US Pilots Labor Discussion

[flyingskier]

No link, Usapa has been completely excluded to prevent them from screwing anything up. Today usapa was told that the deal is structured as follows:

1- Corporate Merger

2- Single carrier application (bridge agreement in place with amr unions, binding arbitration if a deal not done in 60 days)

3- After Single carrier approval, contracts offered to all other work groups. (single contract triggers nic. removing all legal liability)

There will be no TA negotiated as last time for any work group, eliminating any integration issues. The compan's lawyers expect the DJ to bind them to the Nic. and they expect usapa to appeal all the way to scotus, so the lawyers came up with this plan to eliminate usapa and get the company integrated asap. 60 days to get all contracts finished with seniority arbitration following. The APA will request binding arbitration once the contract is ratified with a goal of full integration in 24 months. This follows DAL/NWA road map.

P.S. Majority rules, so the apa can easily do all this within their dfr. check mate.

Fodase,

You need to call your doctor, your meds are off again and need to be adjusted.

Skier

 

[767one]

No link, Usapa has been completely excluded to prevent them from screwing anything up. Today usapa was told that the deal is structured as follows:

1- Corporate Merger

2- Single carrier application (bridge agreement in place with amr unions, binding arbitration if a deal not done in 60 days)

3- After Single carrier approval, contracts offered to all other work groups. (single contract triggers nic. removing all legal liability)

There will be no TA negotiated as last time for any work group, eliminating any integration issues. The compan's lawyers expect the DJ to bind them to the Nic. and they expect usapa to appeal all the way to scotus, so the lawyers came up with this plan to eliminate usapa and get the company integrated asap. 60 days to get all contracts finished with seniority arbitration following. The APA will request binding arbitration once the contract is ratified with a goal of full integration in 24 months. This follows DAL/NWA road map.

P.S. Majority rules, so the apa can easily do all this within their dfr. check mate.

Just curious when the 60 days start? I would think that the merger has to have some sort of approval before the single carrier application can be approved.

 

[Ames]

No link, Usapa has been completely excluded to prevent them from screwing anything up. Today usapa was told that the deal is structured as follows:

1- Corporate Merger

2- Single carrier application (bridge agreement in place with amr unions, binding arbitration if a deal not done in 60 days)

3- After Single carrier approval, contracts offered to all other work groups. (single contract triggers nic. removing all legal liability)

There will be no TA negotiated as last time for any work group, eliminating any integration issues. The compan's lawyers expect the DJ to bind them to the Nic. and they expect usapa to appeal all the way to scotus, so the lawyers came up with this plan to eliminate usapa and get the company integrated asap. 60 days to get all contracts finished with seniority arbitration following. The APA will request binding arbitration once the contract is ratified with a goal of full integration in 24 months. This follows DAL/NWA road map.

P.S. Majority rules, so the apa can easily do all this within their dfr. check mate.

This is pretty much how I have been saying it would happen. What say you MM/Claxon? Have you checked into the nearest mental health facility yet? How about eastus? You must have at least 10000 useless words to puke up on this matter?

 

[BoeingBoy]

That's what I heard, plus unlike you I go through PHL and PHX frequently. Please enlighten me to your reality, oh great knower of all things aviation.

Skier

As I said to East, I don't have to enlighten anyone. Parker/Kirby have done that on several occasions - all you have to do is listen. Are you claiming that going "through PHL and PHX frequently" gives you better data than they have? If PHL is such a powerhouse, why is little ole CLT the best financially performing hub US has? It doesn't have the O&D or the amount of trans-Atlantic that PHL has.

Jim

 

[Move2CLT]

Just curious when the 60 days start? I would think that the merger has to have some sort of approval before the single carrier application can be approved.

We are already in that 60 day window and I think a good initiation date would be when the unions announced they were on board with Parker, if not a little sooner.

The unions, and Parker, have been meeting since late last year and have been hammering out respective term sheets for a month or so. That 60 days is to now convert those term sheets into tentative agreements.

So the timing looks as though mid summer is going to see a whole lot of movement.

As for approvals, I really don't see any issues with approval or STS determination before the end of the summer.

Factors Indicating a Single Transportation System

The following are some indicia of a single transportation system:

(1) published combined schedules or combined routes;
(2) standardized uniforms;
(3) common marketing, markings or insignia;
(4) integrated essential operations such as
scheduling or dispatching;
(5) centralized labor and personnel operations;
(6) combined or common management, corporate officers, and board of directors;
(7) combined workforce; and,
(8) common or overlapping ownership.

 

[Move2CLT]

That's what I heard, plus unlike you I go through PHL and PHX frequently. Please enlighten me to your reality, oh great knower of all things aviation.

Skier

So you're eyeballing a hub's performance based on a few trips through each airport?

That's about as bad as FL430 thinking a pilot is still employed when he's furloughed.

 

[BoeingBoy]

As for approvals, I really don't see any issues with approval or STS determination before the end of the summer.

Personally I think that's pretty optimistic. I doubt that the NMB would grant single transportation status before it became certain that there would be a merger, which could be the end of the year or later.

Jim

 

[Beancounter]

No link, Usapa has been completely excluded to prevent them from screwing anything up. Today usapa was told that the deal is structured as follows:

1- Corporate Merger

2- Single carrier application (bridge agreement in place with amr unions, binding arbitration if a deal not done in 60 days)

3- After Single carrier approval, contracts offered to all other work groups. (single contract triggers nic. removing all legal liability)

There will be no TA negotiated as last time for any work group, eliminating any integration issues. The compan's lawyers expect the DJ to bind them to the Nic. and they expect usapa to appeal all the way to scotus, so the lawyers came up with this plan to eliminate usapa and get the company integrated asap. 60 days to get all contracts finished with seniority arbitration following. The APA will request binding arbitration once the contract is ratified with a goal of full integration in 24 months. This follows DAL/NWA road map.

P.S. Majority rules, so the apa can easily do all this within their dfr. check mate.

I don't really know what is going on. It sure seams though that USAPA should at least know something. What did my last update from them consist of?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M58rLQ13H0

Is it any wonder that some of the east posters, post what they do, when their only source of info is USAPA. To clarify, I said some, because some of the east posters on here have a lot better info than I do. Of course they're getting their info from sources other than USAPA. What the heck happened to all of that transparency and communication stuff they said would happen?

Bean

 

[Move2CLT]

Personally I think that's pretty optimistic. I doubt that the NMB would grant single transportation status before it became certain that there would be a merger, which could be the end of the year or later.

Jim

I would have said that too but I think Horton may turn and actually give in to this merger attempt.

I don't know if you missed this article:

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/morning_call/2012/04/amr-likely-to-consider-merger-in.html?ana=yfcpc

 

[Move2CLT]

I like the part where they ask about USAPA.

https://public.alliedpilots.org/apa/Videos/VideoPlayer/TabId/865/VideoId/99/CBS-Interview-Pilots-Support-Merger.aspx

 

[Metroyet]

Fodase,

You need to call your doctor, your meds are off again and need to be adjusted.

Skier

Do you seriously believe USAPA is going to matter one iota in all of this? Parker has shown his hand when he completely ignored USTUPID and struck deals at AMR. A yapping Chihuahua has more leverage over your new union than the Scab outfit. Parker, as forced by AOL knocked the collective Easts' Richard in the dirt.

My advise would be to STFU and finally enjoy the idea of not being an embarrassment to your profession any more.

 

[fodase]

Just curious when the 60 days start? I would think that the merger has to have some sort of approval before the single carrier application can be approved.

I understood it to be transaction closing date, but I might be wrong. This plan is far more advanced than anyone thinks, I was shocked at the level of detail, looks like it has been going on for years. Apparently there was a plan in place for a merger with each of the big 3 and the slot swap realignment was done to facilitate a transaction when the time was right. Does anyone think that Amr declaring BK and the company all of a sudden backing the west's legal position in court is a fluke?

 

[Black Swan]

What cracks me up about the scabs is they are completely devoid of situational awareness.

The West does not "ignore" the 9ths ruling...the West embraces the 9ths ruling.

From Tashima..."We leave usapa free to bargain for alll USAirways pilots......under the pain of an unquestionalby ripe DFR....once a contract is ratified."

The 9th straight up told usapa that the West will have your nuts in a sling if you ever get that DOH pipedream passed, and yet scabs like Claxon, Cleary, James (Continental scab) Ray, are out there telling the public usapa is free to scab West jobs.

No worries though...any interested party is also aware of the 9ths ruling. so, the company, the APA or whomever is not likely going to get in bed with the scabs because...the 9th already said unfavorable non-NIC=DFR=huge damage award to West pilot class.

Hi Nic4,

The 9th did caution, there is no doubt. But it was not an absolute, just a caution. You need to continue their discussion, because the following was in their opinion.

[8] Plaintiffs seek to escape this conclusion by framing
their harm as the lost opportunity to have a CBA implementing
the Nicolau Award put to a ratification vote. Because
merely putting a CBA effectuating the Nicolau Award to a
ratification vote will not itself alleviate the West Pilots furloughs,
Plaintiffs have not identified a sufficiently concrete
injury.2 Additionally, USAPA’s final proposal may yet be one
that does not work the disadvantages Plaintiffs fear, even if
that proposal is not the Nicolau Award.3

 

[Res Judicata]

Hi Nic4,

The 9th did caution, there is no doubt. But it was not an absolute, just a caution. You need to continue their discussion, because the following was in their opinion.

[8] Plaintiffs seek to escape this conclusion by framing
their harm as the lost opportunity to have a CBA implementing
the Nicolau Award put to a ratification vote. Because
merely putting a CBA effectuating the Nicolau Award to a
ratification vote will not itself alleviate the West Pilots furloughs,
Plaintiffs have not identified a sufficiently concrete
injury.2 Additionally, USAPA’s final proposal may yet be one
that does not work the disadvantages Plaintiffs fear, even if
that proposal is not the Nicolau Award.3

None of this matters anymore. APA is going to cram your next contract. USCABA will cease to exist. Poof. Just like you did to the West MEC. This is what they call, "turning the tables". Nic award coming to you soon in a polished aluminum suppository.

 

[Pi brat]

Personally I think that's pretty optimistic. I doubt that the NMB would grant single transportation status before it became certain that there would be a merger, which could be the end of the year or later.

Jim

I'd guess way optimistic. Sorta like "this whole seniority thing will be over by April".