US Pilots Labor Discussion

[767jetz]

Awfully passionate for someone that "claims" not to work for US Airways. If it walks like a duck....swims like a duck.....and quacks like a duck.....it must be an AOL lawyer.......ie a quack.

Passionate and right on the money. Why is it that every time one of us hits the nail on the head, you guys throw this conspiracy out there? I never understood this line of thinking.

What difference does it make? Why would he or I care if you believe we worked for Delta, United, America West, or Gulfstream International Airlines? Do you think that it would change what we say, believe or feel? Are you honestly that dense as to think that if you can't understand a person's passion or motivation then there can't possibly be a valid one? Are you so self absorbed to think that you live in a vacuum and no one else understands the facts, the turn of events, or what USAPA is all about?

Or could it be that when you don't have a good response it's just your nature to attack and redirect the conversation? How narcissistic of you. OK you win. Metroyet and I are both west captains. We were in new hire class together and neither of us could get a job at USAirways, since that was the only airline we applied to or ever wanted to work for. Feel better now? Great!, now how about addressing the facts that Metro mentioned and you conveniently avoided?

(sorry for spilling the beans Metro. )

 

[GuntherA320]

Passionate and right on the money. Why is it that every time one of us hits the nail on the head, you guys throw this conspiracy out there? I never understood this line of thinking.

What difference does it make? Why would he or I care if you believe we worked for Delta, United, America West, or Gulfstream International Airlines? Do you think that it would change what we say, believe or feel? Are you honestly that dense as to think that if you can't understand a person's passion or motivation then there can't possibly be a valid one? Are you so self absorbed to think that you live in a vacuum and no one else understands the facts, the turn of events, or what USAPA is all about?

Or could it be that when you don't have a good response it's just your nature to attack and redirect the conversation? How narcissistic of you. OK you win. Metroyet and I are both west captains. We were in new hire class together and neither of us could get a job at USAirways, since that was the only airline we applied to or ever wanted to work for. Feel better now? Great!, now how about addressing the facts that Metro mentioned and you conveniently avoided?

The fact is......neither you or Metro would be as passionate about this internal union dispute if you didn't have something invested in it. Even Bong Boy had something invested in US Airways. Both of you are closer to this than you will admit. No one spends as much time as you two do on thisboard if you don't have a vested interest. I'm glad I just pass by these boards. You guys are truly pathetic if you don't have a vested interest and you spend this much time here. Get a life....spend some time with your wife, husband, kids, dog, or whatever. Your opinions will not change anything. Let me make this clear.....you have the right to an opinion. You even have the right to free speech (1st Amendment). If you work for United....whoopy for you. If metroyet works for whoever whoopy for him/her. You have both made your opinions known. Some people agree with you. Some people don't. By constantly spending endless hours on this bulletin board you have to admit that most competent people would make the connection that you have something to gain out of this dispute. Otherwise you would be spending time with your family, friends, dog, or maybe you're a cat person. Who knows. Both of you are very vehement in your opinion. You have to admit that. If you didn't have something to gain, you wouldn't be here. If you don't have something to gain and you spend this much time here.......well that just makes you an idiot. I'm outta here to spend some time out in the real world!

 

[Zone5]

All this theorizing makes my head spin, making sense of things is tough. Looks like Scotus is out, and I doubt anyone would be shocked if the DJ is tossed. If that's the case, I think if the company wants to delay, all they have to do is balk at usapa's section 22 proposal. There you go, instant delay for God knows how long. I'm not sure the mediator would be much help for usapa, what is she going to do, tell the company they need to break all the agreements and give usapa what it wants? I can't really see that happening.

Who knows.

All the more reason for everyone to pull for LOA 93 going the pilots way. The company would then be more inclined and motivated to conclude a new contract, which could be structured to trade off some of the pay rate for across the board quality of life improvements.

Baring that, the company could indeed stall things to the point of the mediator releasing both sides for self-help. A Chaos approach might do the trick in that case. Assuming anyone could tell Chaos from normal operations!

Until the JCBA process is completed one way or another the next round of "ripe" DFRs cannot commence. At least so says the 9th Court of Appeals.

seajay

 

[sumadarson]

And you're too dumb to realize who you're talking to. At UA we have always had an A fund (DBP, ie: pension), AND a B fund (DCP or 401K). The company puts a negotiated % into our B fund above and beyond our salary without our having to contribute a dime. We can also contribute to the B fund up to the legal limits. Since UA's BK and the distressed termination of our A fund, the B fund % has gone up and a C fund has also been negotiated. In all, 16% ADDITIONAL money goes into our combined B & C fund, in addition to anything I choose to contribute. That was negotiated in BK to replace the pension. Look at what Delta did when they terminated the A fund.

You are obviously blinded by your bitterness, anger and fear, as are most of your east cohorts on this forum. You have no one to blame for your situation than yourselves. But you hold everyone else hostage in the mean time, which is where the damages to the west will come in. At my age of hire with UA, I would have had over 32 years (37 years now) when I retire off the 747 left seat. If the pension was not terminated I would have had close to 200K per year from my DBP based on the last formula. So don't preach to me about not knowing about such an animal.

ua pilots

 

[FL430]

The West has absolutely, positively, NOTHING to be scared of in a Federal Court room. Nothing. Let me hit you with a little factoid:

4 Federal Judges have looked at this case. 2 of them vehemently voiced their opinions that USAPA was clearly violating the West Pilots rights. The other two, decided not to opine beyond stating that ripeness was an issue. That's it.

You don't have a absolute "right" to a ratified contract. The courts could care less if you guys ever vote for an improved contract. USAPA's DFR to all pilots is not subordinate to ANYTHING. You're not going to change the rules and dictate to the minority what you think is "fair". Lee $e$ham lied to you and you dumb MF'ers believed him. The West will fund a legal War with you parasites to the last man standing. If the company balks one iota on the Nic. award, we're going after them with both barrels as well. They know that without question and they are rightfully scared of AOL. The West isn't violating the law, you are. We have nothing to fear. You made your LOA93 in perpetuity bed, now you can sleep in it. Use those food stamps for a blanket for all I care.

Do the feds still give free cheese to the Poor? I wouldn't know.

You are letting fear cloud your judgement -- you said previously you didnt work here! Are you a new hire? lol

 

[AWA320]

Jet jock1 said,

Sorry to spoil your party. I llive in the Napa Valley( since 84') ahh, where were you, own 38 acres and have an operating winery and label. Hey,give me youre address and I'll send you a bottle....on me and my measly 401k that's only been funded for 6 years. Hey, boy, hope you stay in shape and make it to retirement. Maybe then, you'll be able to compare asset value. Good luck with that




So your plan is to attempt to compare portfolio's? I dont think you really want to go there! I own a successfull business as well and without going into detail, about who I am and what it is I do, I can tell you that I dont need usair!! I dont much care for wine but my wife does so you can send her a bottle.

AWA320

 

[mikey60]

Jet jock1 said,

Sorry to spoil your party. I llive in the Napa Valley( since 84') ahh, where were you, own 38 acres and have an operating winery and label. Hey,give me youre address and I'll send you a bottle....on me and my measly 401k that's only been funded for 6 years. Hey, boy, hope you stay in shape and make it to retirement. Maybe then, you'll be able to compare asset value. Good luck with that




So your plan is to attempt to compare portfolio's? I dont think you really want to go there! I own a successfull business as well and without going into detail, about who I am and what it is I do, I can tell you that I dont need usair!! I dont much care for wine but my wife does so you can send her a bottle.

AWA320

Reading your bullsh## I can see why your wife drinks,Jetjock why dont you send her a case she deserves it. Now I wasnt going to ask but I have to, whats the business. Really picking soda and beer cans up cant be called a business and I guess thats how you got that " cough cough" portfolio. You can leave now awa319, someone dropped a can on state route 320. Oh by the way hurry and answer this, I have to work tomorrow and I like to have something to laugh about.

 

[nic4us]

Hey, rocket scientist...aren't you a little scared that if this thing somehow goes back to the 9th that they will go back and read their own opinion....PLUS
their reasoning. If not,you should be!!

NICDOA
NPJB

Having a BS degree in "rocket scientry" and a certificate of achievement for my work in chemically induced ballistics, I feel I can give you an authoritative answere to that question.

The West is not scared in the least.

I would think usapa will be peeing their "we can steal West seniority with a cost neutral DOH contract" pants if we end up in front of the 9th again, while they face down the "damages plaintiffs fear".

 

[nic4us]

I was asked a while back to entertain the board and offer my thoughts on the "position the West is in".

I forgot who asked and wanted to reply but ran out of time, as there were other more pressing post that needed replies. However, after wasting my time and posting those replies(some of which seem to have been removed) I will now offer my thoughts on the position the West is in.

A piss poor one.

The West is tied to a group whose word is untruthful. Conscripted to an organization whose intent is to harm. The West has little or no influence on the advancement of the pilot group, cannot participate in contract negotiations, has our contract violated with no effective grievence process in place. The list of bull the West has had to endure because the east fell for the scumbag union busting lawyers bs of how he could help you renege on binding arbitration is getting quite long.

However, there are three very bright sides to the West's position. One, we have collectively kicked usapa in the butt (next up the crotch, then the teeth). Two, we exert more pressure on the company with our threat of litigation, than usapa can as the bargaining agent. That is why the usapa experiment of reneging on binding arbitration is doomed to fail. Three, the West is in the position on being right. Right with the law, right with the method, right with the company.

To sum, and for the umpteenth time, usapa will never get DOH at LCC. The position the West is in guarantees that.

 

[sumadarson]

I would think usapa will be peeing their "we can steal West seniority with a cost neutral DOH contract" pants if we end up in front of the 9th again, while they face down the "damages plaintiffs fear".

The 9th Circuit Court ruling

You lost, get over it. Time to move on to an industry leading contract for all Usairways pilots.

 

[nic4us]

The 9th Circuit Court ruling

You lost, get over it. Time to move on to an industry leading contract for all Usairways pilots.

I am over the 9th opinion, but appearantly the company is not, and the SCOTUS may not be either.

So actually, it is way past time to move on to an industry leading contract.

It is now time to move on to a industry standard, Nic inclusive contract, with a repayment plan for the West pilots who had to endure the damages caused by the east pilots reneging on their contractual obligations.



On a bright note, met some new hires while they toured the PHX crew room. I was not aware that 190 indoc happened in PHX. Also, heard rumors that a 330 sim is coming to the PHX training center. any truth to that?

 

[AWA320]

Reading your bullsh## I can see why your wife drinks,Jetjock why dont you send her a case she deserves it. Now I wasnt going to ask but I have to, whats the business. Really picking soda and beer cans up cant be called a business and I guess thats how you got that " cough cough" portfolio. You can leave now awa319, someone dropped a can on state route 320. Oh by the way hurry and answer this, I have to work tomorrow and I like to have something to laugh about.

That was tooo funny!! OMG I am laughing so hard I can hardly stand it. Tell me, is you paycheck under LOA 93 just as funny?? How does it feel to see that Horizon RJ70 captains make as much as the east captains?? Still laughing, I AM! Oh an for the record I said my wife likes wine not that she drinks it regularly. BTW was that your wife I had drinks with tonight in Philly? She said she was a married to low paid limp noodle from the east so I assumed it was either you or clueless as butter oldie.

Batteries plus!! Do your research...

AWA320

 

[767jetz]

The fact is......neither you or Metro would be as passionate about this internal union dispute if you didn't have something invested in it.

Yes, we know. You have it all figured out. I already told you we are both west captains who couldn't get a job on the east. Now, care to address the facts that Metro mentioned, or do you still feel like going in circles?

I thought so...

 

[AWA320]

The 9th Circuit Court ruling

You lost, get over it. Time to move on to an industry leading contract for all Usairways pilots.

I am so with you on that. lets move on to an industry leading contract that way the nic gets implimented. Lets get it done.

AWA320

 

[767jetz]

That was tooo funny!! OMG I am laughing so hard I can hardly stand it. Tell me, is you paycheck under LOA 93 just as funny?? How does it feel to see that Horizon RJ70 captains make as much as the east captains?? Still laughing, I AM! Oh an for the record I said my wife likes wine not that she drinks it regularly. BTW was that your wife I had drinks with tonight in Philly? She said she was a married to low paid limp noodle from the east so I assumed it was either you or clueless as butter oldie.

Batteries plus!! Do your research...

AWA320

Hey 320, these guys are a laugh a minute. From the tone of their spin I can tell they are scared of what's coming in 2011. Keep the pressure on!

Awesome business, by the way. Had several of the same in the family until recently, in Virgina. You'll have to pm me some details of your region.

Cheers!