US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Black Swan]

Glad that you finally accepted the blame. It is usapa and the east that is to blame for the delay and the harm.

The HARM thing is really interesting. Kind of someone yelling FIRE in a theatre.If you say it, - you better be really prepared to prove it. So far your legal expertise has been entirely absent. The Addington deal was the first legal bluster, and blunder. I would be embarrassed to wear a badge backer to prove I was involved in it in any way, shape or form. RIPENESS took on an entirely different meaning to everybody involved. Harper is killing you guys.

 

[trevrep]

The 9th! We LOVE the 9th!!! The first in the TRIUMVERATE of DESTRUCTION to the DELUSIONAL WEST. The 9th destroyed the whacked WAKE. Th e 9th DESTROYED the Nicolau. THE SUPREME COURT buried the entire stinking pile of MANURE forever. The West and Boeing Boy still don't get it!!!

Wow it's amazing how that cheap wine makes one so smart isn't it?

Hahahaha.......no one and nothing destroyed the Wake. It's just not ripe. Ratify a contract without the NIC and it will be ripe...c ya in court after the injunction is filed the next day....and guess what Einstein? Ground hog day....love your LOA 93..it's not going nowhere if I can help it.

 

[trevrep]

The HARM thing is really interesting. Kind of someone yelling FIRE in a theatre.If you say it, - you better be really prepared to prove it. So far your legal expertise has been entirely absent. The Addington deal was the first legal bluster, and blunder. I would be embarrassed to wear a badge backer to prove I was involved in it in any way, shape or form. RIPENESS took on an entirely different meaning to everybody involved. Harper is killing you guys.

you my "friend" are full of keyboard BS.........

we have pilots who are furloughed that were hired before some of your guys who are working..is that not harm? Captains downgraded due to the shrinkage on the West to TA minimums...is that not Harm?

Harper is not killing us, he is keeping the scumbags running usapa from killing us......go ahead, ratify a contract without the NIC = injunction same day = nullifies your contract = guess what? Ground hog day....you must really love your LOA 93?

back to your peace pipe pal...

 

[nic4us]

Name another pilot group that changed representative agents, and therefore merger policy. You can't except this one. Emotions aside, tell me how the East failed to checkmate the west legally in this process. You can go on forever with your mantra of integrity, or whatever. The fact of the matter is you were checkmated, defeated legally, whatever you want to call it. Loophole. Big enough to drive a 330 through it, and you still can't comprehend that it happened, no matter how much you spend.

My unemotional answere,

You failed to change the representative agent prior to the publishing of the Nic.

As a matter of fact, one could conclude, you changed the agent because of the results of a binding arbitration.

Further, you fail to grasp even the simplest function and responsibility of a union, and instead try to twist the powers granted to organized labor to accomplish something that is in direct conflict with the reasons those powers are granted in the first place.

Checkmate? Hardly.

Stalemate? Maybe.

Loophole? More like sinkhole you are pouring our money down.

 

[nevergiveup]

My unemotional answere,

You failed to change the representative agent prior to the publishing of the Nic.

As a matter of fact, one could conclude, you changed the agent because of the results of a binding arbitration.

Further, you fail to grasp even the simplest function and responsibility of a union, and instead try to twist the powers granted to organized labor to accomplish something that is in direct conflict with the reasons those powers are granted in the first place.

Checkmate? Hardly.

Stalemate? Maybe.

Loophole? More like sinkhole you are pouring our money down.

In reality, the NIC has harmed the west more than it has the east. It's why we are where we are. Thank you, ALPA.

 

[East Hole]

you my "friend" are full of keyboard BS.........

we have pilots who are furloughed that were hired before some of your guys who are working..is that not harm? Captains downgraded due to the shrinkage on the West to TA minimums...is that not Harm?

Harper is not killing us, he is keeping the scumbags running usapa from killing us......go ahead, ratify a contract without the NIC = injunction same day = nullifies your contract = guess what? Ground hog day....you must really love your LOA 93?

back to your peace pipe pal...

Your second line there says it all. Furloughed pilots with more time than some pilots still working. Lets see now Nic says someone with 16.5 years and never furloughed at the time of the merger would be furloughed before someone with 1 year at the time of the merger. You should be outraged at the flawed Nic award. Who is the scumbag really. Just food for thought....

 

[Phoenix]

........

we have pilots who are furloughed that were hired before some of your guys who are working..is that not harm?

Only if DOH is the standard, and only if the lists are integrated.

........go ahead, ratify a contract without the NIC = injunction same day ..

Doubtful, since the 9th disallowed an injunction that was already in place that would require the Nic to be included in the next CBA. If the 9th believed that anything other than the Nic would cause an immediate injunction after ratification then they wouldn't have said the Nic wasn't necessary and they wouldn't have cited the SCOTUS standard of "wide range of reasonableness."

 

[trevrep]

In reality, the NIC has harmed the west more than it has the east. It's why we are where we are. Thank you, ALPA.

What orbit are you on?

The NIC has not harmed the WEST at all!! USAPA's stalling and manipulating...well that's another story.

 

[trevrep]

Your second line there says it all. Furloughed pilots with more time than some pilots still working. Lets see now Nic says someone with 16.5 years and never furloughed at the time of the merger would be furloughed before someone with 1 year at the time of the merger. You should be outraged at the flawed Nic award. Who is the scumbag really. Just food for thought....

Show me the guy on the nic award....name or any other ID...that has 16.5 years....never furloughed at the time of the merger....AND..who the guy is he's getting put junior to that has 1 years of service........can you do that? Or is this one of those myths?

You have to admit...looking at Delta/NWA merger and any merger of any size in recent times....NOBODY is going to use DOH.

So let's just say DOH is dead. Let's just say the NIC is dead.

What, in your mind/opinion then would be fair? LOS?

Fighting for DOH or NIC isn't working real well....the courts may decide someday.....costing us millions of attorney fees (similar to a divorce) and in the end after all our money spent and lost wages and benefits...where has all the infighting gotten us?

Welcome to one more day of "Ground Hog Day" 201

 

[FL430]

you my "friend" are full of keyboard BS.........

we have pilots who are furloughed that were hired before some of your guys who are working..is that not harm? Captains downgraded due to the shrinkage on the West to TA minimums...is that not Harm
?

Your fuloughed pilots were offered the new hire slots on the east - some declined, therefore hiring off the street. No harm here.

Captains downgraded due to downsizing Vegas. Good thing the east is allowing for 24% of your flying - they would be furloughed too if not for the east. No harm here. You brought the Vegas flying to this merger.

Harper is not killing us, he is keeping the scumbags running usapa from killing us......go ahead, ratify a contract without the NIC = injunction same day = nullifies your contract = guess what? Ground hog day....you must really love your LOA 93?

We dont need a new contract, with oil shooting back up it may most likely make PHX obsolete as well. Maybe Jetz can help you with a job?

 

[trevrep]

[/quote}

Doubtful, since the 9th disallowed an injunction that was already in place that would require the Nic to be included in the next CBA. If the 9th believed that anything other than the Nic would cause an immediate injunction after ratification then they wouldn't have said the Nic wasn't necessary and they wouldn't have cited the SCOTUS standard of "wide range of reasonableness."
[/quote]

If the case had been "ripe" in the courts eyes.....the 9th that is...the injunction would have stayed. Ratify a contract without the NIC and it will be up to the courts to decide if the injunction would be allowed or not, not you.
The 9th never said the NIC wasn't necessary.
What does the SCOTUS "wide range of reasonableness" have to do with DFRII injunction?

 

[oldiebutgoody]

Show me the guy on the nic award....name or any other ID...that has 16.5 years....never furloughed at the time of the merger....AND..who the guy is he's getting put junior to that has 1 years of service........can you do that? Or is this one of those myths?...

Not a myth. There are guys with 16.5, even 17 years, never furloughed East guys placed behind west guys with less than 6 months on the property. You'll have to look yourself, since it's frowned upon to put real names on this site, but it's a fact that the Nic did that.

Doesn't matter anymore. ALPA's bargaining position is no more.

 

[trevrep]

You added your response to my quote....makes it look like I said what your reply was.......

Nobody needs to help me with a job. I have my second and third incomes established...in business since 1973...too close to retirement...I'll be out of here in less than 3 years or less if this place craters. I'm around cause I like to fly. Not even here for the benefits...my health insurance is not from US Airways....

I really wish all US Airways pilots would get an industry contract.

But it won't happen with the current leaders driving USAPA. It just won't no matter how much we disagree, rant and rave, cuss each other out and do all the best name calling we know how to do.

This thing is so augured won in the courts that it's gonna be a long time till it's sorted out...I'll have forgotten about it by then....just playing my golf...and enjoying the grandkids.

I'm only on this board to aggravate of view of the narrow minded knuckleheads for entertainment purposes when I'm bored.

There's nothing to be gained on these boards.......other than pure entertainment. Or have we solved the big debate of is USAPA good for all US Airways pilots and the never ending DOH or NIC? Maybe I missed that. Could be.

Now out for some golfing today....going to be about 74 here in Phoenix and I've got a Tee time in about an hour.

Have a wonderful weekend web board maniacs! :blink:

 

[Phoenix]

...If the case had been "ripe" in the courts eyes.....the 9th that is...the injunction would have stayed. ..

Nothing in the 9th Opinion said anything remotely akin to that wishful thought.

... Ratify a contract without the NIC and it will be up to the courts to decide if the injunction would be allowed or not, not you.
..

Courts don't impose injunctions because a plaintiff has insufficient Kleenex.

..
The 9th never said the NIC wasn't necessary.

The 9th majority Opinion most certainly did.

..
What does the SCOTUS "wide range of reasonableness" have to do with DFRII injunction?

What did it have to do with DFR I ripeness? (Hint: DFR I ripeness, nothing. DFRII harm, everything.)

 

[cactusboy53]

Not a myth. There are guys with 16.5, even 17 years, never furloughed East guys placed behind west guys with less than 6 months on the property. You'll have to look yourself, since it's frowned upon to put real names on this site, but it's a fact that the Nic did that.

Doesn't matter anymore. ALPA's bargaining position is no more.

Gramps;
It's not personal, it is professional business. You & yours have attempted to dodge an agreement by simply changing the name of the "union". IMHO you will be made to comply, eventually (if not, then I assure you your just desserts in the final judgement). You may even have to pay damages to those people that you have harmed.

I looked at the list, I have read the list, I have read the findings & the court proceedings. You think it's unfair, that's your OPINION. I think the #1 AWA pilot should have bee #1 or #2 on the new list. It's my OPINION. I still must comply with the final & binding arbitration as delivered via the ALPA merger policy. You have won DELAY, and that is all. EVERYONE ELSE IN THIS INDUSTRY KNOWS EXACTLY WHO AND WHAT THE AWA pilots are dealing with. USAPA is the BLACK SMUDGE in commercial aviation. Pariah to be more precise.