sumadarson
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- Nov 17, 2010
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Vegas????? Bangkok, Australia???
US Pilots Labor Discussion
- Thread starter Richard
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Vegas????? Bangkok, Australia???
I missed the part that you were actually replying to my post, and had asked me a question.
My financial plan is working pretty good so far, thanks for asking.
Again, enjoy the "bottom of the food chain" LOA93 wages and work rules.
PS. I do not think I have made less than a commuter pilot, since after my first year probation pay when I came to AWA, how does that feel? Working out okay for you?
sumadarson
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- Nov 17, 2010
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Your america west pilots have been making those wages since 1983. How does that feel? You under cut other pilots since 1983, now you pontificate.
You averaged 50,000 less than a usairways pilot for 20 years, now you stand here and criticize.
The simple reason you were hired by america west is, you were the bottom of the barrel in qualifications, period.
You started this conversation about wages by the way.
Great, you speak spanish. That will help when you have to work the mens room at the Copa after 65 to make ends meet.
sumadarson
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- Nov 17, 2010
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Start a few pages back. You made fun of the usairways pilots wages. You started this. I proved your hypocrisy.
Deal with it.
My answere for the rest of the readers is, AWA was not a major airline in 1983. Actually, just an upstart, and pay was comenserate. Also, the table you keep posting is somewhat inaccurate, I have explained before, that in 1998-99, 2000 etc, up to a full 1/3rd of the pilots were on first year pay, and in 2000 over half the pilots employed at AWA were on under 5th year pay, Including 4 yr captains.
My answere for you specifically is, enjoy LOA93 loser.
sumadarson
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- Nov 17, 2010
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Another victim. Gutless answer.
Remember, when the alpa shills boeinboy and 767 jetz complain about me, you dared to start this conversation about wages. Now you tell the rest of us that you were not a major airline.....,,,, an upstart undercutting wages of every other pilot.........,,,,,,,,, You were first year..............
You and your fellow america west pilots dragged the industry down victim.
I am not angry, I am informative.
BoeingBoy
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- Nov 9, 2003
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Nic,
It's hopeless to give Nos facts - they just confuse him...
Ok Nos, leaving out the Empire thing at the request of Zone 5 you still have two baseless accusations about me outstanding:
- Prove that I have "kin" (as you put it) on the West side.
- Prove that I'm being paid by ALPA to post here.
Proof Nos
There's your specific list so where is your specific proof?
Jim
It's hopeless to give Nos facts - they just confuse him...
Ok Nos, leaving out the Empire thing at the request of Zone 5 you still have two baseless accusations about me outstanding:
- Prove that I have "kin" (as you put it) on the West side.
- Prove that I'm being paid by ALPA to post here.
Proof Nos
There's your specific list so where is your specific proof?
Jim
Took your advice, went back and read how it started.
I replied to luvthe9's post poking fun at the West spending profit sharing on AOL, and saying he would use his to take the family someplace warm.
I replied that had he gotten of LOA93 and gotten a raise ( I was assuming about a 35K increase) that after 3 years he would have amassed $105k, and could have been well on his way to having paid off a say $180k winter home in PHX.
You then budded in with your "bottom of the food chain" comment.
I baited you with the who aquired who fact, and you are now steaming.
My advice, relax, and enjoy loa93, you wanted it so bad, keep it.
- Feb 10, 2011
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Interesting thoughts, Sparrow. What about D Holler?
From: dholler |
Sent: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 10:11 PM
To: Mike Davis
Subject: Re: LOA93
You may share if you wish.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
From: dholler |
Sent: Tuesday, De )erO 1,2009 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: LOA93
I don't recall writing a paper addressing that issue as an opinion. I can tell you what I know to be true.
1. There was one mention of a snapback in the negotiations surrounding LOA 93 and that was on day 1, the first pass of the pilots' proposal to the Company where we addressed a snapback to previous rates. The Company unequivocally rejected the notion as the financial situation was so dire (and it was dire) that to achieve financing, a projected snapback would not be received favorably by lenders or investors.
2. The goal of LOA 93 was to provide financial relief for the company so that it could survive. The goal of the negotiating committee at the time was to come up with an ability to save the company $300 million dollars on average per year of cash because cash flow was killing the company at that time. The ATSB was tying up cash by restricting it's use so that it could secure the loan that was in place ($900 million). In addition, the credit card processing company was restricting as much cash as possible to cover the outstanding credit card debt that was in place due to advance bookings. They didn't want to get stuck holding the bag if the company went insolvent. Then there was GE Capital (the bulldogs in the junkyard) that were pulling everyone's strings on the debt on the airframes. With everyone grabbing cash to secure the current debt, there was little to no cash for operations. The goal was to live to fight another day.
3. There is no snapback, no term on the rates, except that the contract becomes amendable on December 31st, 2009. To tell you that USAPA doesn't have a chance in this grievance is an understatement. I have not been contacted to testify in the grievance nor has Doug Mowery and we are the only two remaining members of that committee still on the property. Why? Because I cannot sit on the stand and testify that there was a term on the rates other than the amendable date on the LOA where new rates would be negotiable. Doug Mowery has not been contacted either because his position is essentially the same. Why? Because that is the reality of the situation. The problem at hand is that there is nothing to support the union position from a practical standpoint. Trust me, I would love a snap back to previous rates but I won't commit perjury to get there when it isn't the truth. This particular arbitration will, in my view, be one of the shortest in history and it won't be favorable for the pilot group. Until, USAPA gets serious about a contract, settling the rift between East and West (for example dropping the Cactus 18 lawsuit which has no benefit for the pilot group) and acting like they represent all of the pilots, the current rates will be here for a long time unfortunately. This pilot group needs to start acting in a business like fashion and deal with the company in a businesslike fashion because it's all about the money. The company has it and we deserve to be compensated at a reasonable level. Gunfighters don't scream nasty remarks at each other they simply pull out the gun, pull the trigger, step over the body and take the horse. It's time that we start acting like gunfighters in the business world and leave the sophomoric emotional distractions out of it this is business. Just my opinion as a business and finance guy for what it's worth.
My best to you and yours for a blessed holiday season.
Warmest Regards,
Don
Don M. Hollerbach CPA/ABV/CFF, CFE, FCPA, CVA, CDFA
Pained off? oh, I see I made a typo.
Congrats on your fiscal planning, and enjoye spring training. Hopefully, it will not get too hot too fast.
Get a SFO overnight and I'll treat you too a game/beers. Maybe they'll be playing the diamondbacks.
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