US Pilots Labor Discussion

[fodase]

It is not a matter of what is valid. Its a matter of what is negotiable. If you would like to use the Nic now, it is negotiable.

That's not the question. You care to answer the specific question? BTW "its a matter of what is negotiable" is completely wrong, the question is what is in our contract right now.

 

[Move2CLT]

Your welcome wherever your seniority can take you just like I'll get as close to the west coast as I can. After all, isn't that what's its all about.

Per the Nic, I can hold CLT AB Capt now so its just a matter of an opening once this all gets put together.

And yes, that's what its been about this whole time.

 

[Move2CLT]

Talking with some fairly senior AWA boys the other night in CLT, and MOVE you are right they don't care about the AOL kids it's that $172 they like, seniority is for sale. Just remember WYE RIVER, that was your big mistake.

Yawn.

Look everyone, its ClaxoMM Jr.

 

[Move2CLT]

Latest proposal on the USAPA desk, APA furloughed to get slots vacated by USEAST, WEST ATTRITION in 7 year fence reverting to AA US DOH at end of 7 years,! Emphasis language on straight DOH, no slotting! MM! BPR! KNOWS!

LMAO.

Whatever you say.

You can't even get an eastie to believe your posts.

 

[Move2CLT]

Btw, your loa 93 snapbacks are coming and mda will finally kill the nic.

Ouch!!

LMAO.

 

[Move2CLT]

Not True. See AFA v USAir. It has been repeatedly quoted in the DJ litigation briefs.

“If the employees designate a new collective bargaining representative, it succeeds to the status of the former representative without alteration in the contract terms.”

The employees won't be the ones designating a CBA - the NMB will.

 

[BoeingBoy]

The employees won't be the ones designating a CBA - the NMB will.

True, but not relevant. APA will be bound by the US contracts until there's a single contract, possibility by fiat. Of course, the US contracts include the transition agreement specifying the integrated list per ALPA policy, otherwise known as the Nic.

Jim

PS - where's the big USAPA announcement that US/AA seniority lists will be combined by DOH? You'd think that USAPA would be shouting that info from the rooftops...

 

[Move2CLT]

PS - where's the big USAPA announcement that US/AA seniority lists will be combined by DOH? You'd think that USAPA would be shouting that info from the rooftops...

It takes a long time to spin this stuff.

Where's Theur when you need him?

 

[BoeingBoy]

That's just it - what's to spin. Putting those pesky west commuter pilots and a lot of those young AA pilots in their "rightful" place shouldn't need spinning. It would be the best news USAPA has gotten since finding out they won the election for CBA. To borrow heavily from the 9th, "MM and luv may yet say something true which would not do the harm to their reputations that they apparently don't fear."

Jim

 

[OTTER574]

It takes a long time to spin this stuff.

Where's Theur when you need him?

He's to busy eating CROW/Seniority is like negotiating for crew meals.... 😀


OTTER

 

[N924PS]

You'll be wearing an AA uniform before next summer.

No he won't. He is the first EAST Age 65 retirement in December...

 

[Move2CLT]

No he won't. He is the first EAST Age 65 retirement in December...

So why is he so worried about the Nic and what happens here?

He should be fishing.

 

[fifidriver]

So why is he so worried about the Nic and what happens here?

He should be fishing.

"USTUPID is as USTUPID does" finally realized what it has cost him and where it will end. That's got to leave a mark!


Gives "Lowest pay til the last day!" a whole new meaning doesn't it? Enjoy!!!

 

[nic4us]

They can't cement the Nic. I highly doubt they would pick sides like this, and especially the Nic. It really doesn't make sense they would, if they could. It will be a complete re run of the process, with USAPA and APA as the "opponents" per se. The West does not have any autonomy.

And the following is why Judge Silver, like Judge Wake, will not be able to cram down anything Nicolau on anyone. They simply cannot interfere with internal union issues. If they do, then it is going to be subject to the same appeals court that rendered the last. The 9th.

Although we do not hold that a DFR claim based on a
union’s promotion of a policy is never ripe until that policy
is effectuated, we conclude that, in this case, there is too much
uncertainty standing in the way of effectuation of Plaintiffs’
harm to warrant judicial intervention at this stage. Cf. Sergeant
v. Inlandboatmen’s Union of the Pac., 346 F.3d 1196,
1200 (9th Cir. 2003) (examining Labor Management Reporting
and Disclosure Act issue “in light of the well-established
federal policy of avoiding unnecessary interference in the
internal affairs of unions and according considerable deference
to the interpretation and application of a union’s rules
and regulations”)

Swan,

In regards to this and the previous post addressed to me.

I totally understand the 9ths opinion. I completely get the ramifications of the opinion.

But, a couple of things. The 9th made conflicting statements in their dicta, and the biggest ones you quoted above.

First they say, a union does not have to effect a policy for it to be a DFR, the mere promotion of that policy could be a DFR, (and in this case is exactly what usapa was found guilty of by jurty verdict ).....but usapa has not effected the policy yet??? so case dismissed??? That is a conflicting statement that does not address the verdict.

Second, they point out the deference in regards to "internal union matters" yet ignore that this internal matter was resolved by binding arbitration and never even mention that fact. They did not want to make a statement that, hey a uniion can just ignore arbitrations, or arbitrations are meaningless in the context of unions for obvious reason, so...they just ignored the facts. They called the Nic.."the West's preferred method" or some BS like that, not the result of arbitration etc..


Here is what I learned from this BS. The court system in this country has very little to do with the dispensing of justice, and everything to do with self promotion, running a legal industry of lawyer and judge employment, which falls entirely along political lines. Wake and Bybee (both republican apointees side with contract law and arbitration) Tashima and the other affirmative action judge (both Democratic appointees side with labor and unions rights).

So, go ahead and make their day and continue the reneging whining til your hearts content. But, the Nic is and will remain the only accepted system seniority list at LCC. Just no getting around that, and no getting around the fact that any future players are not going to waste their money on your temper tantrum.

PS. your cordial post was reciprocated in kind.

 

[nic4us]

Latest proposal on the USAPA desk, APA furloughed to get slots vacated by USEAST, WEST ATTRITION in 7 year fence reverting to AA US DOH at end of 7 years,! Emphasis language on straight DOH, no slotting! MM! BPR! KNOWS!

Latest reply from the parties with their feet on the usapa desk.

"um...who are you?....and what is a usapa??"