US Pilots Labor Discussion

[cleardirect]

Where did I say USAPA was the best money I ever spent? Nothing to do with any union will ever be the best money I ever spent. That honor would go to money spent on my family. But pulling stuff out of your rear has never stopped you before....

It must not be too big because I believe you would be the first one crowing about it.

More wasted space.

Do the research yourself or call your rep.

If it is no big deal why does usapa hide it? It took about 45 seconds to get the news about the ninth out. Almost a week later and nothing when it is a set back. Let me guess. The excuse will be it is no big deal. We expected to lose this anyway. But we had to try.

Read my post a little closer. I never said you said the best money you ever spent. Details, details.

 

[cactusboy53]

.... We still work under LOA 93, subsidizing the west and high fuel costs. It is clear, to all that wish to see it, that this merger kept us all in a job........

If Doug had shook his head in 2005 you would probably still be looking for a job.

Are you a F/O? Just curious.

Oh Crap! What? You mean the West pilots are to blame for you being on LOA 93 AND ALPA National?? Oh the humanity! Oh the pain and suffering!

Are you an F/O? Wait, I really don't care. Here's what I care about: In your formative years were you taught to keep your word? When you promised to comply or do something, was it OK to dodge out of it because you later thought you were somehow cheated? If you win your LOA 93, will it be OK for Parker to change the name of the company and do anything he can to avoid paying you?

Keep clickin' them heels, Dorothy.

 

[Phoenix]

Oh Crap! What? You mean the West pilots are to blame for you being on LOA 93 AND ALPA National?? Oh the humanity! Oh the pain and suffering!

Are you an F/O? Wait, I really don't care. Here's what I care about: In your formative years were you taught to keep your word? When you promised to comply or do something, was it OK to dodge out of it because you later thought you were somehow cheated? If you win your LOA 93, will it be OK for Parker to change the name of the company and do anything he can to avoid paying you?

Keep clickin' them heels, Dorothy.

Ha! You are so hard of hearing. We promised you if you didn't relax your death grip on the windfall we would submit more than 200 cards. You had far too much faith in ALPA mythology.

Please, keep staring at your white knuckles as sweat drips from your brow while you pant at the echos of ALPA Sirens wafting the seductive words of "Final and Binding."
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[Barrister]

Oh Crap! What? You mean the West pilots are to blame for you being on LOA 93 AND ALPA National?? Oh the humanity! Oh the pain and suffering!

Are you an F/O? Wait, I really don't care. Here's what I care about: In your formative years were you taught to keep your word? When you promised to comply or do something, was it OK to dodge out of it because you later thought you were somehow cheated? If you win your LOA 93, will it be OK for Parker to change the name of the company and do anything he can to avoid paying you?

Keep clickin' them heels, Dorothy.

 

[Pi brat]

Do the research yourself or call your rep.

If it is no big deal why does usapa hide it? It took about 45 seconds to get the news about the ninth out. Almost a week later and nothing when it is a set back. Let me guess. The excuse will be it is no big deal. We expected to lose this anyway. But we had to try.

Read my post a little closer. I never said you said the best money you ever spent. Details, details.

You quoted my post, then put this : "usapa the best money the east ever spent right." There was no question mark, but it sounded like a poorly written question.

Whatever. We will hear soon enough.

 

[Pi brat]

Oh Crap! What? You mean the West pilots are to blame for you being on LOA 93 AND ALPA National?? Oh the humanity! Oh the pain and suffering!

Are you an F/O? Wait, I really don't care. Here's what I care about: In your formative years were you taught to keep your word? When you promised to comply or do something, was it OK to dodge out of it because you later thought you were somehow cheated? If you win your LOA 93, will it be OK for Parker to change the name of the company and do anything he can to avoid paying you?

Keep clickin' them heels, Dorothy.

Did I say it was anyone's fault?

I've kept my word. Were you taught anything in your formative years? It's not apparent.

I'm a capt. How about you, angry F/O or angry C/O.

 

[nic4us]

Ha! You are so hard of hearing. We promised you if you didn't relax your death grip on the windfall we would submit more than 200 cards. You had far too much faith in ALPA mythology.

Please, keep staring at your white knuckles as sweat drips from your brow while you pant at the echos of ALPA Sirens wafting the seductive words of "Final and Binding."
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And here I thought the only Homer the east was familiar with was Simpson...."doh"...

BTW..we heard the we'll throw ALPA off the property threat load and clear....problem for you was........other than to the AWA ALPA FPL crowd, that was no threat.

Threats of any substance have to contain repercussions the group you are trying to intimidate would fear. For instance, "under the pain of an unquestionably ripe DFR", was a lame threat, because the seniority theives do not fear losing a DFR. To really drive their point home the 9th should have said,,"we leave usapa to bargain in good faith, for all pilots, east and West, or else we will publish Cleary and Seeham's TSA full frontal body scan images on the web". Now had they said that we would have had a Nic inclusive contract 6 months ago.

Get back to us if you ever come up with something threatening.

 

[cactusboy53]

Did I say it was anyone's fault?

I've kept my word. Were you taught anything in your formative years? It's not apparent.

I'm a capt. How about you, angry F/O or angry C/O.

Keep your powder dry there Capt. Integrity. Many of you have espoused that ALPA National is responsible for your collective woes. YOU stated the following: We still work under LOA 93, subsidizing the west and high fuel costs.

Doug Parker told your group (when asking for pay parity) that the only way you would see a raise was via a joint contract.

While your may personally "keep your word" in your own personal every day dealings, your collective pilot group REFUSES to accept the product of our merged pilot seniority list process. YOUR collective pilot group by direct action (or in-actiion) are responsible for voting out ALPA with a new independent union. That UNION and its legal team has promised your group that a seniority list by date of hire is a slam dunk. That UNION and its legal team wasted NO TIME in trying to "take hostages" with the Cactus18 play (you remember, that was the case that was DISMISSED WITH PREJUDICE X 2).

I was born in the 50's and was brought up with what I believe to be good moral character. These events have truly tested my Christian up-bringing. It bothers me that not one, but nearly and entire group of 3500+ pilots are freely willing do this. The hubris and unmitigated gall that we see from USAPA supporters here is beyond comprehension.

Not angry, just very disappointed in the actions (or in-action) of your collective group. I expect better of adult human beings.
I and 1700+ of my closest friends are determined. We will not lay down. We will not be bullied. We will not allow you to recover your career with our assets. We are funded and supported by many others in the aviation community.

 

[Pi brat]

Keep your powder dry there Capt. Integrity. Many of you have espoused that ALPA National is responsible for your collective woes. YOU stated the following: We still work under LOA 93, subsidizing the west and high fuel costs.

Doug Parker told your group (when asking for pay parity) that the only way you would see a raise was via a joint contract.

While your may personally "keep your word" in your own personal every day dealings, your collective pilot group REFUSES to accept the product of our merged pilot seniority list process. YOUR collective pilot group by direct action (or in-actiion) are responsible for voting out ALPA with a new independent union. That UNION and its legal team has promised your group that a seniority list by date of hire is a slam dunk. That UNION and its legal team wasted NO TIME in trying to "take hostages" with the Cactus18 play (you remember, that was the case that was DISMISSED WITH PREJUDICE X 2).

I was born in the 50's and was brought up with what I believe to be good moral character. These events have truly tested my Christian up-bringing. It bothers me that not one, but nearly and entire group of 3500+ pilots are freely willing do this. The hubris and unmitigated gall that we see from USAPA supporters here is beyond comprehension.

Not angry, just very disappointed in the actions (or in-action) of your collective group. I expect better of adult human beings.
I and 1700+ of my closest friends are determined. We will not lay down. We will not be bullied. We will not allow you to recover your career with our assets. We are funded and supported by many others in the aviation community.

I did say that, but I didn't say it was your fault. We are both living with the decisions we made.

You say you won't allow ME to recover my career with YOUR assets? Are they your assets? I don't see any really great assets that YOUR side of the merger brought, and I don't want any of them. With history as a guide, they will probably go away anyhow. It is YOUR side that is salivating to take the east's, to recover YOUR failed career, and you just use Nic to justify it.

And you come across as angry, like a few others on here.

BTW, yeah, I know the C18 was dismissed twice, as it should have been. If you noticed I've always said it was wrong.

 

[cactusboy53]

....You say you won't allow ME to recover my career with YOUR assets? Are they your assets? I don't see any really great assets that YOUR side of the merger brought, and I don't want any of them. With history as a guide, they will probably go away anyhow. It is YOUR side that is salivating to take the east's, to recover YOUR failed career, and you just use Nic to justify it.

I guess what I meant to say(regarding assets) is that the America West had NO pilots furloughed at the time of the merger announcement. Conversely AAA had what? Over 1750 listed furloughed behind Dave O'Dell (the junior AWA FO).

During our down-turn in the economy 140 pilots in PHX that had jobs before the merger were FURLOUGHED. 6 east pilots that took recalls in PHX were MIRACULOUSLY "recalled" to the east while both sides furloughed. You said you don't want any of our "assets".....well, 140 of your previously furloughed pilots won a lottery prize via separate operations.

AWA (in May 2005) had no failed career expectations. This is proven by AWA Holdings getting credit & financing to acquire US Air (while US Air was in Chapter 11).

Oh, BTW....not salivating, not mad & going for some restful sleep. Have a great evening, and an even better tomorrow.

USAPA..........A house of cards......and most of them are Jokers.

 

[Phoenix]

And here I thought the only Homer the east was familiar with was Simpson...."doh"...

BTW..we heard the we'll throw ALPA off the property threat load and clear....problem for you was........other than to the AWA ALPA FPL crowd, that was no threat.

Threats of any substance have to contain repercussions the group you are trying to intimidate would fear. For instance, "under the pain of an unquestionably ripe DFR", was a lame threat, because the seniority theives do not fear losing a DFR. To really drive their point home the 9th should have said,,"we leave usapa to bargain in good faith, for all pilots, east and West, or else we will publish Cleary and Seeham's TSA full frontal body scan images on the web". Now had they said that we would have had a Nic inclusive contract 6 months ago.

Get back to us if you ever come up with something threatening.

Nic, Nic, Nic. You missed the whole point. I wasn't trying to say anything threatening. Ah, who would give credit to Don Quixote for his realization that the threats were mere windmills, when the windmills never purported to be threats?

Bravo.. sorta.

 

[700UW]

My prediction is that USAPA will merge to the IBT.

 

[Metroyet]

My prediction is that USAPA will merge to the IBT.

Cool. IBT has lost more properties in Aviation than anybody else. AOL can just as easily sue them too.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Me too. It would be very interesting to see where the eastholes would be right now should that have happened.

If what Parker has to say is any indication, the "eastholes" would be working at the bottom of some other carrier's seniority list, and the westholes would be sending in their resumes to that same carrier looking for a job once AWA shut its doors six months after US.

 

[A320 Driver]

My prediction is that USAPA will merge to the IBT.

They will get my vote.


Driver B)