pay them for no other reason than to fly off half cocked into immature temper tantrums. That's not what I'd want in my union. I'm no Cheerleader for ALPA, Prater deserves to be punched in his generous t*ts for what he did to the America West pilots. Prater also got fired.

Honestly, do you think USAPA could maintain a 3% lead if there was another election today? Not a chance IMO. Therefore USAPA is doomed. 😀 They'll implode all by themselves. Something which is already happening in an uncontainable fashion.

When the LOA93 grievance finally shows up; it will be interesting for you to find out what the BPR knew, and when they actually knew it. It will explain their latest immature tirade and attempted diversion.

Depends on who the players are in your hypothetical election. If ALPA is one of them, then USAPA would get all the East support they needed. If the IBT was a player, it gets a lot riskier for USAPA. The IBT is gaining a LOT on support around East circles.


Driver B)

 

[Black Swan]

That's all there is. This witch hunt has no effect whatsoever on LOA93, the company's DJ, or the nic list that you will be told to live with when the courts and the company are finished. So knock yourselves out. And tell me when you get a guilty verdict. After watching the Cactus 18 clean your clock, you'll forgive me if I don't hold my breath.

Let's speculate for a minute and say that 3 guys are charged and convicted of some wrong doing. Explain how that that helps your cause to avoid binding arbitration. It doesn't. It is a totally separate issue and inconsequential to everything related to a contract or seniority.

As traderjake says:



The reality is that AOL's information is now circulating among the east ranks and being discussed in cockpits, crew rooms, dinner tables, and layovers as we speak, and there is nothing any of you can do about it. The truth got out, immune to USAPA's censorship, and that REALLY burns your behinds!

Here is the real truth that got out- The mailer and the way Leonidas obtained the info. spoke volumes as to the INTEGRITY of the people involved. Obtained ILLEGALLY, from a management pilot, used ILLEGALLY by a corrupt organization, then mailed out. All machinated by one of the PHX reps. If you really think you know what we are talking about, it is this- Leonidas is a criminal enterprise, nothing coming out of it is to be read or trusted. What is being discussed? How these 3 are going to most likely be fired, Leonidas sued, and the company getting most likely sued also for not having properly safeguarded sensitive information. Are you honestly that dumb to think we actually believe what is in that crap pamphlet? The hottest discussions are these- "How did these $&^^&&^ get my home address, and secondly, "who gave it to them?" Fortunately due to the diligence of Mike Cleary, he pushed this thing right to the top. You have no idea how this thing is going to rock Leonidas. They are in serious trouble for this. The first pamphlet lit the investigation off. It was kept going all along. Then the idiots who run Leonidas were stupid enough to do it again! That forced the company to finally do something. That is what I'm talking about!

 

[Freighterguynow]

It is my understanding they stole it from ALPA when some of the scab union founders were practicing the illegal tactic of dual unionism. I also speculate that is why the PHL reps were replaced by ALPA. Rather than filing criminal charges during the heated period, ALPA just removed the perpetrators. Another gross injustice ALPA inflicted on the West. To properly protect the West, ALPA should have prosecuted to the fullest extent to recover the stolen info. Info that could have contained, ss#, insurance benificiary information, etc.

Further, if you have paid by check to usapa they likely have your name, address, ss#, checking account #, and a copy of your signature. Pretty much personal info to be in the hands of a criminal organization such as usapa.

I would suggest paying the scumbags in unrolled coin, multiple denomination, but heavy with pennies.

They got the information because you agreed to be under the auspices of the NLRB when accepting a union job.

Usually, election logistics are set by agreement of the parties, but if they cannot agree, the Regional Director may set them

http://www.nlrb.gov/what-we-do/conduct-elections

AOL certainly got you damages - just not the ones you expected!

 

[Crzipilot]

Why not simply make the better Argument?

Well basically, I would think Usapa doesn't have to argue with rogue faction of the east pilots. What good would that do? Rehashing the same "studies" comparisons back and forth in the mail????


And yes IBT is gaining traction within the east, but uhmmm...why do you think USAPA and IBT have been sitting down with each other. Could it be that it will eventually lead to an no poaching agreement??!?!?!?

 

[prechilill]

And yes IBT is gaining traction within the east, but uhmmm...why do you think USAPA and IBT have been sitting down with each other. Could it be that it will eventually lead to an no poaching agreement??!?!?!?

Because USAPA's days are numbered, Cleary knows it and this is a vane attempt at closing down the failed experiment gracefully.

 

[Crzipilot]

What's a little more disturbing is. The company claims to have completed an investigation of the release of this file. This was back in Nov/Dec??? And during this investigation the company was not aware that this file contained the SSN #'s, and it wasn't until now that they discovered it contained the information, revealed by an unusual excel command?

Uhmm.. Exactly what kind of investigation did they complete, not knowing what was contained in THEIR file(s) which had gone outside of their control?

Really.....????

 

[Freighterguynow]

The reality is that AOL's information is now circulating among the east ranks and being discussed in cockpits, crew rooms, dinner tables, and layovers as we speak

No, really, it is not.

It was truly funny watching those pathetic mailers put AOL further and further in the hole and the West , all the while, thinking those AOL donations were actually accomplishing something.

 

[CactusPilot1]

Of course USAPA isn't doomed by a glossy mailer. They're doomed because they are a complete failure. Recall that USAPA won the election by a mere 3% of the vote. That was 3 years ago. No contract. Not even close. Every single "supremely confident" statement regarding their legal footing has been shown to be a lie. That's bad. If you're life's goal is to stay separate ON LOA 93 than I guess you're winning. USAPA has been 100% effective if you pay them for no other reason than to fly off half cocked into immature temper tantrums. That's not what I'd want in my union. I'm no Cheerleader for ALPA, Prater deserves to be punched in his generous t*ts for what he did to the America West pilots. Prater also got fired.

Honestly, do you think USAPA could maintain a 3% lead if there was another election today? Not a chance IMO. Therefore USAPA is doomed. 😀 They'll implode all by themselves. Something which is already happening in an uncontainable fashion.

When the LOA93 grievance finally shows up; it will be interesting for you to find out what the BPR knew, and when they actually knew it. It will explain their latest immature tirade and attempted diversion.

It is obvious Cleary's fixation with Leonidas is intended to divert attenion away from the failures of his association. It is also worth noting that Leonidas is not at all concerned about recent events:

Thursday, 24 March 2011 05:27 | | |
Today, USAPA released a letter from Cleary to Mr. Parker accusing a West pilot and Leonidas of several violations of federal law. You can read Cleary's letter here. The first sentence of the second paragraph in reads: "Notwithstanding these alarming developments, the Company has determined that neither the individual responsible for the theft nor those who received the stolen property will suffer any consequences." In other words, the company investigated USAPA's claims and determined that no action should be taken. We at Leonidas feel there is nothing else that needs to be said about USAPA's petty and needlessly divisive allegations.

Sincerely,

Leonidas LLC

 

[Freighterguynow]

They have a huge hurdle to climb. Usapians think they have EF's head on a platter. That could not be further from the truth. They have an uphill battle and I keep pointing out the issue of Chain of Custody.

Possession = Guilt

AOL fantasy land:

AOL: Gee officer, I didn't realize that small packet of white powder I paid $100 for was cocaine! Why, it must be a vitamin mix of some sort.
Police: By all means good Sir, go about your business.

 

[cleardirect]

Here is the real truth that got out- The mailer and the way Leonidas obtained the info. spoke volumes as to the INTEGRITY of the people involved. Obtained ILLEGALLY, from a management pilot, used ILLEGALLY by a corrupt organization, then mailed out. All machinated by one of the PHX reps. If you really think you know what we are talking about, it is this- Leonidas is a criminal enterprise, nothing coming out of it is to be read or trusted. What is being discussed? How these 3 are going to most likely be fired, Leonidas sued, and the company getting most likely sued also for not having properly safeguarded sensitive information. Are you honestly that dumb to think we actually believe what is in that crap pamphlet? The hottest discussions are these- "How did these $&^^&&^ get my home address, and secondly, "who gave it to them?" Fortunately due to the diligence of Mike Cleary, he pushed this thing right to the top. You have no idea how this thing is going to rock Leonidas. They are in serious trouble for this. The first pamphlet lit the investigation off. It was kept going all along. Then the idiots who run Leonidas were stupid enough to do it again! That forced the company to finally do something. That is what I'm talking about!

Once again as usual. A lot of false accusation but no facts or evidence to back it up. It is really funny watching you guys get all emotional and convince yourselves you think you know what happened.

What have we heard from you jokers before? The cactus 18 did this or that. Dismissed. The pension investigation was going to return the pension and someone was going to jail. Now you say these guys are going to be fired.

One question. Do you have any evidence that anyone from Leonidas saw or even knew that information was there?

 

[767jetz]

Here is the real truth that got out- The mailer and the way Leonidas obtained the info. spoke volumes as to the INTEGRITY of the people involved.

So you want to compare the integrity of 3 individuals, to the integrity of an entire union formed with the illegal intention of avoiding their legal responsibilities to the detriment of the minority they are supposed to represent?

Really? YGTBFKM.

 

[Black Swan]

ALL EAST PILOTS- re check your mailing information on the Leonidas mailer. There are NUMEROUS pilots who have received pamphlets addressed to them, and their SPOUSES. If you have one of these, make absolutely sure you maintain possession of it, and contact USAPA and the Company. This is most likely indicative that Leonidas accessed more than your CATS data, and most likely have gone deeper into your personal data, most likely your contact information. You are going to need to DEMAND lifelock for any and all family members as the compromise has gone deeper than the company or Leonidas has admitted.