US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Pi brat]

You and I disagree but have been civil. I see you trying to reach out at times and reel back in frustration. You and I don't agree on the Nic. I don't even bother debating it because of the ongoing legal battles which include the DJ being decided by Judge Silver.

I'm a MIG of USAPA because I feel I should be able to criticize the direction the association and the leadership if it does not fairly represent my interests. Criticism through normal channels go ignored by the association. Therefore, they find themselves in court and facing opposition on the message boards.

One more thing, it puts a bad taste in some peoples mouths to fund an association which files trumped up, malicious charges against the very membership it claims to represent.

I don't blame Nic for not wanting to fund such an association which is pretending to be a union.

I understand your frustration with USAPA, believe me I share quite a few of them. The thing is, we have to pay a certain %, or we get fired. Period. Doing otherwise and then saying the other guy picks and chooses what is right or wrong is disingenuous.

 

[Pi brat]

You just won't give it up, will you? Go look at the east seniority list on Wings... Count the names and then look at how many you had in 2005.
Did you even go to college? I know you were hired young and had a lot in life laid out for you (thanks Dad!) but really, can you even count? Can you not look at a seniority list and count down from Monda? If you can count to 600 you will get close to the answer.
So now, tell us again you had 600 guys senior to Monda retire in two years to keep the east in a state of "zero growth"

As I said to Jim, quit digging. I'm not done with you. I received the '05 list the other day and am putting the finishing touches on my presentation that will show what a complete idiot you are. Thanks for posting and calling me names again, it will refresh everyone's memory of what you are.

Did you see where I asked if any of your west brothers wanted to support you? Nic threw out some numbers, but was smart enough to stop short of support. No one else stepped up to that one.

If it helps you get through the day making claims about what I had "laid out" for me, go ahead. If you only knew it would make you realize how much more stupid it makes you look. Oh wait, no it wouldn't.

 

[prechilill]

As I said to Jim, quit digging. I'm not done with you. I received the '05 list the other day and am putting the finishing touches on my presentation that will show what a complete idiot you are. Thanks for posting and calling me names again, it will refresh everyone's memory of what you are.

Did you see where I asked if any of your west brothers wanted to support you? Nic threw out some numbers, but was smart enough to stop short of support. No one else stepped up to that one.

If it helps you get through the day making claims about what I had "laid out" for me, go ahead. If you only knew it would make you realize how much more stupid it makes you look. Oh wait, no it wouldn't.

LOL

That's all I can say...

You are a nutcase, dude (and junior to a lot of us westies who post on here...)

{There! I called you a name! LOL Since you falsely accused me of calling you a name when I didn't I figured I might as well take you up on it.}

I anxiously await how you can add over 620 pilots below Monda when not a single pilot has been forced to retire in the past three years...

 

[CactusPilot1]

I understand your frustration with USAPA, believe me I share quite a few of them. The thing is, we have to pay a certain %, or we get fired. Period. Doing otherwise and then saying the other guy picks and chooses what is right or wrong is disingenuous.

Agreed but I do find those who claim they stopped paying ALPA are the same people who have their hands out expecting payment.

Hypocrites.

 

[Pi brat]

LOL

That's all I can say...

You are a nutcase, dude (and junior to a lot of us westies who post on here...)

{There! I called you a name! LOL Since you falsely accused me of calling you a name when I didn't I figured I might as well take you up on it.}

I anxiously await how you can add over 620 pilots below Monda when not a single pilot has been forced to retire in the past three years...

Let me give you the highlight reel:

On the '05 list Monda was #3537-604 non-line=#2933 active line pilot
On the '11 list Monda was #2592-619 non-line=#1973 active line pilot

So his raw movement was up 945 numbers, net 960 active line pilots.

On the seniority list that is being used today, I am junior to no west pilots.

 

[Pi brat]

Agreed but I do find those who claim they stopped paying ALPA are the same people who have their hands out expecting payment.

Hypocrites.

Agreed, as are those ALPA reps that used to go after non-paying pilots, but today are................non-paying pilots. If pilots feel that the organization that represents them is too terrible to be a part of, they should resign their job, because to keep the job a requirement is to pay what is owed. The same for ALPA or USAPA.

 

[700UW]

I once read a story about a guy that believed he was wronged by his dad. As a result, he felt justified to hate his dad as a lifelong passion. His whole life was wrapped up in his hatred, so when his dad finally died and the object of his hatred was no longer available, he just fell apart.

If everyone, that you allege wronged you, came forward and admitted everything you hold against them, would you be satisfied or depressed to no longer have a basis for a grudge?

Answer with facts and something that has to do with the issue.

 

[CactusPilot1]

Agreed, as are those ALPA reps that used to go after non-paying pilots, but today are................non-paying pilots. If pilots feel that the organization that represents them is too terrible to be a part of, they should resign their job, because to keep the job a requirement is to pay what is owed. The same for ALPA or USAPA.

Interesting....I've seen posters bragging about not paying ALPA. It would make sense to me they are UHL's for USAPA.

Anyway, I've had enough fun for a while...good day, PI B)

 

[Pi brat]

Interesting....I've seen posters bragging about not paying ALPA. It would make sense to me they are UHL's for USAPA.

Anyway, I've had enough fun for a while...good day, PI B)

Many of them are the UHL's.

Me too, off to lunch with my son, have a good one.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

One west guy had it right from the very beginning. Follow the rules, do it right, and stand up for the legal rights of the west pilots. There is plenty of gamesmanship and selective standards to go around, on both sides of the aisle. For instance, the Suzie arbitration. What did that do to our west credibility? On the one hand, we are demanding honor, but on the other we are playing a game of technicality and semantics. I didn't have a doubt we would lose that, as it was obvious what we were up to, and I felt the aritrator would see that, which she in fact did.

 

[767jetz]

I'm hardly a potty mouth, jetz. I was getting sick and tired of repeated name calling and responded in kind.

I know that. You were baited.

I was just pointing out to mikey where he was wrong again, since he asked. He claimed that the mods do nothing and you can bad mouth anyone all day long with no consequences. If I had just used east examples of moderator intervention I would be called out on it. Just trying to keep it fair.

 

[767jetz]

When Nos called me a waffler, I answered HIM. Jim has directed posts at ME about acts with children. He can hide behind his "game" but there is a difference.

As an American you are part of a group that has at times supported some very unsavory characters around the world. Is it your fault? Are you hunting down CIA files to find out who is and who is not worthy of our county's support? I have no idea what has happened with "Joe". He will have to deal with the legal consequences of his actions and I left it at that. To claim otherwise is B.S.

Do I need to start defending you too jetz? Are your feelings getting hurt too?

Nope. No need to defend me. But then again there is no need to defend nos either. Didn't you come to his defense by saying I crossed a line? Many others came out of the wood work to do so. And remember I did not call him a pedophile. Only that he is "part of a group."

Is there a need to admonish me for a true statement but not Nos? You seemed to jump on the bandwagon condemning me for "crossing a line" but never condemn Nos for doing the same. That's my problem... when the rules are selectively enforced in favor of the east. I have defended the east when they are attacked by their own for disagreeing. Recently one of your own claimed to be re-evaluating his position about USAPA. He was immediately attacked by Nos and others, and has posted little since then, apparently succumbing to peer pressure. Perhaps he received personal attacks via PM, as I have gotten in the past. I defended him. I have also corrected west supporters when they when I disagree. I recently spoke up against a west pilot's use of political slanders in this discussion.

The difference between Jim and Nos is that Nos was never provoked by anyone. He has always been offensive since day one. As Jim has said it has been YEARS. If Jim had gone off the deep end for no reason I would speak up too. But the way I see it, he is tired of the double standards, and after years of being provoked he is dishing some back for a change.

This is exactly what I did with regard to Nos. I don't nor have I ever believed that a person should be judged solely by their association to the lowest common denominator. But after enough of his provocation I decided to turn the guns on him and see how he liked it. Apparently he did not. Same thing happened with oldie. Notice he has backed off and hasn't been seen a a while since some of us targeted him as he was doing to others. The best way to deal with a bully is to target him with his favorite venom.

I'm perfectly fine with sticking to opinions and facts related to the issues at hand. It is many others who seem to not be able to play by those rules. But I would be fine with a cease fire as long as it is applied both ways. But when others start with the lynch mob mentality, no one should be surprised when we respond in kind.

 

[Phoenix]

Answer with facts and something that has to do with the issue.

What... you keep dragging up a 20 year old grudge and chide others about relevance?

Really dude, what is your point? You believe USAir pilots are scoundrels... Always have been scoundrels... Always will be scoundrels. Ok. No one denies it. You're right.

Feel better now?

 

[Zone5]

I know that. You were baited.

I was just pointing out to mikey where he was wrong again, since he asked. He claimed that the mods do nothing and you can bad mouth anyone all day long with no consequences. If I had just used east examples of moderator intervention I would be called out on it. Just trying to keep it fair.

Granted, "crossing the line" is something of a matter of perspective and is somewhat subjective. Kind of like pornography, even the SCOTUS can't define it, but they know it when they see it.

Not unlike sexual harassment, it's in the eye of the recipient. I recall a session of "sexual harassment" training years ago in the Navy, the grisly old Command Master Chief says, "let's cut to the chase here, if you are saying something to a female shipmate, that you wouldn't say to your Sister at the Thanksgiving dinner table, you're skating on thin ice".

Something to think about, before you hit the Add Reply.

seajay

 

[prechilill]

Let me give you the highlight reel:

On the '05 list Monda was #3537-604 non-line=#2933 active line pilot
On the '11 list Monda was #2592-619 non-line=#1973 active line pilot

So his raw movement was up 945 numbers, net 960 active line pilots.

On the seniority list that is being used today, I am junior to no west pilots.

So now you are saying 1000 pilots left the company? LOL
You are funny!