Flight Attendant Recalls In 2005

[jimntx]

FYI...On my commuter trip home to Dallas yesterday, a DFW-based f/a (15-20year range) told me that if they do another summer of constant re-assignments, she is "outtahere." Now, you can put this in the same category with "I'm retiring at the first opportunity" or not. We'll see.

It seems to me that I am hearing more and more quality-of-life issues being raised by flight attendants with some years under their belts. I don't know any f/a who took the job to work 5-6 days/week. That's too much like a real job.

 

[FA Mikey]

Lots talked of get the money and run 777 award. Too bad it didnt pan out as we thought.

 

[czerny]

Lots talked of get the money and run 777 award. Too bad it didnt pan out as we thought.

[post="273604"][/post]​

I guess as always, we'll just have to play the wait and see game. Although, for those of us dumped in the summer of 2003, we have 2 more years of waiting. Am not sure I can hang on for that long! In any case, the MEC for AFA American Eagle were told during one of their meetings that there will be a recall this year and training for AE fas will continue partly for that reason. The 2000 dollar question is, "When?"

Barely hanging on at number 78

 

[flydcoop]

N,

I think the biggest issue with TW recalls right now is training pay. That's just my gut feeling.

Opening up "FU" probably has such a cost associated with it, it is easier to fly understaffed and reassign.

AA gave 2 "lower hallways" to insurance companies, IIRC (at the appropriately named "FU"...love the white and blue flag "on campus", BTW).

We haven't had "Industry leading pay" for some time now.

I don't know why TWA would need 2-3 weeks of training when we only needed 8 days to qualify on the TW certificate (only 2 A/C maybe?).

I do know the FAA sat in on our training to make sure it was "on the up and up".

The best is a memo we recently received that stated every SABRE entry costs AA money and to use them sparingly. That's well and good but A) why spin SABRE off and B) why try to outfit every employee with JetNet?

I would assume that when you do any entry through JetNet (flight bookings) that it is translating to a SABRE entry and costing us money.

That's how Sabre Plus worked...and it sucked.

N. Our entire contract is a joke but I eke out of it what I can.

The best was at the beginning of this month, my entire sequence cancelled while I was at the airport. I contacted sCrew Schedule to see if there was a make-up trip.

I then asked about "call-out" pay. The scheduler said (I swear) "do you want call-out pay?"

My response was "Uh yeah, you're joking, right?" "YES! I want call-out pay!".

Per the contract, you have to ASK for call-out pay...it's not automatic.

I think it is is safe to say, since I have predominately flown with TW cockpits that they despise the AA corporate mission.

All I have ever known is the AA corporate mission.

I also have difficulty flying with non-TWA cockpits...they are a different breed.

We are not "buddy-buddy" with TWA cockpits but I geniunely like many of them.

Our layovers and utilization are very different. My layover this month is actually longer than the cockpit's...that's rare.

We (F/As) have a crappier day the first day.

Coop

SLT

[post="273509"][/post]​

I have always loved the "they don't want to pay you" reason for not recalling. The f/a salary is an insignificant part of the budget pie. Much as you would like to think the "industry leading" pay is that great, it isn't a factor anymore. Reality check, AA would like to se ALL f/as at newhire rates. Your $10 over-staffing cost is a joke. It should be 1 hour of flight pay for each hour or fraction for all affected f/as. Tes, that is what we had and there was VERY little understaffing. I expect July will cut the numbers and give AA a pretty clear picture of what they will have left of our group. No passes, no Cobra, time to go for many.. On another note, I just got a letter from Laurie Curtis "thanking" me for my many years of excellent service. Do you all want to help me compose a reply...lol Everyone have a safe Memorial Day Weekend.

[post="273518"][/post]​

[/quote]

 

[flydcoop]

I just "commuted" back to STL with a Flt Svc Mgr who is in MIA now and she said that that IMA is starting to retire.

I had no idea that IMA was that senior but apparently they want out...I'll believe it when I see it on the MIA Recall list.

Coop

SLT

FYI...On my commuter trip home to Dallas yesterday, a DFW-based f/a (15-20year range) told me that if they do another summer of constant re-assignments, she is "outtahere." Now, you can put this in the same category with "I'm retiring at the first opportunity" or not. We'll see.

It seems to me that I am hearing more and more quality-of-life issues being raised by flight attendants with some years under their belts. I don't know any f/a who took the job to work 5-6 days/week. That's too much like a real job.

[post="273578"][/post]​

 

[nbmcg01]

L. Training is a cost of doing business and therefore tax deductible. There is a training facility in STL that could be used-FU2. On line training could be utilized. If I can get a degree from Harvard on line, it would stand to reason a good portion of AA training could be accomplished on-line. All that would be necessary upon recall would be updates and hands-on. That should be accomplished in no more than 5 days. AAs unwiilingness to "entertain" anything new and innovative is /was one of the deciding factors in my retirement. This company always says, "We don't do it that way" or "We have always done it that way"..That is why there is no growth. That is why the "product" is stale and that is such a pitty. AA could truly soar in this time of turmoil. Instead they tick off the internal customer and that filters down to the paying customer. I see it as a self fullfilling destiny of inferior results. Regards, Nancy

N,

I think the biggest issue with TW recalls right now is training pay. That's just my gut feeling.

Opening up "FU" probably has such a cost associated with it, it is easier to fly understaffed and reassign.

AA gave 2 "lower hallways" to insurance companies, IIRC (at the appropriately named "FU"...love the white and blue flag "on campus", BTW).

We haven't had "Industry leading pay" for some time now.

I don't know why TWA would need 2-3 weeks of training when we only needed 8 days to qualify on the TW certificate (only 2 A/C maybe?).

I do know the FAA sat in on our training to make sure it was "on the up and up".

The best is a memo we recently received that stated every SABRE entry costs AA money and to use them sparingly. That's well and good but A) why spin SABRE off and B) why try to outfit every employee with JetNet?

I would assume that when you do any entry through JetNet (flight bookings) that it is translating to a SABRE entry and costing us money.

That's how Sabre Plus worked...and it sucked.

N. Our entire contract is a joke but I eke out of it what I can.

The best was at the beginning of this month, my entire sequence cancelled while I was at the airport. I contacted sCrew Schedule to see if there was a make-up trip.

I then asked about "call-out" pay. The scheduler said (I swear) "do you want call-out pay?"

My response was "Uh yeah, you're joking, right?" "YES! I want call-out pay!".

Per the contract, you have to ASK for call-out pay...it's not automatic.

I think it is is safe to say, since I have predominately flown with TW cockpits that they despise the AA corporate mission.

All I have ever known is the AA corporate mission.

I also have difficulty flying with non-TWA cockpits...they are a different breed.

We are not "buddy-buddy" with TWA cockpits but I geniunely like many of them.

Our layovers and utilization are very different. My layover this month is actually longer than the cockpit's...that's rare.

We (F/As) have a crappier day the first day.

Coop

SLT
I have always loved the "they don't want to pay you" reason for not recalling. The f/a salary is an insignificant part of the budget pie. Much as you would like to think the "industry leading" pay is that great, it isn't a factor anymore. Reality check, AA would like to se ALL f/as at newhire rates. Your $10 over-staffing cost is a joke. It should be 1 hour of flight pay for each hour or fraction for all affected f/as. Tes, that is what we had and there was VERY little understaffing. I expect July will cut the numbers and give AA a pretty clear picture of what they will have left of our group. No passes, no Cobra, time to go for many.. On another note, I just got a letter from Laurie Curtis "thanking" me for my many years of excellent service. Do you all want to help me compose a reply...lol Everyone have a safe Memorial Day Weekend.

[post="273518"][/post]​

[post="273789"][/post]​

[/quote]

 

[flydcoop]

N.

Again, you teach me so much. FU2...hilarious! It should be activated...LOL!

Sad to say, but you are right about AA. We are too management-bloated and not innovative.

That's why management was not for me. I was happier dealing with paxs face-to-face and doing what I could to resolve it. I get more satisfaction from that. I had a pax scream at me in the galley the other day and it threw my entire day off...I'm still upset about it. I went to SLT FSM to report it and they were lovely (not to mention shocked that this happened on an STL flight).

Regarding SLT/STL, I know many people at this base from flying high-time. Regardless of the fact that we sent a group to the APFA BOD meeting to give presentations about our APFA representation, we are not anti-TWA...but that's what it turned into with the final presentation.

The junior ones don't care whose ahead of us...TW/AA, no difference...we're junior.

The base is in a tizzy because 16 AA Seniors are transferring in...we are not pleased.

My informal poll is about this transfer and every attitude is the same...if you were not here in JUL2003 or you were not furloughed, you have no business being here.

We sorted it out and you didn't earn the right to be here just to be off RSV in ORD.

It sounds awful but those are the results of my informal poll.

The juniors know what the SIA means...it's the 15 year F/As having near-aneurysms about a TWA recall...you would think all 4000 of you would be coming back to STL tomorrow.

I strongly believe this is the base where the healing will begin. SLT deals with former TWA F/As more than any other base.

The reality is TW will trickle in and we'll get used to each other, just like the TWA certificate.

It was ugly with the pilots at first but I really have trouble flying with a non-STL cockpit these days.

Coop

SLT

L. Training is a cost of doing business and therefore tax deductible. There is a training facility in STL that could be used-FU2. On line training could be utilized. If I can get a degree from Harvard on line, it would stand to reason a good portion of AA training could be accomplished on-line. All that would be necessary upon recall would be updates and hands-on. That should be accomplished in no more than 5 days. AAs unwiilingness to "entertain" anything new and innovative is /was one of the deciding factors in my retirement. This company always says, "We don't do it that way" or "We have always done it that way"..That is why there is no growth. That is why the "product" is stale and that is such a pitty. AA could truly soar in this time of turmoil. Instead they tick off the internal customer and that filters down to the paying customer. I see it as a self fullfilling destiny of inferior results. Regards, Nancy

[post="273789"][/post]​

[post="273948"][/post]​

[/quote]

 

[Flyboy4u]

Flydcoop

Great Post!!! I can tell you that this exact sentiment rings true at the LGA base as well. All of us ( Mostly Junior ) welcome the TWA'rs back with open arms and hope they get to come to NY as well. You are right that the senior F/A's are the ones whining the blues about the TWA F/A's returning to the line..The only thing I continue to say to them is either s**t or get off the pot. If you dont like it find a new job or ( In most cases ) Retire!

What Unity?

 

[nbmcg01]

Who knows what will happen. The first SIA honored our seniority in both JFK and STL. It was revised to fit the will of the then President of the APFA. JKF and STL became just STL. Then a bogus training class was held for the sole purpose of merging the seniority list...and the triggered the loss of all of our careers and forced the AA f/as to "give up" their AA qualifications and be trained as TWA-LLC f/as. Hardly an ethical way to do business. I probably would have flown for 4-5 more years just to have SOME retirement. Now, I have 35 years of nothing but a small PBGC retirement from the Ichan/TWA days. Until this company is willing to shake up mangt. and demand some new and innovative changes, it will truly be "business as usual". And my friends, that is one thing I will not miss. And for those who will say, "it is all a matter of pay"...horse hockey. F/as do not make enough to have salary a major issue. Pilots yes, f/as no. That is just another very weak excuse for dishonorable behavior. And where is the "good Union" when flts are short staffed enough that FSMs are flying? NBM-stl-ret



quote=Flyboy4u,May 30 2005, 08:58 AM]
Flydcoop

Great Post!!! I can tell you that this exact sentiment rings true at the LGA base as well. All of us ( Mostly Junior ) welcome the TWA'rs back with open arms and hope they get to come to NY as well. You are right that the senior F/A's are the ones whining the blues about the TWA F/A's returning to the line..The only thing I continue to say to them is either s**t or get off the pot. If you dont like it find a new job or ( In most cases ) Retire!

What Unity?

[post="274161"][/post]​

[/quote]

 

[flydcoop]

. And where is the "good Union" when flts are short staffed enough that FSMs are flying? NBM-stl-ret

What "good Union" N? I did a presentation before them and I saw the politics...I wanted to vomit.

Nothing will change for the MIA forced-transfers or the STL/SLT representation situation or TWA for that matter. APFA is more concerned with avoiding lawsuits and trip removals.

I wear the pin because I'm hopeful, but I no longer have the faith.

I had a very bad EPT experience regarding LAX-I F/A's but my revenge came on the trainers. I am qualified on every piece of metal AA flies...not by choice, I'm junior and draftable.

I show up at the 777 trainer and am frozen out by LAX-I. They were rather snotty..."this is the 777, the 752 is OVER THERE!"

They knew I was SLT (an issue in itself...I thought MIA was a red-headed step-child...sheesh!).

Then the instructor asks me if I am JFK, they can't figure out where my quals came from. I sweetly reply that I have NEVER been International. The trainer accuses me of being an over-achiever...why would I do that for every trainer at EPTS? I didn't have time to smoke.

I triggered for 777 and held it, not A300. Then I was drafted for A300.

sCrew Schedule finally figured out that they did not have RSV F/As that were A300 qualified in MIA...hence, the draft.

I didn't want to qual on the A300, but I had no choice.

I do miss that airplane.

It's all I flew before being forced to STL.

Coop

SLT

quote=Flyboy4u,May 30 2005, 08:58 AM]
Flydcoop

Great Post!!! I can tell you that this exact sentiment rings true at the LGA base as well. All of us ( Mostly Junior ) welcome the TWA'rs back with open arms and hope they get to come to NY as well. You are right that the senior F/A's are the ones whining the blues about the TWA F/A's returning to the line..The only thing I continue to say to them is either s**t or get off the pot. If you dont like it find a new job or ( In most cases ) Retire!

What Unity?

[post="274161"][/post]​

[post="274175"][/post]​

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[nbmcg01]

l. You are smart. AA should take a lesson from you. It is absurd that ALL AA f/as are not qualified on all aircraft and for all services. It would cut down on the extending of trips, cancelations due to lack of quals, and make life easier for all. If training and AA EPTs are as "wordy" as the Inflight announcements, I guess it would add another 3 weeks to training..lol We were required to be qualified on all aircraft, once "wet ditched" always wet ditched (for intn.), and were qualified for all services. And our AER(EPT) was only one day. Talk about "make work". Even though we had cross utilization between Dom and Intn, I always used to tell the Intn' regulars that they ought to be glad that someone liked Dom. I would much rather have my duvet fluffed than be fluffing someone elses..lol



quote=flydcoop,May 31 2005, 01:39 AM]

[post="274175"][/post]​

[/quote]

[post="274296"][/post]​

[/quote]

 

[acmech]

So why is it that Northwest can recall all their remaining F/A's but UnAmerican can not?

 

[operaations]

[post="274175"][/post]​

[post="274296"][/post]​

[/quote]
COOP it is people like you that make some of the people in Crew Schedule have bad attitudes. You just called the entire workforce in crew schedule Screw Schedlue. Have any of us ever called you fly pie. or fluff or glorified sky waitress. I think you should be a little nicer in the words you use to the people that control your schedule.

I in no way was refering to all Flight Attendants. I am just making a point that all it takes is one bad apple like ms COOP.

Coop you seem to be one of the most bitter people i have encountered on this board

 

[StraaightTaalk]

operaations,

The disdain you, and your alter-ego, Garfield, have towards flight attendants is legendary, as demonstrated in your collective postings on this board.

Though I do not know her, Coop is one of the most proactive, intelligent, and real-world oriented flight attendants out there. Your comments are way off base.

Just as you claim that "it takes...one bad apple like ms COOP [sic]" to spoil the whole bunch of flight attendants, all it takes is one, in this case, two, disdainful Crew Schedulers to paint the whole department in that light.

Coop is not bitter. She just calls them as she sees them.

 

[operaations]

operaations,

The disdain you, and your alter-ego, Garfield, have towards flight attendants is legendary, as demonstrated in your collective postings on this board.

Though I do not know her, Coop is one of the most proactive, intelligent, and real-world oriented flight attendants out there. Your comments are way off base.

Just as you claim that "it takes...one bad apple like ms COOP [sic]" to spoil the whole bunch of flight attendants, all it takes is one, in this case, two, disdainful Crew Schedulers to paint the whole department in that light.

Coop is not bitter. She just calls them as she sees them.

[post="274384"][/post]​

Curve

go ahead post any coment of mine that lumps an entire workforce as one and puts them down. You cant because I do not have a distaste for flight attendants. I appreciate all of the people that work for AA. Even you