AWA Alpa thread 11/2-11-8

[nostradamus]

Translation: the great AWA pilots tried to do this and could not, how do you low life' s think you can.

Condescending , accusation, attempted intimidation. Bottom line, pontification.

 

[Phoenix]

Not a policy? Care to back up that assertion?

Update for November 7, 2007

Invisible Illegal Meeting


Dear Philadelphia Pilots,

At the end of our meeting with Captain Prater in Washington on Thursday our Chairman encouraged us to stay around Friday (since we where already in town) to work on strategy for the planned meeting with the AWA MEC scheduled for November 9th and 10th.

Unfortunately, we had a couple of Pilot Representational issues scheduled in the Chief Pilots office Friday Morning back in Philadelphia. I decided to return to be present for those, while Eric remained in Washington for the remainder of the MEC meeting. It’s important to remember that the Emergency MEC meeting called by Captain Prater had only one agenda item: Response to the USAPA Raid.

Upon finishing with the pilot issues in the Chief Pilots Office, I called Eric to see if there was any need for me to return to Washington. Eric advised that I had better return, because there was an election underway for this concept committee (to elect the members of the committee) to work on resolving issues of importance to both pilot groups. I was in disbelief that our time and efforts would be expended on this task without the acceptance and participation of this concept by the west. I was beginning to believe that everyone else knew something that we were not privy to...

 

[lithuanian]

Here is the new thread. Please stay on topic. No personal attacks or name calling. Thank you.

I'm going to pick on Edward. You have the website. How the heck did you have the insite to open wounds for this workforce and industry. Gotta give you credit! But, are you going anyplace with this or not? Thanks, again. US.Airways/AWA!

 

[oldiebutgoody]

Tantrums? Hardly.

I did refute evey one of your admittedly weak arguements. For all of your complaints about my style of debate you offered nothing to challange any of my points or to back up any of your assertions, which boil down to the fact that you "feel" the award is unfair because a 17 year pilot is junior to a one year pilot. (No fact, no logic just your "feelings" about the unfairness of it all.)

You are the one behaving like a child, and not a very bright one at that.

Get back to me when you can actually say something substantitive.

I look forward to a long silence.

I'll only have conversations with people who are my intellectual peer, not mental midgets like yourself. This is the end of the discussion.

 

[nostradamus]

Update for November 7, 2007

Invisible Illegal Meeting


Dear Philadelphia Pilots,

At the end of our meeting with Captain Prater in Washington on Thursday our Chairman encouraged us to stay around Friday (since we where already in town) to work on strategy for the planned meeting with the AWA MEC scheduled for November 9th and 10th.

Unfortunately, we had a couple of Pilot Representational issues scheduled in the Chief Pilots office Friday Morning back in Philadelphia. I decided to return to be present for those, while Eric remained in Washington for the remainder of the MEC meeting. It’s important to remember that the Emergency MEC meeting called by Captain Prater had only one agenda item: Response to the USAPA Raid.

Upon finishing with the pilot issues in the Chief Pilots Office, I called Eric to see if there was any need for me to return to Washington. Eric advised that I had better return, because there was an election underway for this concept committee (to elect the members of the committee) to work on resolving issues of importance to both pilot groups. I was in disbelief that our time and efforts would be expended on this task without the acceptance and participation of this concept by the west. I was beginning to believe that everyone else knew something that we were not privy to...

“No man's life, liberty or property are safe while the legislature is in session.â€￾

 

[Phoenix]

The latest letter from the AWA MEC Chairman to the interim president of USAPA has just been posted.

http://usairlinepilots.org/AWA_MEC_letter.htm

The captain of every sinking ship is duty bound to stay with it till all other passengers safely exit. As the passengers of the Titanic rowed away from the ship, did the captain yell, "Hey last time I saw a boat rowing away from the mother ship everyone ended up nearly freezing to death. They lost their hands and feet to frostbite, lost all their money to doctors and lawyers, and now are begging on the street corner, but can't even hold a cardboard sign, "Will Work for food". Yeah? Well they aren't shark chum.

 

[exB717Flyer]

Update for November 7, 2007

Okay.... and how does that little post of yours relate to ALPA Merger Policy?

 

[Phoenix]

Okay.... and how does that little post of yours relate to ALPA Merger Policy?

Do you read coloring books?

It is'nt "my little post". It is an update from an MEC member who describes the election of three MEC members to a committee that will be meeting on the 9th with the AWA MEC to figure out how to complete the merger. I did not defend the meeting as something sanctioned under ALPO merger policy. Do you?

 

[end_of_alpa]

Nicolau was already very reasonable when he explained himself in the award. Yet, the east folks will have none of that. Likewise, many west posters have done the same, yet east folks will have none of that either. Do you have any other suggestions?

I'm not going to debate you about whether I believe whether you think the award is fair or whether I think the award is fair. That is not up to you or I decide any longer, that is up to the majority. You may not agree with it, but that is simply the fact of the matter.

The AWA MEC Charman seems to have declared war on USAPA and the majority. So be it...scorched earth policy is now revealed to management and they KNOW we already have a divided pilot group. It will be interesting to see management choose the side who will give them the better deal...East LOA 93, an already existing contract without the award.... or AWA Section 6....a great unknown? Certainly the company believes that LOA 93 is the prevailing award and the East pilots are required to fly it. They can withdraw from negotiations in the Transition agreement at anytime now.

Read the AWA MEC latest message to USAPA here....I guess he's drawing the line.

http://usairlinepilots.org/AWA_MEC_letter.htm

Will the West pilots work for less than LOA 93? If they won't, then the East pilots will just be forced to pick up the slack under LOA 93. We're bound to a legal and binding contract too, as well you know. It's called LOA 93. FYI.

After the company closes down PIT and, if I were management, I would guess their next plan would be to close LAS, consolidate operations in PHX and accelerate the hiring of F/Os in the East. If Section 6 negotiations do not go as planned out West I would overstaff East Captain positions on the A-319, B-737 and B-757 in preparation for strike action on the West. The cost to the company would be considerably less than the 122 million per year they offered all of us for parity plus 3 percent. But the east pilots evidently realize the short term loss would return a long term gain. With a ready pool of pilots on the East from overstaffing able to accept TDY assignments in PHX the loss West pilots from the strike would be minimized at the worst and probably have no effect if they hire enough new hire pilots.

I hope management isn't reading this.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

That's right, bubba, the whole world just wants to screw the East pilots --

The east seniority issue has been around since the UAL merger attempt in 2001. Only this time around the 20+ year F/O's seniority is so degraded the merger will have a better chance. It also started again with the DAL merger almost immediately after announcement. Then you have the award in late spring. Coincidence?

 

[nostradamus]

The east seniority issue has been around since the UAL merger attempt in 2001. Only this time around the 20+ year F/O's seniority is so degraded the merger will have a better chance. It also started again with the DAL merger almost immediately after announcement. Then you have the award in late spring. Coincidence?

No coincidence, the only wall between Parker and his merger payday is the pilot seniority issue. You better believe the PP group, Parker and Prater, are on the phone a lot trying to scratch each other's back. Not that there is anything wrong with that!

 

[ableoneable]

I'll only have conversations with people who are my intellectual peer, not mental midgets like yourself. This is the end of the discussion.

Still no substantitive response, just the nanny nanny boo boo retort.

I find the possibility that you are allowed to vote and to drive a car alarming.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Still no substantitive response, just the nanny nanny boo boo retort.

At least he didn't say "Blah Blah Blah next". Or what the missing Junebug used to say "Pinhead"

BTW. I know he's lurking, wonder why he quit posting?

 

[nostradamus]

Still no substantitive response, just the nanny nanny boo boo retort.

I find the possibility that you are allowed to vote and to drive a car alarming.

You are responding to a poster who has 10 times the character and intelligence you or you lineage could only hope to attain in this century. I do not know this poster, just an observation of previous history of posts on this forum.

 

[Frank Bama]

I'm not going to debate you about whether I believe whether you think the award is fair or whether I think the award is fair. That is not up to you or I decide any longer, that is up to the majority. You may not agree with it, but that is simply the fact of the matter.

The AWA MEC Charman seems to have declared war on USAPA and the majority. So be it...scorched earth policy is now revealed to management and they KNOW we already have a divided pilot group. It will be interesting to see management choose the side who will give them the better deal...East LOA 93, an already existing contract without the award.... or AWA Section 6....a great unknown? Certainly the company believes that LOA 93 is the prevailing award and the East pilots are required to fly it. They can withdraw from negotiations in the Transition agreement at anytime now.

Read the AWA MEC latest message to USAPA here....I guess he's drawing the line.

http://usairlinepilots.org/AWA_MEC_letter.htm

Will the West pilots work for less than LOA 93? If they won't, then the East pilots will just be forced to pick up the slack under LOA 93. We're bound to a legal and binding contract too, as well you know. It's called LOA 93. FYI.

After the company closes down PIT and, if I were management, I would guess their next plan would be to close LAS, consolidate operations in PHX and accelerate the hiring of F/Os in the East. If Section 6 negotiations do not go as planned out West I would overstaff East Captain positions on the A-319, B-737 and B-757 in preparation for strike action on the West. The cost to the company would be considerably less than the 122 million per year they offered all of us for parity plus 3 percent. But the east pilots evidently realize the short term loss would return a long term gain. With a ready pool of pilots on the East from overstaffing able to accept TDY assignments in PHX the loss West pilots from the strike would be minimized at the worst and probably have no effect if they hire enough new hire pilots.

I hope management isn't reading this.

Wow. You've got it all figured out. What's plan B?

BTW, Nic is not up to the majority. Nic was up to an arbitrator that everyone agreed to. No getting around that.

Bama