US Pilots Labor Discussion

[luvthe9]

Pi;
It seems that someone forgot to put sugar in the USAPA Kool-Aid last night.

The other day one of your co-workers made the statement the he "prayed for the split of this airline"....

Here's mine:

"The wicked plots against the just, And gnashes at him with his teeth. The Lord laughs at him. For He sees that his day is coming. The wicked have drawn the sword And have bent their bow. To cast down the poor and needy, To slay those who are of upright conduct. Their sword shall enter their own heart, And their bows shall be broken." Psalm 37: 12-15

Here's another:

"Commit your activities to the Lord and your plans will be achieved." Proverbs 16:3

I am so very sorry for the losses that you have endured. I don't know how this journey that USAPA has taken us on will end, but be assured that we will fight the good fight and finish this race.

Have a great day.

Here is one for you: Those thinking they are righteous think putting Joe Monda with 17 yrs uninterrupted service with a new hire is blessed by their god. Joe Mondas' rose up and smote them big time!

 

[Pi brat]

The mutually chosed arbitrator already "found the answer". Final and Binding, what are you missing about that concept?

I'm missing nothing, what are you missing about finding some way to "appeal". You guys say there was no appeal, seems like there is. When all is said and done, I will accept it and move on. How about you? If the courts say that seniority is negotiable, will you accept it and move on, or will you fight until you retire/die, whatever?






Then what do you call avoiding/delaying the Nicolau Award? Enlighten us.

The TA always gave us that right. It could have been the west delaying right now. It was a pitfall that others learned from.



"If he is displaced...?" Alot of if's could happen. Its not just about protecting the East. Until this group is unified USAPA will not have the horsepower to get anything better than Kirby. This management likes for you to negotiate with yourself and USAPA is inept at accomplishing anything so long as its mantra is DOH. So, until then you can choose to enjoy your pathetic LOA93.

Same goes for you, and it amazes me that you fail to see it! If you get the Nic, you will still need the east to get a decent contract, yet you make enemies at every turn with you arrogant, condescending attitudes.



Your friend was ratioed in on the award exactly where he should be. It seems hard for you to understand that you cannot have it both ways. You say you want a resolution, but are unwilling to comply (until forced) with the award unless your friend who rightly sits at %18 on the list is protected with super seniority or reparations. Doesnt work that way. DOH is DOA.

He was not ratioed where he should be, and you can save your breath. DOH maybe DOA, I've never said it wasn't, but I guess it hasn't "A'ed" yet, has it?




They will get exactly what they should at their ratioed position that they brought to the merger. It's unfortunate that your group is unwilling to honor their agreements. If the truth hardens peoples resolve, so be it. All one has to do is look in the mirror at the problem to see where it begins. Integrity Matters to most, just not the East.

See the above post. The TA always allowed for delay, you just didn't see it coming from this direction. If you can't see the negative of hardening people's resolve, well it pretty much confirms what I thought all along.

 

[Pi brat]

Pi;
It seems that someone forgot to put sugar in the USAPA Kool-Aid last night.

The other day one of your co-workers made the statement the he "prayed for the split of this airline"....

Here's mine:

"The wicked plots against the just, And gnashes at him with his teeth. The Lord laughs at him. For He sees that his day is coming. The wicked have drawn the sword And have bent their bow. To cast down the poor and needy, To slay those who are of upright conduct. Their sword shall enter their own heart, And their bows shall be broken." Psalm 37: 12-15

Here's another:

"Commit your activities to the Lord and your plans will be achieved." Proverbs 16:3

I am so very sorry for the losses that you have endured. I don't know how this journey that USAPA has taken us on will end, but be assured that we will fight the good fight and finish this race.

Have a great day.

They don't look like prayers, they look like quotes.

You remind me of some folks that I used to go to church with. Wear their religion on their sleeves, but watch your back. Except when they quoting scripture you would never know they claim to be Christian. One reason I haven't stepped foot in that church for 6 years.

Here's my prayer for you:

Lord, please forgive him, he knows not what he does.

I have a long memory, and I remember you from another board.

 

[luvn737s]

I'm not confused at all. The entire contract is negotiable, including section 22. Every section can or could change while negotiating with Management.

So why have millions been spent to prevent a seniority integration that may only apply for a year or two? Have you ever seen the seniority methodology changed at an airline?

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Pi Brat says:

"The TA always gave us that right. It could have been the west delaying right now. It was a pitfall that others learned from."

I say facts is facts, that is a true statement. I think in many cases when a west pilot refers to others as having learned from our debacle, that he puts that all on the east's shoulders. But way back when, many in the west thought it was a good idea to set it up like we did. We had a hand in it, now we're living with it.

I'd argue with a few tactics the east has used, but as far as the structure goes, hey,we on the west did that to ourselves as much as anyone. We all, east and west, outsmarted ourselves.

 

[767jetz]

If there is no contract by December, there is no furlough protection for them.

Needless to say, united pilots strategy should not be copied or advice taken very seriously.

Yeah. USAPA is the model of success. LMFAO!

Don't worry Nos... if there is no contract by December we (UA) will be on strike. Then you'll finally have your chance to scab at UA. :unsure:

How's that recall of Cleary going? Awfully quiet on that one, considering you are obsessed with UA's recall of Morse, that won't go anywhere because they don't have the votes.

 

[cactusboy53]

They don't look like prayers, they look like quotes.

You remind me of some folks that I used to go to church with. Wear their religion on their sleeves, but watch your back. Except when they quoting scripture you would never know they claim to be Christian. One reason I haven't stepped foot in that church for 6 years.

Here's my prayer for you:

Lord, please forgive him, he knows not what he does.

I have a long memory, and I remember you from another board.

I'll take the complement. Worn on my sleeve, on my heart & hopefully from my mouth & in my deeds (not perfect....a work in progress). I stand fast with Leonidas to defend what you attempt to steal and do us harm (when I think of USAPA, RICO & the Cleary Regeme .....I think David vs. Goliath). I pray daily for God's grace, intervention and forgivness.

I'm sorry you haven't attended that church for the past 6 years. I can only hope that you have found a new church home.

Regarding the other boards, I'm not hard to find. I use the same name everywhere. If you want to know, I'll even tell you what my name is, where I'm based, where I live and what my dog's name is. I won't hide behind some alias spewing lies (like my buddies Nostradamus / Sumadarson, & luvthe9).

You did find my third piece of scripture that I was thinking about. While VERY displeased at the east's inability to keep an agreement (by dodging with a new CBA), yes....I do forgive you. Will you be held accountable or punished? That's WAY above my pay grade.

Have a great night Pi. I'm going out to enjoy the felowship of a couple of westies & some BBQ.

 

[cactusboy53]

Here is one for you: Those thinking they are righteous think putting Joe Monda with 17 yrs uninterrupted service with a new hire is blessed by their god. Joe Mondas' rose up and smote them big time!

Luv;
Are you just making things up again as you go? That may be a quote from the book of JoBoo (vs. Job). Shame on you.

CB

 

[fodase]

Usapa's top ten for the 3rd anniversary:

http://www.youtube.com/user/InternetTrashTalk

 

[Code Name V]

I don't know if you are ex Piedmont or USAir. But if you are the former then I'm pretty sure that DOH was no where near acceptable to you back in 1988. Many ex Piedmont are still smarting from that merger. Back then the mantra was relative position. I believe the Republic/Frontier arbitration award recently released was the first under the auspices of McCaskill-Bond. Check out the disparities in DOH within that merged list. A change to the USAPA position on DOH would need to be done in accordance with the C&BL's. My impression from flying with a wide range of pilots is that they are resigned to stalemate, hoping for good news from Kasher. If you were working continuously for a company, would you be okay with a furloughee coming in above you on a merged list simply because he/she had an earlier date of hire? Furlough is tough, but many went to other airlines and stayed, some left the industry altogether, very few had any realistic expectations of returning and very few that left ever looked back.

You don't really think the FAA is waiting for a tentative agreement to put the kabash on single operations do you? They would have advised the company by now that east/west cockpits ain't goin to happen.

Those of us who ask hard questions aren't traitors. I was sending money to USAPA before they began collecting dues. Apathy and blind obedience does not constitute mutual support

Finally, I think that the more support from the PHX contingent we can get, the faster we will secure a contract. There actually are F/O's on the east list who would benefit more from a better contract than a DOH list.

Thanks for the well thought out reply. FWIW, based upon your prior posts; I do not consider you to be one of the 'traitors' that I refer to or those with no concerpt of mutual support even though it was your post from which I was replying.

V

 

[nic4us]

Here is one for you: Those thinking they are righteous think putting Joe Monda with 17 yrs uninterrupted service with a new hire is blessed by their god. Joe Mondas' rose up and smote them big time!

Here is one for you.

Those thinking they are righteous think stealing another's Job is justifiable. Monda has not smitten anyone, so you can quit with the it is sooo unfair whine!

However, if you would like to pass on your sentiments to the almighty in prayer, here is a little tip. Call him by his first name, which I have come to learn is HAL.

Go ahead, ask me how I know.

 

[USA320Pilot]

Internet Trash Talk News Update (USAPA TOP TEN): April 12, 2011

Here is a little TOP TEN list to commemorate USAPA three year anniversary

See Story

 

[CactusPilot1]

Internet Trash Talk News Update (USAPA TOP TEN): April 12, 2011

Here is a little TOP TEN list to commemorate USAPA three year anniversary

See Story

Fodase posted this link on the previous page, FYI. B)

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Everyone must be off doing their taxes. It's been kind of quiet for awhile.

 

[Freebird]

Pi,

Why would you choose to appeal Binding Arbitration when it is understood that the outcome will be, Final and Binding? We had to have a third party settle our disagreement. He did. It's not up for negotiation. USAPA is merely (underhandedly) attempting to delay at any cost and any means the arbitrated award. It's not going away. So, what you are missing is the basic concept of Binding Arbitration. You say that after your appeal, when you lose, you will accept it and move on....why all the wasted time? The wasted money? The fear mongering by the East? The arbitration process is designed to bring the issue to and end for all parties involved. It is NOT designed for debate ad nauseum.

The T/A does not give you the right the avoid/delay the award. Its gives you the right to vote YES or NO. USAPA, is afraid to put out a contract to vote on, why? What are they afraid of?

You say we, the West, make enemies at every turn? You're kidding right? You wont have to look far to realize that USAPA has started this mess and forced the West to defend itself. Your ONLY advantage is the majority. Yet instead of seeking unity your group chooses to dig their heels in, and for what? Pride? And at what cost? Afraid to admit you're wrong on this? USAPA is a hostile organization; open your eyes to what they are spouting in all the recent updates, are they focused on a contract and unity? Or are they trying to justify their existence? They essentially brought this backlash by the West (and more and more East pilots) onto themselves. The charade is coming to an end. Are you ready to accept that?

USAPA = Afraid to let the pilots vote