IAM Fleet Service topic

[JoeDirt]

perserverance, I work in LAS and we are told that where not a HUB! so we don't get hub pay like phl or clt and those flight reductions don't happen till AUG...............

I don't know who is telling you this but LAS would be a Class I city under our current CBA. This sounds a lot like someone trying to influence the vote in LAS. It doesn't matter if LAS is considered a "Hub" or not.

 

[Ramp Rogue]

Would anyone have an answer? I cant get any union leaders to answer my calls.


Thanks

Sidelined,

You must realize that UNION LEADERS is an OXYMORON. Then you will understand why your calls go unanswered.

Rogue

 

[wings396]

I have a question, I'm currently on furlough from the 2005 mass closing of east cities. If I was to put in transfer paperwork for a city and I got it and say this POS T/A agreement passes, would I be given an adjusted date since I transferred in before ratification?

Would anyone have an answer? I cant get any union leaders to answer my calls.

Also do we still use PE-66's to put in for transfers?


Thanks

Yes, you can still put in a PE-66. I can provide you with the fax number to send it to and how to get one. To answer the rest of your question, IF you are back at work at the time of ratification, you will go back to your pay seniority the following pay period. Your regular seniorty should still be in place for the term of your recall rights. The 60 day Crap only had an effect on your rate of pay. I hope this helps. 🙄

 

[mike33]

So Tim you think that voting against an agreement that gives rasies in a down ecomomy is sensibly. Well I guess if your independatly wealthy. Look I think that if a merger does take place its going to happen with or without this vote being yes or no.
There also is no guarentee that UA is going to be the buyer.
If you look at UAs balance sheet they have many problems. My guess its going to be USAirways as the buyer so out goes any COC language. There are no clear cut outcomes in any of this.
One thing is for sure though we all get an increase in our rate of pay and we all come together as one.
That should be the goal here.

Anyone that considers us as being one while thowing me under the bus has a rude awakening. If you want to consider us as one than vote no, hold your ground with or without pay. I know it's hard but that's what sacrifice is if you still want to be employed by this company. What part of the UA FS contract don't you understand about " not being furloughed for any reason if you were on the UA payroll as of 1994 "!!!!!!

Someone pinch these guys %%$#$#^_)(_). Get a grip and do some research.....................

 

[cltrat]

Mike I just look at some and shake my head thanks for the info you have provided bro

 

[Tim Nelson]

cltrat, I am no expert but this is what I believe that makes CIC worthless. I may be wrong, but in the end I won't regret my yes decision. I may however understand that my yes decision was wrong but I won't regret it because I made it with all the facts and possibilities at my disposal. If this TA gets shot down I will be ready to take the next step with the naysayers.

Respectfully,

P. REZ

Pat, the one fact that you are failing to be reasonable with in regards to the CIC is your failure to recognize that the CIC was a 'must have' for the company this time. That basic fact can logically and reasonable mean that the CIC must be more than your opinion that it was 'worthless'. I think the facts should allow you to give more respect to the CIC.

So far IMO, PHX is bias as they have not come up with one good reason why the CIC was a 'must have' for Hemenway. Freedom said hemenway was 'Just cleaning things up'. That is a nonsensical position. You are saying it is 'worthless'. I think the facts are separate from my opinion and hold your positon to be incorrect when addressing the actions of the company, i.e., why would Hemenway want the CIC if it is worthless?

The facts are this:
1. The company attorneys didn't mind leaving the CIC in the contract when doing the AMerica West merger. And an arbitrator agreed with the company attorneys.
2. The company attorneys told Hemenway to remove the CIC this time.
3. A merger is being discussed and may be announced as soon as May 9th.

I think it is very clear that the CIC has value and in having value it gives fleet service leverage. I'll stand on the actions of Hemenway. To say it is worthless does harm to justice as there would be no logical reason why hemenway would make the CIC a 'must have'.

You may be correct in that the company may have to shuffle a transaction if the CIC was left in, but the company obviously doesn't have any present intentions of doing so since it wants fleet service to be the last group to remove it.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[Black Magic]

Well put.. It simply comes down to "if it wasn't important to the company, why would they want it gone now?"

 

[Tim Nelson]

Las Vegas employees being told they may cease being a hub........

article

Thanks

LAS will experience "great pain' if this contract is voted in and they won't even get the $19 since they are not scheduled that raise [by agreement] until around January, 2009.

The United Airline board of director made sure he positioned United to eliminate the LAS workers by giving Hemenway the rights to lift part-time ratio restrictions for up to 6 months. In 6 months, LAS will look alot difference and the damage of a hub operation will have already taken place.

Also, not only did Canale agree to 'look the other way' for Hemenway on part-time ratios but Canale also 'guaranteed' that hemenway could 'strip' full-timers of seniority rights to part-time recall positons. I'm not the smartest guy in the world but adding these two things together adds up to alot of us getting 'screwed again'. LAS if not only finished as a hub, as the article said, but those workers who will be screwed will be screwing themselves if this contract is passed. It's in the agreement and separate from opinion.

The alternative is to hold your position and keep your scope protections, seniority protections and don't dare let Canale throw out that part-time ratio grievance he been trying to toss out. The only thing that will be tossed out will be Canale. We will be eliminating him in June and kicking him back up to the United Board of Directors where he belongs. Delaney will be taking over and there will be a new sheriff in town.

We have much to look forward to and there is much hope that we will finally have negotiators that will listen as opposed to talking down to us and beating us down like Canale has in each of his contracts. Each contract he never said it was a good one, he always sold it based on fear.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[Tim Nelson]

Anyone that considers us as being one while thowing me under the bus has a rude awakening. If you want to consider us as one than vote no, hold your ground with or without pay. I know it's hard but that's what sacrifice is if you still want to be employed by this company. What part of the UA FS contract don't you understand about " not being furloughed for any reason if you were on the UA payroll as of 1994 "!!!!!!

Someone pinch these guys %%$#$#^_)(_). Get a grip and do some research.....................

Mike, All united employees can't be furloughed in on the payroll in 1994. Some stations that will play into, others it won't. More importantly, especially for class 2 stations, is that Canale butchered the scope of the United agreement and it now only has a couple dozen stations under the fleet service agreement. Take, for instance, JAX. While United works the ramp there, it is the PCE group which comes under a seprate agreement. What that means is that the JAX workers would have to start day one and work under the PCE agreement [pe66?] or transfer to a covered station. Many of our class 2 stations will have no option other than transfer or change departments and start day one...unless they are working in a covered station.

For JAX or any other non-ramp covered station to think they will be able to get their $19hour next January and continue working in a non-covered station is delusional given the context of a merger.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

Here is another 5.4 MILLION reasons to vote NO!

US Airways CEO's pay valued at $5.4 mil in '07

http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/b...kerpay0430.html

 

[Rook]

Wow so all the class II stations could grt thrown under the bus if this goes thru!!

 

[Black Magic]

Yep hard times indeed...Some people really got it bad!

 

[Tim Nelson]

Wow so all the class II stations could grt thrown under the bus if this goes thru!!

That's right. The class 2 stations who are NOT covered stations will be screwed again. United has the PCE group that works many of its stations and it is a different craft. You are from JAX so you guys will most definately be screwed over unless you want to put in a pe66 and transfer to PCE group and start day one. Your only option is to transfer. Unfortunately, you will have restricted seniority rights to part time positions if you end up on furlough and you will have to transfer and commute on $19 bucks an hour. Sorry but it's in the agreement at United. In ORD, we don't have this problem but there are 'several' west cities and class 2 stations that will most definately experience 'great pain' if we are to allow Canale to 'gut' the scope and status of this agreement.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago

 

[Ramp Rogue]

Are you tired? Battle weary? Vote yes. Have you just plain given up? Vote yes. If a $3.00 raise is going to change your lifestyle significantly? Vote yes. If begging and pleading for double-time on your second day off, (that is the only time you will get it) is worth more then having your second day off? Vote yes. If having unlimited part-timers roaming around, keeping you from getting full-time is worth it? Vote yes. Is uprooting your self and family to keep your job is worth it? Vote yes. If it is okay with you when some union yahoo bumps your family off of a vacation flight you have been waiting all year for, Vote yes. If you have no problem with being in the unemployment line, while someone junior to you is still working, Vote yes. If you will be satisfied working holidays without getting holiday pay for it, vote yes.

If you are tired of being put upon by the iam and usair, Vote no. If you believe you are worth more then they are offering, Vote no. If you are ready to stand strong and fight the good fight, Vote no. If you are tired of the iam making choices for you, and you have no say so in the matter, Vote no. If you understand why the pilots, flight attendants, and mechanics fight so hard for what they have earned, Vote no. If for once you would like to see the iam and usair's back against the wall instead of yours, Vote no.

When you know that you have labored over the years for your just rewards, it makes it oh so easy to fight for them. VOTE NO!

Rogue

 

[Tim Nelson]

The way I see this thing playing out is 4 different scenarios.
1. We turn this offer down and the Co. and the IAM go back to the table and try to hammer out an agreement acceptable to the membership.
2. We turn this down and the Co. and the IAM decide to offer our current contract to the west for a vote. Then the decision will be fully in the people in the west.
3. We turn this down and things remain status quo and we continue to operate as we are now.
4. The T/A gets voted in and we will never know what else might have happened.
IMO #1 and #4 are the only ones that have any real chance of happening. The reason being is the company came to us for a reason. They
wanted/needed something from us. I have heard some say its the CIC. Others say its the scope protection in the west contract. Some think
its a extention of our contract. I think its all three. The only way for the company to get whatever it is they want is for either scenario #1 or #4

to take place.

First off, I agree with District Force that it makes no sense in rolling the west into the east contract since there are 'grave circumstances' without negotiations. Any 'rollover' will be with negotiations.

But, if a 'straight transition' the west into the east, then it would naturally follow that everyone should vote NO so the IAM can 'straight transtion' both west/east into the United agreement. Many would say that could be a good thing for most stations. In reality, there is no such thing in collective bargaining of a 'straight transition'. When making a decision, the decision should be made based on the available facts, not fears. One clear fact is a merger with united. Another clear fact is that LAS is toast regardless and needs whatever protections they can hang on to. Most in LAS will never experience the $19 they are set to gain next January. Another clear fact is that many class 2 stations and west stations are in 'non covered' United stations and would be eliminated. That's why hemenway had Canale throw that language in Parker's trash can. The CIC has meaning, at least according to Hemenway, since it was a 'must have'. Keep all this and hold our position. You can always agree in the future to this agreement which has $19, worst vacation, worst sick pay, worst scope, worst holiday pay [none], worst of worst. The company would be ecstatic if we accepted this contract on May 9th or anytime thereafter. This contract wasn't even negotiated. The negotiations session lasted 4 minutes and Canale said, "I do". Bottom line.

regards,
Tim Nelson
IAM Local Chairman, 1487, Chicago