US Pilots Labor Discussion

[exB717Flyer]

Yes we do. Called avoid bid. Right in the bid page 15.

I'm glad you have that but it doesn't sound the same as a no-fly. No-fly isn't a bid, it's a fact. Even on reserve if you happen to get assigned with a pilot on your list you can get removed without question.

 

[Al Legheny]

I'm glad you have that but it doesn't sound the same as a no-fly. No-fly isn't a bid, it's a fact. Even on reserve if you happen to get assigned with a pilot on your list you can get removed without question.

The word from some close to negotiations is that the "no-fly" list, as it is currently configured out West, will not likely survive a new contract.

Rumor is there are complaints by more senior pillots that if they don't contribute to the Addington Litigation that they will be put on the no fly list. If the F/O's all boycott this captain he cannot get open time. When he goes on the computer to see what is available the trip does not appear if the F/O who is on the tirip has a "no-fly" on that captain.

It will not likely survive. To be honest it could be argued that it is indicitave of a lack of professionalism. If it is such a large issue, what does it say about the ability of West pilots to get along amongst themselves?

 

[nic4us]

The word from some close to negotiations is that the "no-fly" list, as it is currently configured out West, will not likely survive a new contract.

Rumor is there are complaints by more senior pillots that if they don't contribute to the Addington Litigation that they will be put on the no fly list. If the F/O's all boycott this captain he cannot get open time. When he goes on the computer to see what is available the trip does not appear if the F/O who is on the tirip has a "no-fly" on that captain.

It will not likely survive. To be honest it could be argued that it is indicitave of a lack of professionalism. If it is such a large issue, what does it say about the ability of West pilots to get along amongst themselves?

I would be willing to venture that you are correct.

However, the end product I foresee is doing away with what is called the captain no-fly. The f/o's will still be able to no-fly captains, but the captains will not be allowed to no-fly f/o's. That will not solve the problems for the West captain's that have not contributed to Addington, and I certainly do see a publishing of a list of donors in the future. But, that cuts both ways, you will now have a list that former east f/o's can reference also.

The company does not like the captain no-fly, and it is problematic when using PBS.

Besides, the senior captains that are complaining about being put on no-fly list are most likely the same ones who already having an issue. Most senior west captains are major contributors, haven't seen a checkairman yet not sporting a badge.

 

[exB717Flyer]

The word from some close to negotiations is that the "no-fly" list, as it is currently configured out West, will not likely survive a new contract.

Considering the NAC isn't the slightest bit interested in what the West wants I'm not surprised
.

Rumor is there are complaints by more senior pillots that if they don't contribute to the Addington Litigation that they will be put on the no fly list.

I call bs. That "rumor" undoubtedly began on the East. Kind of like the "rumor" we heard not too long ago about a recall of Vice Chair Ferguson. Try again.

If the F/O's all boycott this captain he cannot get open time. When he goes on the computer to see what is available the trip does not appear if the F/O who is on the tirip has a "no-fly" on that captain.

You're misinformed. It doesn't work like that. Maestro has no idea what somebody bid on PBS. Neither does Crew Scheduling. When you find you've been assigned a trip with someone on your no-fly list you have to take the action yourself to get removed.

 

[sumadarson]

SURE!!!!!!

Why, because the east pilots word is worth so much? You all have lived up to your other agreements?

usapa has had almost 3 years to get the east to parity with the west and have been unable to do it. What makes you think we would believe the east would or could do it for the west?

You know when a dishonest person tells me something I don't believe it.

You are an f/o with america west and just returned from furlough, your W 2 will show no pilot wages from usairways for 2009 and hardly any in 2010. Even if you were a gainfully employed west f/o working full time for 2010, you would have made 20 g's less than the original Usairways pilots did the last two years(East f/0's), due to your length of service.

I am substituting my reality to your myths. Keep one portion of your body buried in the sand and pound sand in the other sir.

 

[sumadarson]

Time to move on west pilots, death and taxes are the only certainty. The wise have always been aware of this.

 

[N924PS]

You are an f/o with america west and just returned from furlough, your W 2 will show no pilot wages from usairways for 2009 and hardly any in 2010. Even if you were a gainfully employed west f/o working full time for 2010, you would have made 20 g's less than the original Usairways pilots did the last two years(East f/0's), due to your length of service.

I am substituting my reality to your myths. Keep one portion of your body buried in the sand and pound sand in the other sir.

You are a 24 year F/O with USAirways, uninterrupted service, and your 2010 W-2 will show about the same number or less than it did in 1989. Even if you could upgrade to Captain before you retire in a few years, you would be making 16K a year less than an original HP pilot, and 66K less than a WN B737 Captain, thanks to LOA 93 and a singularly focused union(SEC 22 DOH).

I am substituting reality to your myths. Talk about pounding sand. Sir.

Try to move on East pilot, wise ones know death and taxes are the only certainties in life.

 

[nic4us]

Considering the NAC isn't the slightest bit interested in what the West wants I'm not surprised

.I call bs. That "rumor" undoubtedly began on the East. Kind of like the "rumor" we heard not too long ago about a recall of Vice Chair Ferguson.

Try again.You're misinformed. It doesn't work like that. Maestro has no idea what somebody bid on PBS. Neither does Crew Scheduling. When you find you've been assigned a trip with someone on your no-fly list you have to take the action yourself to get removed.

717, it works differently for reserves. That is, a reserve could indeed be called out to fly with a pilot they have put on their no-fly. However, Al is correct when he said if all the f/o's boycotted a captain, that captain could not get open time.

Here is how I understand it works. PBS runs the captain lines first. Then runs the f/o lines. An f/o will not be awarded a trip that has already been asigned to the captain they have put on no-fly. Then, once the f/o lines are completed, scheduling goes back and does a manual adjustment of the captains line if they are paired with an f/o that they had put on no-fly.

Now once the lines are complete, lets say I am flying a trip with f/o Surestick, I call in sick and my pairing goes into open time. The trip will show up in Maestro for any captain that Surestick has not put on a no-fly. So if all the f/o's boycott a particular captain, that captain would indeed never see any open time in Maestro.

I believe Al when he says a senior captain complained, I heard rumors that a certain senior captain, who is on many many f/o's no-fly list, compained about this very issue. The funniest part was being on the AWAPPA web board when it was explained to him why he was never seeing open time, then all of a sudden usapa comes out with a stance against no-fly, and why it violates seniority, blah blah blah. I think he ran to usapa and complained, which is ever funnier, because there ain't squat they can do about it.

 

[nic4us]

You are an f/o with america west and just returned from furlough, your W 2 will show no pilot wages from usairways for 2009 and hardly any in 2010. Even if you were a gainfully employed west f/o working full time for 2010, you would have made 20 g's less than the original Usairways pilots did the last two years(East f/0's), due to your length of service.

I am substituting my reality to your myths. Keep one portion of your body buried in the sand and pound sand in the other sir.

Sumadarson,

Welcome back from furlough. How is that 190. I should take the time to go look at one, I hear the flightdeck is pretty niffty.

Don't worry we will get the pay up substantially with a Nic inclusive contract.

 

[AWA320]

And so is tax season, new years , valentines day, SPEED WEEK, Daytona 500, Superbowl, if I missed any on your X-BOX pause feel free to add some, just days away events! JAMIE, JJ, JG, MM!

I have never tired xbox but you speak on it regularly so I have to assume that you are are the expert.

AWA320

 

[AWA320]

Nobody on the East side says we won it. We are smart enough to know NOBODY knows yet, especially your stellar management team.

Everyone but you knows that you lost on that deal. Gotta have the agreement PRIOR in order to cash in one a snap back. Now AA pilots had a snap back provision but you did not!!! Hmmm me thinks its loa 93 wages for a minute!!

AWA320

 

[AWA320]

You are a 24 year F/O with USAirways, uninterrupted service, and your 2010 W-2 will show about the same number or less than it did in 1989. Even if you could upgrade to Captain before you retire in a few years, you would be making 16K a year less than an original HP pilot, and 66K less than a WN B737 Captain, thanks to LOA 93 and a singularly focused union(SEC 22 DOH).

I am substituting reality to your myths. Talk about pounding sand. Sir.

Try to move on East pilot, wise ones know death and taxes are the only certainties in life.

OMG youi just got slapped him dead in the chops and HARD at that...

AWA32q0

 

[cleardirect]

You are an f/o with america west and just returned from furlough, your W 2 will show no pilot wages from usairways for 2009 and hardly any in 2010. Even if you were a gainfully employed west f/o working full time for 2010, you would have made 20 g's less than the original Usairways pilots did the last two years(East f/0's), due to your length of service.

I am substituting my reality to your myths. Keep one portion of your body buried in the sand and pound sand in the other sir.

Typical! I point out the failure of usapa to perform and you attack me.

So if I were a captain your rant would be completely bogus and wrong. Meaning that your TOS captain made $30,000 less than an AWA junior captain. If you want to make that point.

If I were furloughed like you say next year I would pass your top of scale 25 year F/O. Ouch that has got to hurt.

You enjoy LOA 93 now and until you retire.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

You are a 24 year F/O with USAirways, uninterrupted service, and your 2010 W-2 will show about the same number or less than it did in 1989. Even if you could upgrade to Captain before you retire in a few years, you would be making 16K a year less than an original HP pilot, and 66K less than a WN B737 Captain, thanks to LOA 93 and a singularly focused union(SEC 22 DOH).

I am substituting reality to your myths. Talk about pounding sand. Sir.

Try to move on East pilot, wise ones know death and taxes are the only certainties in life.

Singularly focused union? (SEC22) ? 125+pbgc is not worth a 1000+ pilot hit at HP rates, especially when PHX will go the way YOUR beloved PSA bases went, tell that to the to someone else. We all know it's all about you! Counting the days! JAMIE, JJ, JG MM! BTW the only thing you are substituting for reality is who you really are, go pound sand!

 

[exB717Flyer]

Now once the lines are complete, lets say I am flying a trip with f/o Surestick, I call in sick and my pairing goes into open time. The trip will show up in Maestro for any captain that Surestick has not put on a no-fly.

I stand corrected. Maestro is indeed loaded each month with our no-fly list.
I was confused since I was once given a reserve assignment to fly with one of my no-flys. I guess that's a different scenario.

In any case, losing our no-fly list will be a detriment to all pilots and a benefit to the company. So of course USAPA doesn't want it.

break

Hey, how about we talk about the cabin jumpseat again. Anybody know how those negotiations with the AFA are going?