US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Pi brat]

Stick with the Nic/T.A. and you will never be successfully sued by anyone....or violate the TA, collude with USCABA and allow their second bite at the apple at the sole expense of the West and get sued.

This is one area where I think you guys leave the tracks. The company will not be colluding with USAPA, it will be negotiating with the legally elected CBA. The company fulfilled their obligations under the TA. Read it. They have done everything it says they will do, remember? They ACCEPTED the list.

I know you want to go after the company because you have the illusion of damages and they have deeper pockets, but they will not be the ones doing you wrong(if wrong is done) it will be USAPA.

 

[Pi brat]

We've accomplished a hell of a lot. Nobody saw the West coming, especially the Angry F/Os.

OMG, AOL loves people like you. Or wait, maybe you are the chief lanyard salesman for them, as this type of b.s. is what it takes to keep the cash coming in.

You have accomplished nothing. We are right where we were years ago. Oh wait, you have accomplished something-stagnation and the extended furlough of many of your brothers.

I really do have some financial proposals for you if you think that zero return is a great thing.

 

[aquagreen73s]

You do realize US Airways already won against Addington and successfully had themselves removed as a defendant in the DFR suit.

Bob Siegle mentioned that and explained it well: then they were sued under two contract claims. The harm that the company is facing now was not present during Addington. Now they have no choice other than to go along with USAPA and get sued by the West. Siegle then emphasized that he knows that area of the law very well and the position that the company is in vis a vis the West pilots is not good.

 

[Freebird]

This is one area where I think you guys leave the tracks. The company will not be colluding with USAPA, it will be negotiating with the legally elected CBA. The company fulfilled their obligations under the TA. Read it. They have done everything it says they will do, remember? They ACCEPTED the list.

I know you want to go after the company because you have the illusion of damages and they have deeper pockets, but they will not be the ones doing you wrong(if wrong is done) it will be USAPA.

So you admit it? USAPA is doing us wrong. DFR? The company will be negotiating with the CBA (who was erected only to circumvent the Nic Award), the CBA USAPA, who inherited the prior CBA (ALPA) agreements. Which include the T/A. USAPA's option are extremely limited without the West. No NIC=No West.

USAPA = Where's our rudder?

 

[Metroyet]

You do realize US Airways already won against Addington and successfully had themselves removed as a defendant in the DFR suit.

Wake still kept them on the leash if he found evidence of collusion. Because the company wasn't dumb enough to agree to violate the TA, they were released. Guess what happens if they violate the TA?

They ain't getting out of it. They know it. Your point is meaningless.

 

[Pi brat]

I'd like to see their union try to cash that lottery ticket. Company will tell tell them to pound sand with the threat of a lawsuit hanging over their heads.

It's been there since shortly after the election of USAPA and I've yet to see the company issue a sandage poundage message yet. The love this! Why would they try to stop with one of us, unless there is a merger in the works?

 

[aquagreen73s]

OMG, AOL loves people like you. Or wait, maybe you are the chief lanyard salesman for them, as this type of b.s. is what it takes to keep the cash coming in.

You have accomplished nothing. We are right where we were years ago. Oh wait, you have accomplished something-stagnation and the extended furlough of many of your brothers.

I really do have some financial proposals for you if you think that zero return is a great thing.

How's your day? We're doing great. No DOH and there will never be DOH. Look forward to many more months on LOA93 for you. Enjoy, and here comes the Nic!

 

[Pi brat]

So you admit it? USAPA is doing us wrong. DFR? The company will be negotiating with the CBA (who was erected only to circumvent the Nic Award), the CBA USAPA, who inherited the prior CBA (ALPA) agreements. Which include the T/A. USAPA's option are extremely limited without the West. No NIC=No West.

USAPA = Where's our rudder?

I'm not saying they are wrong because I don't know. I've heard all the web board lawyers say each other is wrong, but I don't know the law. What I'm saying is that IF any group is wrong, it would be USAPA and not the company. As always, IMO. I see collusion as the company saying to USAPA "psst....we will screw over the west guys in exchange for a low ball contract", not negotiating something, and even if that was the company's intent, I don't think they are stupid enough to do it in a way that AOL could catch them.

 

[GorgeousGeorge]

Bob Siegle mentioned that and explained it well: then they were sued under two contract claims. The harm that the company is facing now was not present during Addington. Now they have no choice other than to go along with USAPA and get sued by the West. Siegle then emphasized that he knows that area of the law very well and the position that the company is in vis a vis the West pilots is not good.

What else would he say? He was only sitting in that courtroom because his boss, US Airways filed the DJ complaint. He had to attempt to justify it or there would be clear evidence that it was frivolous or an act of bad faith. He was doing his job. He wasn't going to argue against US Airways filing the complaint.

 

[aquagreen73s]

This is one area where I think you guys leave the tracks. The company will not be colluding with USAPA, it will be negotiating with the legally elected CBA.

Well, that's not the way the company's attorney sees it. The company's entire case is built around the lawsuit threat from the West.

The company fulfilled their obligations under the TA. Read it. They have done everything it says they will do, remember? They ACCEPTED the list.

Within 30 seconds Siegle brought up the T/A, and he characterized the problem as USAPA wanting to modify it, but the company has no power to do that. Siegle asked rhetorically what the company is supposed to do? Counter with another seniority proposal? They can't which means they're stuck if USAPA insists on non-Nicolau.

I know you want to go after the company because you have the illusion of damages and they have deeper pockets, but they will not be the ones doing you wrong(if wrong is done) it will be USAPA.

Tell the company's lawyer that, who by the way is the recognized expert in the area of Hybrid DFR. If anyone knows about an air carrier's potential liability from a Hybrid DFR suit, it's Seigle. If you were there yesterday you would have seen why the man is a top dollar attorney. He's impressive.

 

[Pi brat]

How's your day? We're doing great. No DOH and there will never be DOH. Look forward to many more months on LOA93 for you. Enjoy, and here comes the Nic!

I'm well, thanks for asking. I think you meant years, and enjoy your stagnation and lawyer payments. Do they give you a pilot/lawyer discount? Since, I'm sure they feel sorry for you.

 

[Metroyet]

This is one area where I think you guys leave the tracks. The company will not be colluding with USAPA, it will be negotiating with the legally elected CBA. The company fulfilled their obligations under the TA. Read it. They have done everything it says they will do, remember? They ACCEPTED the list.

I know you want to go after the company because you have the illusion of damages and they have deeper pockets, but they will not be the ones doing you wrong(if wrong is done) it will be USAPA.

Why don't you call Siegle and give him the good news!? According to you, he's worried about nothing. He only authored text books regarding labor law....you're an airline pilot. Call him. I'm sure he's be so relieved!!

 

[Freebird]

I'm not saying they are wrong because I don't know. I've heard all the web board lawyers say each other is wrong, but I don't know the law. What I'm saying is that IF any group is wrong, it would be USAPA and not the company. As always, IMO. I see collusion as the company saying to USAPA "psst....we will screw over the west guys in exchange for a low ball contract", not negotiating something, and even if that was the company's intent, I don't think they are stupid enough to do it in a way that AOL could catch them.

You dont know the difference between right and wrong?

Did the East and West agree to Binding Arbitration? Yes.
Is USAPA trying to get out of Binding Arbitration? Yes.
Is the East living up to their end of the agreement? No.

What part do you not understand? I havent said anything about collusion in my posts. That doesnt mean I dont see it as a possiblity. The right thing to do would be to honor your agreements rather than try anything to weasel out. Both sides went in knowing the outcome would be Final and Binding. What am I missing here?

USAPA = Only if it benefits the East.

 

[Freebird]

I'm well, thanks for asking. I think you meant years, and enjoy your stagnation and lawyer payments. Do they give you a pilot/lawyer discount? Since, I'm sure they feel sorry for you.

Even with stagnation, the West pilots make more than you and have days off to enjoy it. Are you getting paid for the WX cancellations back East? You guys are so desperate for DOH that you are missing the big picture. It will not be worth it in the end. You're wasting time.

USAPA = Going to have to go with the Nic. Sorry guys. We failed.

 

[nic4us]

What else would he say? He was only sitting in that courtroom because his boss, US Airways filed the DJ complaint. He had to attempt to justify it or there would be clear evidence that it was frivolous or an act of bad faith. He was doing his job. He wasn't going to argue against US Airways filing the complaint.

Who do you think told USAirways to file the complaint?

I am guessing it was the same lawyer (I think his name is actually on the filing) who stood in front of the judge yesterday and explained why the West will have the company's lunch if they come off the Nic.

Here in lies the east's problem. Every attorney who has looked at it says, the West has the company by the short hairs. The only lawyer who had a different plan was Lee...."psst..we can ditch Nic with a cost neutral DOH contract"....Seeham. Problem for Seeham's plan, the company ain't playing along with the lets renege because it will be good for us gang.