Shhhhhh. Excuse me, we are trying to read factual information. Your cherry picking sentences are disturbing the readers ability to form their own opinion.
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US Pilots Labor Discussion 8/11- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES
- Thread starter Richard
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Notsofast,
Thanks for the links, I found more on you tube. What a crock of unfactual BS usapa put out there. An eight part rant of angry lies and whinning.
Kind of liked the background music, who composed and performed that? I heard it was a new band called Jack Stephan and the whinners (video #1). Is that really the former MEC chairman in a usapa video, spouting a bunch of bull about how the arbitrator was misguided, and everyone had all this misinformation, and that only the east mec knows how to put a seniority list together? I thought you guys ditched all the ALPA baggage. No wait, I knew Stephan was still around, he made some questionable remarks on the witness stand about how the arbitrated award would only be "binding" on the merrger committee members and not the pilot group.
These videos make usapa look like a bunch of schmuks.
I realy no longer care who saved who, how many days you were from liquidation, whether or not you were unemployed and want my captain seat. Bottom line, there is an arbitrated seniority award at LCC. It will be implemented upon contract ratification. Live with it or leave.
PS. Saw that usapa put the DOH list back on their website. That is the only place that list will ever be published.
Thanks for the links, I found more on you tube. What a crock of unfactual BS usapa put out there. An eight part rant of angry lies and whinning.
Kind of liked the background music, who composed and performed that? I heard it was a new band called Jack Stephan and the whinners (video #1). Is that really the former MEC chairman in a usapa video, spouting a bunch of bull about how the arbitrator was misguided, and everyone had all this misinformation, and that only the east mec knows how to put a seniority list together? I thought you guys ditched all the ALPA baggage. No wait, I knew Stephan was still around, he made some questionable remarks on the witness stand about how the arbitrated award would only be "binding" on the merrger committee members and not the pilot group.
These videos make usapa look like a bunch of schmuks.
I realy no longer care who saved who, how many days you were from liquidation, whether or not you were unemployed and want my captain seat. Bottom line, there is an arbitrated seniority award at LCC. It will be implemented upon contract ratification. Live with it or leave.
PS. Saw that usapa put the DOH list back on their website. That is the only place that list will ever be published.
I love the unfactual words they put in Mr Parkers mouth. These USAPA guys are good.
Now that is funny.
Once again Cleardirect post a very sound, reasoned reply, backed up with facts, and all he will get from the east posters is, "hey quit throwing water on my wet dream".
You are going to have to come up with some facts that are actually pertinent, and of course they would actually have to be facts. Until then, keep posting the links to the whinner videos of falsehoods. You might convince more readers, of something, I am not sure what, but you will convince them alright.
I would never accuse Mr. Parker of lying. In the video he said he believed absent the merger AWA would have probably had to file bankrupcy. So what is usapa's point? Mr Parker has also said that absent the merger AAA would have "liquidated". Mr parker has also said that we had no time to wait for a joint contract and an integrated list because AAA would have "liquidated".
Mr Nicolau, as Cleardirect just posted, was aware of the financial conditions of the two companies, and accurately described the situation.
You see, in everybody's opinion except usapa's, a solvent company that "may have to file bankrupcy", is in much better condition than a bankrupt company that would have "liquidated". The BS they put in the videos clearly says that Mr Nicolau was wrong, the east was in better condition than the West.
usapa is good alright, good at lying, cheating, stealing.
BoeingBoy
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Selective "facts". Where are the instances of Parker saying that "old" US would have liquidated absent the merger? Is that little fact not as pertinent as what would have happened to HP?
Too few on the East side fail to recognize three things:
1 - The corporation called US Airways was not the same corporation that was in bankruptcy. There was a new corporate charter, a new corporate structure, and new corporate executive structure.
2 - Parker said whatever he needed to say to the different pilot groups. He has said everything from US would have liquidated while HP would have faced a cash crunch to both companies needed the merger to survive.
3 - Nic dealt with the situation as it existed when the merger was announced, as per ALPA merger policy. Without using such a "snapshot", look at all the variations that have occured at both US and HP over the last 30 years. US (including it's predecessor airlines) went from flying nothing bigger than 727's domestically (including Canada) to having widebodies flying trans-Atlantic. HP went from an idea to flying the 747 across the Pacafic. Pilots at both have seen the ups and downs, from quick upgrades to furloughs. Even USAPA uses a snapshot for it's C&R's, just one more favorable for the East but one that is unrelated to the merger.
Jim
And without huge pay cuts the east pilots took (not the west) this merged airline would not have been viable from start. There is always more than one way to look at any issue......
Metroyet
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767jetz
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You're right. Without those concessions the old USAirways would certainly have liquidated long before. Meaning your job and employer would have been gone, all of you would have been starting over somewhere else or not at all, and someone would have bought up the pieces left over. So good for you for keeping your head above water until a rescue ship arrived!
Unfortunately your assertion above doesn't help the argument of other east pilots who claim there is no way "they" (whoever they are) would let US fail under any circumstances. Remember? There was too much cash flow and lease deals to let it fail, right? And if that's the case I guess those concessions were unnecessary and should not count for anything since it was done out of the goodness of your hearts. A gift to the shareholders and executives I guess.
So which is it? Your old airline would have not survived without the huge pay cuts? Or no way "they" would let the airline liquidate? You guys love to try to have it both ways depending on the argument of the day.
No sweat, Ace. What WAS your point?
Driver B)
Go back and read the original post. It's not rocket science.
I thought it was TWO billion! Oh well, what's a billion give or take.
Driver B)
A billion here, a billion there. Pretty soon you'll be talking about some serious cash. Yep, US Airways was the powerhouse and AWA the little wannabe airline.
Yes. What Parker says at an alpa dinner to placate his new employees differs significantly from the financial facts at the time. Nicolau used the published financials to help make his decision. Go figure.
So your point is that if you didn't take the pay cuts US Airways would not have been around to "merge" with. So what? You did what you had to do to keep your job at that time. When you voted for the pay cut was a "merger" with AWA presented to motivate you to do so? No. Self preservation at the time, nothing more.
Don't take this the wrong way but had US Airways liquidated the rest of the industry would have benefitted enormously, including AWA. Rather than facing that reality and being thankful you guys just keep urinating into the wind in an attempt to regain what you believe you are entitled to.
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