US Pilots Labor Discussion

[BoeingBoy]

I think the Empire guys would have a good shot at winning the DFR

It may be my memory, but I think the Empire pilots were not unionized prior to integration so would have no one to bring a DFR suit against. ALPA didn't represent them until they were integrated and represented by ALPA.

Jim

 

[Reed Richards]

It may be my memory, but I think the Empire pilots were not unionized prior to integration so would have no one to bring a DFR suit against. ALPA didn't represent them until they were integrated and represented by ALPA.

Jim

Good, more the reason to screw those non union peons.

RR

 

[BoeingBoy]

Boeing boy can not find his web board postings back then.

Another charge...you just won't stop making things up. So offer up the proof of my web board postings back then. Seems like your mouth is running up more than your ### can take? Or maybe you have a birth defect and both orifaces are the same place.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

Good, more the reason to screw those non union peons.

To be clear, that's your sentiment and not mine.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

Jim

 

[Reed Richards]

They tried. I agree with you on the fair and legal. It is happening.

Empire Pilots vs ALPA

Boeing boy can not find his web board postings back then.

Thanks for that link. I will give it a good read tomorrow. I am not without sin on this entire Empire issue. I did not campaign for their rightful place during the run-up to USAPA being elected. I actually agree with them that everyone should have their DOH. But the law simply does not support going back and reordering lists from airlines past...so my crusade on their behalf rings a little hollow...I could not have supported them in 2008 had I wanted to...their screw job happened at a different airline half my lifetime ago.

My real argument with BB is when do you START to do the right thing? Had we established a national seniority list in the early 80s at ALPA, this would all be moot. But we did not. I will never really benefit from USAPAs DOH CBL..but those that follow in the next few decades will.

Nothing else to really say,

RR

 

[sumadarson]

To be clear, that's your sentiment and not mine.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

Jim

Was the Empire integration fair? You have a post that claims Empire was treated better than america west pilots. Do you still feel this is true?

 

[flypg]

To be clear, that's your sentiment and not mine.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

Jim

Your wifey called...she says you must finish the yard work or she will cut you off the high speed internet.

 

[BoeingBoy]

I actually agree with them that everyone should have their DOH. But the law simply does not support going back and reordering lists from airlines past...

Care to cite that law? IIRC, you once said that the statute of limitations for reordering seniority lists was when the contract was ratified. I'd even question that idea, although mainly on self-serving grounds since it puts the West pilots in a position of not being able to bring a DFR suit - the instant a DOH contract is ratified is the same instant it's too late to bring a DFR suit.

Jim

 

[aquagreen73s]

My real argument with BB is when do you START to do the right thing? RR

How about honoring one's agreements?


Still no answer to:

Question for the USAPA loyalists:

we know that PI sought to staple the Empire pilots. For the sake of argument, say the Empire pilots wanted DOH. Now suppose the two groups couldn't agree so they went to arbitration. The arbitrator mostly agrees with the Empire guys and gives them DOH but with some adjustments for the larger aircraft that PI flew and Empire didn't.

Now, stay with me. Say that the PI pilots are outraged and they use their voting numbers to change unions. They then craft bylaws that call for merging seniority lists according to . . . .drum roll please . . . stapling! Which happens to coincide exactly to what the PI pilots wanted during the arbitration and didn't get.

Now here's the question: is the above scenario fair?

Show your work.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Was the Empire integration fair? You have a post that claims Empire was treated better than america west pilots. Do you still feel this is true?

I don't answer your questions until you prove your claims against me...

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

 

[BoeingBoy]

I think the Empire guys would have a good shot at winning the DFR, as stapling is not recognized as a universally accepted means of merging lists. DOH is.

When you get around to reading the appeals court ruling, you'll see that the District Court's ruling was upheld and the suit dismissed by summary judgement. You'll also see that the appeals court ruling was in anticipation of the US/PI seniority integration, so well past the 6 month statute of limitations.

Jim

 

[sumadarson]

A guy like you that stapled pilots to the bottom of your list that you used to work for and you did nothing. tsk, tsk. Now you lecture others on seniority. You are a hypocrite sir.

boeing boy,

My original post above. Your were part of a group that stapled Empire pilots. You are the company you keep.

You dare lecture on this board today when you were part of that group. One of your posts even claimed that the Empire pilots were treated better than the america west pilots.

Quintessential definition of a hypocrite. I am the messanger.

 

[BoeingBoy]

My real argument with BB is when do you START to do the right thing?

As you well know, in a union a single person can't make anything happen. If they could we wouldn't have made any concessions since I voted against every one. All a single person can do is let one's reps know their position.

Had we established a national seniority list in the early 80s at ALPA, this would all be moot.

That's been a pipe dream since deregulation and had as much chance of happening back then as now - nil. First the union(s) would have to convince every management to accept it - not a small task. Second there is enough variance between carriers to make it palatable to the majority of pilots. All you'd end up with is a bunch of pilots roving from carrier to carrier as their seniority at a specific carrier fluctuated while the junior pilots would be left at the bottom watching pilots senior to them come in from other carriers. Those junior pilots would be subject to the whims of the senior guys/gals coming in above them from other carriers.

Jim

 

[BoeingBoy]

boeing boy,

My original post above. Your were part of a group that stapled Empire pilots. You are the company you keep.

You are part of a group that had scabs. You are the company you keep. Does that make you a scab? Presumably you'll say yes.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

 

[sumadarson]

You are part of a group that had scabs. You are the company you keep. Does that make you a scab? Presumably you'll say yes.

Tick tock tick tock...where's the proof? Nos? RR? 9? Anyone? Still waiting on that proof...

Maybe you should spend some quiet time away from the board. You are starting to sound like AWA320.

Relax, watch a movie, take in an old Rockford Files rerun. You sound stressed.