US Pilot Labor Thread 10/5 to 10/12 KEEP ON TOPIC

[N924PS]

Nonsense sir. I was/am hardly any "key" man..and I had MANY conversations with a collective and virtual host of folks, over the course of many flights, that would also have cheerfully placed a bounty on Alpoids...See..here's the thing = If someone steals your wallet..It's merely a nuisance. When someone steals your future/pension/etc...It can actually get on people's last nerves...amazingly enough.

Whatever host of attempted colorations might ever be tried..Alpa just plain failed at every level possible....period.

I don't disagree with you on that one.

 

[EastUS]

But for USAPA, failure is not an option.

This much?..We've the fullest accord on sir. Only time will tell the tale..and as "old men" in this business ourselves, that've seen so much over time..well..we'll still just have to wait and see the ultimate results. Umm..although it's not necessarily my nature to be overly optimistic concerning any/all future projections...I do believe it will prove out well in the long run.

 

[BoeingBoy]

There was a strong anti ALPA undercurrent on this property before the Nic award. It simply lacked the critical mass which the award provided.

The strength of that undercurrent seems to depend on what's needed to rebut something. It's been posted that the USAPA vote was on the C&B/L's, on the interim reps, or on multiple issues. Personally, I agree with you on the anti-ALPA undercurrent, with the DOH issue being what put USAPA over the top.

APA was the first legacy pilot group to break away from ALPA, was it not?

As far as I know, it was. And as I said, that's the only similarity between APA's formation and USAPA's

As I recall, one of the central issues was the two man crew.

Not the two man crew per se, but the two pilot crew plus professional engineer issue - APA was formed and voted in before the more recent two man crew issue came to a head. I guess that one could claim that whatever reason exists to vote in a new CBA is just as "self serving" as the DOH issue that carried USAPA to victory, but one fact remains - it was one side of the two US pilot groups that brought USAPA to power, something that can't be said about APA. It is that distinction - a change in CBA because of and in furtherance of a division in the pilot ranks - that makes USAPA a one of a kind experiment (at least so far).

Jim

 

[EastUS]

(Deleted by moderator.)


Moderator note: Enough already. You all know the rules. Some posters are already in the cornfield. Personal attacks earn you a free ticket to join them.

How very "interesting"..two of my posts have "disappeared"..not "deleted by moderator" but entirely gone now, without a trace? Amusing. Allow me the priveledge of reposting the no-doubt last one to you then

So be it then. Any individual that's falsely claimed combat theater flying without ever even getting close to any war zone, is, of himself a "personal attack" to all who've ever served, much less all those who've perished for our Nation throughout our history, all those currently in harm's way, and is simply an utterly vile and despicable excuse for ANY sembalnce of a supposed "man". Such a pathetic creature I can never have even the slightest respect for in any way, shape or form, and I question any that'd cloak or protect such cowardly and utterly despicable behavior..for whatever reasons..much less by way of supposed "civility"....

When NLC was spewing forth batchlots of utter and complete lies about his self-assigned, and entirely false, BS "heroics"..and was immediately proven to be a wholesale con artist and BS-spewing fire hose..None saw any need for censorship....Interesting priorities as to what's "civil" on these boards

Perhaps it's just as well, as I've had my full fill of west notions of what constitutes "INTEGRITY" in any case.

Ciao

PS: It's not "personal" with NLC, as I find any that impersonate and/or pass themselves off as imaginary "war heros" to be equally disgusting.

Moderators?...I don't flatter myself that I'm of any great benefit towards enhancing your readership numbers..but..since you've the notions of having my postings become not merely "deleted by moderator" ..but entirely "disappear"at your slightest whim instead?...Go F yourselves...we're done here. Have a good one. ..."and I question any that'd cloak or protect such cowardly and utterly despicable behavior" ..With all proper and due disrespect for those that would simply pretend that something wasn't ever said...much akin to Stalinists "purging" people from pictures. my last posting was number 111, (and there's now a "new" number 111) which I did print the "real" 111, and have a copy of, having noted a prior "disappearance"... should any wonder at the truth of it...no matter I suppose,....have fun All and take care in life

PS Folks..don't be surprised if this too..just disappears

 

[ussnark]

Or perhaps not....the only similarity between APA replacing ALPA and USAPA replacing ALPA is that ALPA was replaced as the CBA. Pretty much everything else about the two cases is different - APA wasn't formed during a merger, it wasn't formed to negate a merger related seniority integration arbitration, etc.

So in almost all respects except one, USAPA is indeed a first.

Jim

USAPA was formed to prevent the last vestige of why pilots are here from being taken from them. You know, seniority, something you profited from your entire career. Now, sitting on the sidelines you jibe at those attempting to retain the only thing left that constituted "your" career. Shame on you.

APA was formed because certain ALPA "policies" were not in alignment with the AA pilots. So, too, USAPA.

You are now part of the peanut gallery. Thank you for your service.

 

[ussnark]

I suggest reading Chapters 21 and 22 of "Flying the Line" by George E. Hopkins. He devotes these two chapters to the rather complex set of circumstances that spawned APA, crew complement being the "final brick in the wall."

In contrast, USAPA was founded on the single issue of the Nicolau Award.

Wrong!!!

USAPA was founded on the "final brick in the wall", the "nic", building on all the insults delivered by ALPA minions for some fifteen years, just like APA. Try re-reading your book because you seemed to have missed a lot.

 

[N924PS]

Wrong!!!

USAPA was founded on the "final brick in the wall", the "nic", building on all the insults delivered by ALPA minions for some fifteen years, just like APA. Try re-reading your book because you seemed to have missed a lot.

Had the Nicolau Award been something that was accepted by both pilot groups ALPA would still be the CBA at USAirways.

Seems like all the minions you disparage were elected by a majority of pilots. The tyranny of the majority is only acceptable when it suits your cause.

 

[EastUS]

Had the Nicolau Award been something that was accepted by both pilot groups ALPA would still be the CBA at USAirways.

Seems like all the minions you disparage were elected by a majority of pilots. The tyranny of the majority is only acceptable when it suits your cause.

Wholesale nonsense..as to this "tyranny of the majoirity" BS. What's Right is Right...although all individuals have differing perspectives to be be sure. Quite honestly?..The ONLY slight respect I've ever had for the west's, to my thinking, entirely narcicisstic and utterly absurd "position"...is that they chose to do what they, absurdly in my thinking...feel's "Right"..regardless of the odds involved. Umm..btw..how many actually, ever bothered to even vote in attempts to choose between one generic Alpoid drone or another? ...Hardly any "majority" of the line pilots..as most had long since, just given up on Alpoid "processe" of any sort.

Hey!..This is kinda fun!..I'm going to be "banned" or made to "disappear"..personally just bail, and/or simply be done with this sorry BS here in any case..so..I can actually speak freely, and without any reservations at all towards "civility", outside of my personal standards of course Anyone who wishes to at present?.=Bring it!

 

[N924PS]

Wholesale nonsense..as to this "tyranny of the majoirity" BS. What's Right is Right...although all individuals have differing perspectives to be be sure. Quite honestly?..The ONLY slight respect I've ever had for the west's, to my thinking, entirely narcicisstic and utterly absurd "position"...is that they chose to do what they, absurdly in my thinking...feel's "Right"..regardless of the odds involved. Umm..btw..how many actually, ever bothered to even vote in attempts to choose between one generic Alpoid drone or another? ...Hardly any "majority" of the line pilots..as most had long since, just given up on Alpoid "processe" of any sort.

Hey!..This is kinda fun!..I'm going to be "banned" or made to "disappear"..and simply be done with this BS here in any case..so..I can actually speak freely, and without any reservations at all towards "civility" Anyone who wishes to at present?.=Bring it!

Interesting comments from someone who once served as an ALPA "Drone". I think I even voted for you a few times!

 

[flybynite]

No argument from me ma'am....You folks had the required common sense to go straight date of hire, as it should be.

You betch 'ya!

Some times it hurts buts it's the most civilized way to handle it. I know this better than anyone. I was a block holder with Piedmont when the merger with USAir took place and when the fences were lifted I lost my block holder status and was on reserve in CLT for the next 15 years. But I didn't begrudge anyone that. I know a few did. But as for me...I really didn't.

Seniority is the name of the game and it keeps everyone honest. DOH is straight forward and that's how I like it.

 

[EastUS]

Interesting comments from someone who once served as an ALPA "Drone". I think I even voted for you a few times!

Not the least chance sir....never been an Alpoid in any capacity around here....

 

[EastUS]

Seniority is the name of the game and it keeps everyone honest. DOH is straight forward and that's how I like it.

Amen Sis...We've all seen our ups and downs through such..but; It's the only thing that makes any fundamental and lasting sense....

All this "The moon's in Capricorn!..so I'm "senior"..I've a secret witch mark on my right cheek!..so I'm "senior"...I like blue and you don't!...Pick a number between 1 and 10...It's Tuesday,..so I'm "senior" now...I was AWA!...It's all just "relative"...The Arbitrator said!/etc"..is nothing more than a toxic witches' brew for the enhancement of human insanity....

 

[ussnark]

Interesting comments from someone who once served as an ALPA "Drone". I think I even voted for you a few times!

I think you have the wrong person, not that that hasn't happened before.

You should really meditate on what EastUS says. A shallow person always misses the underlying truth, especially when thought is not applied.

 

[N924PS]

Not the least chance sir....never been an Alpoid in any capacity around here....

And your not married to Baja Babe either.........

 

[EastUS]

And your not married to Baja Babe either.........

Nope..Don't know that I've ever met the Lady....and I'd think that her husband wouldn't be much thrilled at even the suggestion. You would have to look under files labeled: "Short, ex USAF punks with attitude" for starters (I've long been convinced that PSA, being mostly USN..kept such files) ..or..we could just do golf or lunch Lunch would be safer..my golf game's a joke...