US Pilots Labor Discussion

[CactusPilot1]

Everyone must be off doing their taxes. It's been kind of quiet for awhile.

Taxes should not take too long since the numbers are small.

 

[nevergiveup]

Pi,

Why would you choose to appeal Binding Arbitration when it is understood that the outcome will be, Final and Binding? We had to have a third party settle our disagreement. He did. It's not up for negotiation. USAPA is merely (underhandedly) attempting to delay at any cost and any means the arbitrated award. It's not going away. So, what you are missing is the basic concept of Binding Arbitration. You say that after your appeal, when you lose, you will accept it and move on....why all the wasted time? The wasted money? The fear mongering by the East? The arbitration process is designed to bring the issue to and end for all parties involved. It is NOT designed for debate ad nauseum.

The T/A does not give you the right the avoid/delay the award. Its gives you the right to vote YES or NO. USAPA, is afraid to put out a contract to vote on, why? What are they afraid of?

You say we, the West, make enemies at every turn? You're kidding right? You wont have to look far to realize that USAPA has started this mess and forced the West to defend itself. Your ONLY advantage is the majority. Yet instead of seeking unity your group chooses to dig their heels in, and for what? Pride? And at what cost? Afraid to admit you're wrong on this? USAPA is a hostile organization; open your eyes to what they are spouting in all the recent updates, are they focused on a contract and unity? Or are they trying to justify their existence? They essentially brought this backlash by the West (and more and more East pilots) onto themselves. The charade is coming to an end. Are you ready to accept that?

USAPA = Afraid to let the pilots vote

Tis speculative at best!

 

[kubotapilot]

FYI...

You must be speaking for yourself...

My combined "entities" did not pay federal taxes in 2010. The 100k LCC component of my revenue structure is the smallest one of a group of five. It's hard to walk away from 100K though when you only have to work an average of 32 hours / month to get it !

Please continue being the good worker bee you are! Fly your 85-90 hours/mo. Remember, the world will always need ditch diggers. As pilots we are basically well trained machine operators doing the same thing day in day out. We are not given any incentive to excel at what we do...pretty boring stuff when you really think about it. Promotion is not based on merit. Even watching the sun rise over the north atlantic gets pretty mundane after awhile.

Taxes should not take too long since the numbers are small.

 

[CactusPilot1]

FYI...

You must be speaking for yourself...

My combined "entities" did not pay federal taxes in 2010. The 100k LCC component of my revenue structure is the smallest one of a group of five. It's hard to walk away from 100K though when you only have to work an average of 32 hours / month to get it !

Please continue being the good worker bee you are! Fly your 85-90 hours/mo. Remember, the world will always need ditch diggers. As pilots we are basically well trained machine operators doing the same thing day in day out. We are not given any incentive to excel at what we do...pretty boring stuff when you really think about it. Promotion is not based on merit. Even watching the sun rise over the north atlantic gets pretty mundane after awhile.

I did my taxes in Feb and owed. My wife is self-employed. I've made less than her for years since she has her own business. I get to do them quarterly.

I fly airplanes for a hobby.

 

[Black Swan]

I never said your posts, either. But several of your pals have said that seniority is forever. So who is confused, you or the others.

Jim

Exactly the case Bill Wilder made. USAPA is not bound to honor Nicolau, nor the company. Seniority, as you agree is negotiable. i.e. the Nicolau can and will be discarded, backed by the 9th.

 

[Pi brat]

Pi,

Why would you choose to appeal Binding Arbitration when it is understood that the outcome will be, Final and Binding? We had to have a third party settle our disagreement. He did. It's not up for negotiation. USAPA is merely (underhandedly) attempting to delay at any cost and any means the arbitrated award. It's not going away. So, what you are missing is the basic concept of Binding Arbitration. You say that after your appeal, when you lose, you will accept it and move on....why all the wasted time? The wasted money? The fear mongering by the East? The arbitration process is designed to bring the issue to and end for all parties involved. It is NOT designed for debate ad nauseum.

The T/A does not give you the right the avoid/delay the award. Its gives you the right to vote YES or NO. USAPA, is afraid to put out a contract to vote on, why? What are they afraid of?

You say we, the West, make enemies at every turn? You're kidding right? You wont have to look far to realize that USAPA has started this mess and forced the West to defend itself. Your ONLY advantage is the majority. Yet instead of seeking unity your group chooses to dig their heels in, and for what? Pride? And at what cost? Afraid to admit you're wrong on this? USAPA is a hostile organization; open your eyes to what they are spouting in all the recent updates, are they focused on a contract and unity? Or are they trying to justify their existence? They essentially brought this backlash by the West (and more and more East pilots) onto themselves. The charade is coming to an end. Are you ready to accept that?

USAPA = Afraid to let the pilots vote

Once again, you miss the mark by a mile. As I said, I didn't agree with USAPA's method of Nic abatement. I didn't think you could get around binding arbitration and the best we could do would be to vote no on a contract until the west decided it was in there best interest some kind of relief.

You say that USAPA is just trying to delay the Nic. Let me assure you, that is not what they are trying to do. They are trying to bury it so it will never see the light of day. When I say "appeal", I don't mean in the classic term, but as there is more than one way to skin a cat. Will they succeed? I've always had my doubts, but I'm not a lawyer, and there seem to even be a number of them that disagree, so we will have to wait for a judge/jury to tell us for sure.

You ask why all the wasted time and wasted money. It's for the same reason YOU are wasting time and money. Your side could stop fighting, tell the company you will accept a DOH list and let's get a contract. But you won't, right? You feel that it is worth the cost and it looks like, for now, the majority of east feel the same. There are things out there that could change that view, but I don't think there anything the west can do to speed it along. I think the west can slow it down. That's where making enemies comes in. I know the east has made enemies. You don't seem to agree with any other east idea, why would you adopt that one?

As far as the TA goes, it pretty much does allow for us to avoid/delay the award, that's what a yes or no vote will do, but we have to get there first. I haven't seen any great offer thrown out by the company and I'm not going to push USAPA to lower the bar and vote on some POS just to see how the vote will go. Would you support going to the company an telling them "Give us your best offer and we will put it out for a vote"? There is NOTHING to vote on right now and I think the company is playing this in order to keep their cost advantage. Talk to Doug and the boys about that.

As far as the ability to delay goes, lynrdskynrd gets it.

 

[Black Swan]

Yeah. USAPA is the model of success. LMFAO!

Don't worry Nos... if there is no contract by December we (UA) will be on strike. Then you'll finally have your chance to scab at UA. :unsure:

How's that recall of Cleary going? Awfully quiet on that one, considering you are obsessed with UA's recall of Morse, that won't go anywhere because they don't have the votes.

The recalls of Morse and Cleary are startling in their similarities. Both going nowhere. The east has no scabs. Your worries reside in your allies.

 

[aquagreen73s]

Exactly the case Bill Wilder made. USAPA is not bound to honor Nicolau, nor the company. Seniority, as you agree is negotiable. i.e. the Nicolau can and will be discarded, backed by the 9th.

Contracts can be broken. Nothing new there. When the benefit of breaking a contract outweighs the penalty of breaching, then that's called an efficient breach. Good luck with getting the company to go along with that in light of what's headed your way and USAPA's way (remember that little ole jury verdict in less than two hours . . . ). USAPA doesn't care, but USAPA doesn't have any money anyway. Plus, there's ample history of USAPA acting irrationally; as in jumping off bridges before seeing how high it is. The company on the other hand doesn't do business that way. What they got now works just fine. Can't say that I blame them.

Enjoy LOA93.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Exactly the case Bill Wilder made. USAPA is not bound to honor Nicolau, nor the company. Seniority, as you agree is negotiable. i.e. the Nicolau can and will be discarded, backed by the 9th.

First, I didn't agree. Practice those Dick and Jane books - they'll help your reading comprehension.

Second, I think I'll wait for the courts to rule. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think a Judge's ruling has more substance than a lawyer's blog.

Third, I know that you and others have twisted the 9th's ruling beyond recognition to get what you wish it said out of it but I'll wait on the courts for that too. I know a Judge's ruling has a whole lot more substance than you.

Jim

 

[East Hole]

Internet Trash Talk News Update (USAPA TOP TEN): April 12, 2011

Here is a little TOP TEN list to commemorate USAPA three year anniversary

See Story

PUNKS

 

[trevrep]

PUNKS

PUNKS? hahaha you've got to be kidding me.....that's some funny sh*t and ALL TRUE! Look at the facts, USAPA sukcs and needs to go......

 

[aquagreen73s]

PUNKS

#6 was the best. Don't you think so, captain?

 

[Barrister]

I did my taxes in Feb and owed. My wife is self-employed. I've made less than her for years since she has her own business. I get to do them quarterly.

I fly airplanes for a hobby.

Sure you do!!!

NICDOA
NPJB

 

[CactusPilot1]

Sure you do!!!

NICDOA
NPJB

Since the "majority" thought it was such a good idea to throw out a legitimate union and replace it with a "weak" association with no bargaining power, we all pay the price.

Thanks, Captain

 

[USA320Pilot]

ALPA, ATA and TSA Announce Initiation of Crew Member Identification Verification Testing

The system, which is jointly sponsored by ALPA and ATA, will tie airline employee databases together in a seamless way and enable TSA security officers to positively verify identity and employment status of crew members. In 2007, ALPA promoted to TSA the first version of an alternate screening method called the Crew Personnel Advanced Screening System (CrewPASS). CrewPASS has been used successfully at three East Coast airports for almost three years. This enhanced process leverages current technology to provide an effective and cost efficient solution.

See Story