IAM topic of the week
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roadtrip
Veteran
Yup thats is correct!
Don't even get me started on Mid Atlantic Airways and that sham deal
Canale got suckered on that bait and switch deal.....
and we got screwed...
Canale=No Trust
roadtrip
Veteran
I did some research and looked around correct me if I'm wrong but Midwest Ramp was non union and the company was free anytime to replace those folks
On Delta those rampers have always been non-union they worked for a get this a labor friendly company! So the company thanks them by laying off a big bunch of them.
Now for Alaska Airlines Ramp in Sea I found an Article from USA Today dated 6/3/2005 and I bring your attention to this part
"Because Alaska has a contractual right to hire subcontractors, it was not required to negotiate at all with the
union to try to save the ramp workers' jobs," Hollinger said. [
This is what we are all concerned about having Canale and Canalites sign a new TA that has loop holes like Alaska had in there contract that would allow management to contract you out.
Sorry but We don't want anything like that deal and we will be on guard to stop any trash deals from Canale seeing the light of day.
perserverance
Senior
- Aug 10, 2007
- 382
- 0
Jester,
Though contracting out jobs to vendors is a situation, I agree with ''road'', you have to
have that in your agreement, to ensure this is not pursued. I personally don't think the company
would go 100% in that direction if they had the choice, maybe in smaller stations but the larger
ones would prove to difficult to deal with as far as the fleet is concerned.
An example of a vendor coming into play has already occured in places on the property already
but I can only speak for PHL. In utilities the contracted out jobs have shown thier value. Just look
at the appearance of our A/C and read all the complaints our passengers file on a daily basis. The
company will tell you it was ''cost feasible'', and while that may be the case it is not good in the
long term for customer satisfaction and the growth of other airlines in Phl. Passengers are slowly
getting the choice of what airline they want to fly. We had them in a strangle hold when it came to
options and the hold is slipping.
In frieght, where there is a direct connection to the fleet, our operation has slipped. We take cargo
delays and are forced to scratch loads due to bad communication, damaged pieces and frieght not
being brought to plane side or taken to the frieght facility in a timely manner. I know a few not many
drivers who continue to complain about the service provided by NAS but the company's response is
never, ''we have to think of giving these jobs back to the fleet'' it is however ''thank you for your
concerns and we will look into the matter''.
Hiring a vendor may work in some situations in a different vocation but in the airline division where
everything from mishandeled baggage to on time performance are rated and ranked you
need to ensure the employees are yours so you as a manager or worker can interact directly with
the agents performing the job.
Now before you say were ranked and rated near the bottom often I need you to look at prior
to all the concessions and oddly the growth of our airline while concessions were being made.
It can not be overstated enough, ''you get what you pay for''. The pool of perspective employees
becomes less when the appeal of the wages and long term prospects seems bleak. When many of us
were hired this was a job that offered you a means to foundation to start. The company has removed
that foundation and they still seek a ''good worker''. That will not occur.
Bottom line Vendors are indeed ''cost effective'' , Thier effectiveness has a cost and not in the
good way.....
I hope this explains my views on your question.
Thanks
Though contracting out jobs to vendors is a situation, I agree with ''road'', you have to
have that in your agreement, to ensure this is not pursued. I personally don't think the company
would go 100% in that direction if they had the choice, maybe in smaller stations but the larger
ones would prove to difficult to deal with as far as the fleet is concerned.
An example of a vendor coming into play has already occured in places on the property already
but I can only speak for PHL. In utilities the contracted out jobs have shown thier value. Just look
at the appearance of our A/C and read all the complaints our passengers file on a daily basis. The
company will tell you it was ''cost feasible'', and while that may be the case it is not good in the
long term for customer satisfaction and the growth of other airlines in Phl. Passengers are slowly
getting the choice of what airline they want to fly. We had them in a strangle hold when it came to
options and the hold is slipping.
In frieght, where there is a direct connection to the fleet, our operation has slipped. We take cargo
delays and are forced to scratch loads due to bad communication, damaged pieces and frieght not
being brought to plane side or taken to the frieght facility in a timely manner. I know a few not many
drivers who continue to complain about the service provided by NAS but the company's response is
never, ''we have to think of giving these jobs back to the fleet'' it is however ''thank you for your
concerns and we will look into the matter''.
Hiring a vendor may work in some situations in a different vocation but in the airline division where
everything from mishandeled baggage to on time performance are rated and ranked you
need to ensure the employees are yours so you as a manager or worker can interact directly with
the agents performing the job.
Now before you say were ranked and rated near the bottom often I need you to look at prior
to all the concessions and oddly the growth of our airline while concessions were being made.
It can not be overstated enough, ''you get what you pay for''. The pool of perspective employees
becomes less when the appeal of the wages and long term prospects seems bleak. When many of us
were hired this was a job that offered you a means to foundation to start. The company has removed
that foundation and they still seek a ''good worker''. That will not occur.
Bottom line Vendors are indeed ''cost effective'' , Thier effectiveness has a cost and not in the
good way.....
I hope this explains my views on your question.
Thanks
The Bagfather
Senior
Who are you directing this comment to? Please put your comments
under the poster they pertain to otherwise they seem to come out
of nowhere. Thank you for your consideration.
wings396
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
- 3,672
- 1,122
"Jester,
Though contracting out jobs to vendors is a situation, I agree with ''road'', you have to
have that in your agreement, to ensure this is not pursued. I personally don't think the company
would go 100% in that direction if they had the choice, maybe in smaller stations but the larger
ones would prove to difficult to deal with as far as the fleet is concerned."
If given the option, the company WILL contract out any and all jobs that they can. I have seen it first hand with the outsourcing of 20+ east stations. As soon as the ink was dry on the CBA, the company began taking bids for fleet service jobs in these stations. If the new CBA permits outsourcing, you can bet the ranch that they will outsource every west station that they can.
Though contracting out jobs to vendors is a situation, I agree with ''road'', you have to
have that in your agreement, to ensure this is not pursued. I personally don't think the company
would go 100% in that direction if they had the choice, maybe in smaller stations but the larger
ones would prove to difficult to deal with as far as the fleet is concerned."
If given the option, the company WILL contract out any and all jobs that they can. I have seen it first hand with the outsourcing of 20+ east stations. As soon as the ink was dry on the CBA, the company began taking bids for fleet service jobs in these stations. If the new CBA permits outsourcing, you can bet the ranch that they will outsource every west station that they can.
- Banned
- #69
Are the moderator now?
roabilly
Veteran
- Feb 17, 2008
- 2,136
- 2,355
OUTSOURCIN' FLEET QUESTION:
Gottah quick question fer all tha more prolific minds browsin’ this board.
Seems to me, if tha Company really wanted tahh outsource Fleet…they just missed tha golden opportunity!
Couldn’t have tha bankruptcy proceedings been orchestrated in ahh way as to have made this possible?
All tha Unions were on their knees... ‘n helpless! (Least, that’s what they told us.)
If tha answer is yes… or even maybe… than that tells us (membership)
tha Company doesn’t consider this cost effective.
700UW … got any input?
Gottah quick question fer all tha more prolific minds browsin’ this board.
Seems to me, if tha Company really wanted tahh outsource Fleet…they just missed tha golden opportunity!
Couldn’t have tha bankruptcy proceedings been orchestrated in ahh way as to have made this possible?
All tha Unions were on their knees... ‘n helpless! (Least, that’s what they told us.)
If tha answer is yes… or even maybe… than that tells us (membership)
tha Company doesn’t consider this cost effective.
700UW … got any input?
- Banned
- #71
Well let me tell you what I know from being at CCY for M&R Negotiations during the last bankrupcty.
Your PHL members of the NC screwed the Class II stations and the cities that closed.
The company wanted to outsource PHL Catering and give them all jobs on the ramp, since PHL said no way, the company had to seek the cost savings from somewhere and the Class II and small cities were the sacrificial lambs.
They did outsource what they wanted so my personal opinion is they want to do the same to the cities currently staffed by the West that are similar to the cities that were closed on the Eastside of the operation.
I know in the current M&R talks they want to outsource more of heavy maintenance and the IAM is totally against that situation so I doubt you will see an agreement between US and the IAM for M&R.
Your PHL members of the NC screwed the Class II stations and the cities that closed.
The company wanted to outsource PHL Catering and give them all jobs on the ramp, since PHL said no way, the company had to seek the cost savings from somewhere and the Class II and small cities were the sacrificial lambs.
They did outsource what they wanted so my personal opinion is they want to do the same to the cities currently staffed by the West that are similar to the cities that were closed on the Eastside of the operation.
I know in the current M&R talks they want to outsource more of heavy maintenance and the IAM is totally against that situation so I doubt you will see an agreement between US and the IAM for M&R.
mike33
Veteran
- Nov 7, 2007
- 2,252
- 1,128
The company has a problem.......The west stations have " no outsourcing language "
My ID says usairways
The planes in my station say usairways
But, my TWU contract says " no outsourcing ".
SFO for example: Separate operations. Who would they outsource to, themselves? I think everyone there has ID's that say Usairways!
The company has a problem by Contract Language. 2 contracts for 2 workgroups that are the same company employees in the same job classification.
What a Mess............I do agree with ur assumption of cost effective but the TA still has it in there. They say it's in there for catastrophic events......Yeh Right!
pjirish317
Veteran
- Sep 21, 2007
- 1,240
- 743
Jester,
If the company wanted to replace us with vendors, they would have already. So worrying about it is nonsense. Worrying is like an old rocking chair, you can sit in it all day long, and it still gets you nowhere. BTW if you are so over-educated for the job, then find other employment that suits your mental capacity. I chose to stay with this company. I am not sure how much time you have, but obviously you made the same choice. I for one don't worry about what could happen, or what happened to other rampers at other airlines, I worry about what happens at usairways when it happens. I do not live on the "What If" planet. So we will have to see if the coming negotiations will be productive or not. Personaly I think canoli is too arrogant, and will try to pass the same T/A as last time. Only to have it shoved back up his arse. The entire Fleet Service group needs to stay strong and unified in the effort for a fair and equitable agreement.
So Refutes pjirish
If the company wanted to replace us with vendors, they would have already. So worrying about it is nonsense. Worrying is like an old rocking chair, you can sit in it all day long, and it still gets you nowhere. BTW if you are so over-educated for the job, then find other employment that suits your mental capacity. I chose to stay with this company. I am not sure how much time you have, but obviously you made the same choice. I for one don't worry about what could happen, or what happened to other rampers at other airlines, I worry about what happens at usairways when it happens. I do not live on the "What If" planet. So we will have to see if the coming negotiations will be productive or not. Personaly I think canoli is too arrogant, and will try to pass the same T/A as last time. Only to have it shoved back up his arse. The entire Fleet Service group needs to stay strong and unified in the effort for a fair and equitable agreement.
So Refutes pjirish
perserverance
Senior
- Aug 10, 2007
- 382
- 0
700-
Yeah I just read your post. Phl did agree to the proposal in front of them, but
at what cost. Lose '' catering'' or lose the other cities. I'm not sticking up for them but a
job is a job, and Phl was the pawn ...you , yes you had this as leverage and instead gave
it up........move on to posts' that involve your plight..your not a plus to our fight but a
deterent, and yet here you are on this post and many others'....to the other members , I
rarely engage in these type of posts' but look at the posters' history....they do not remain
in the subject or topic they look to disrupt a topic and ask for rebute...not form me.......700
I have no idea who you think you represent or defend but I so know your not part of the
conversation...you just have a selfish pride and GOD BLESS THE IAM is your motto.......
Thanks
Yeah I just read your post. Phl did agree to the proposal in front of them, but
at what cost. Lose '' catering'' or lose the other cities. I'm not sticking up for them but a
job is a job, and Phl was the pawn ...you , yes you had this as leverage and instead gave
it up........move on to posts' that involve your plight..your not a plus to our fight but a
deterent, and yet here you are on this post and many others'....to the other members , I
rarely engage in these type of posts' but look at the posters' history....they do not remain
in the subject or topic they look to disrupt a topic and ask for rebute...not form me.......700
I have no idea who you think you represent or defend but I so know your not part of the
conversation...you just have a selfish pride and GOD BLESS THE IAM is your motto.......
Thanks
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