US Pilots Labor Discussion 2/17- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[Black Swan]

I'd love the BBQ but not interested in NASCAR. Formula 1 is more my taste. I think we'd be much happier living in either New Hope or the Mainline PA.

You guys have a great day. I've got to go and make the donuts. Maybe see you tonight. Before I go, Clear. Thanks. My response to you brought me a new status level for postings. My wife isn't too happy about that.

 

[cleardirect]

Just like me and Freebird have been in some near misses on the track, until the damage is done, and he hits me or I hit him do we get to jump out of our rides and duke it out. A nasty skid doesn't rate.

You said that it was an internal union matter I asked nothing about damages. Transition agreement has nothing to do with damages. Third try care to be mature and answer the questions?

If a DFR is an internal union matter how are there federal DFR cases to cite? Rakestraw, Ramey, truck drivers, ect.

Do you consider the transition agreement to be a contract?

 

[Freebird]

They absolutely cannot do that without your permission. But, go wade through those closing documents and you will find that you gave them that permission when you signed the mortgage agreement.

NYCBusdriver,

You're catching on. Just like when you entered Binding Arbitration, you allowed the Arbitrator the authority to settle this dispute. Good Point !!!

Repeat...AAA MEC Gave Nicolau permission to Arbitrate a seniority list under BINDING ARBITRATION. Its over.

 

[cleardirect]

Callaway,

USAPA is flush with cash and we in the east love the union. Mike Cleary is our supreme leader!

Standing just a little bit too close to the Kool-Aid. Isn’t this the same thing that happened when you were with ALPA? Blindly following and believing whatever your union leadership tells you. How about asking a couple of questions? USAPA has made a lot of promises, do a checklist and find out how many have been kept.

The 9th probably realized early on that Wake was in way over his head. Can you say expedited.

History lesson. This case started out as an injunction case. That is the reason that judge Wake took it so fast he say the damages that the furloughs were taking. It then progressed through the court very quickly. The ninth took it on an expedited manner for whatever reason they had. What would be an expedited answer? One month two months three months? If the court saw a problem with judge Wake where is the expedited stay of the injunction?

Man, I hope you guys get some help if this doesn't go your way. You sound very angry.

The only thing that we are angry about is the unprofessional behavior from some of you guys. That because of your entitlement attitude and lack of integrity it is costing all of us money. Besides, who was it that lost their minds when Nicolau was first announced? It was equated to the assasination of Kennedy.

Doug is probably going to sell the west off to Republic.

This really is the funny part. If you were so confident that you were going to win in the ninth then you would get DOH. DOH places 80% of the west below the east furloughs. You guys should be praying that Parker keeps us together so you have of us junior to you and protecting you from furlough and able to get all of the upgrades. It appears to me that you all are sure that you are going to lose in the ninth and the only way to get out of the Nicolau is a re-do. But good luck with that. Why would you want to get rid of us?

The east operation is the most valuable asset.

I have asked multiple times where the proof of that statement is. Any SEC or corporate statement that back up your bold assertion?

Cactus 18...........who cares? We offered to talk.............the rest is up to the legal scholars out west.

Talking and making a valid offer are two different things.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Perhaps Bradford, Cleary and the ardent supporters of USAPA could take a long, hard introspective look at Tiger Wood’s statement and be moved to make the same. Imagine the unity that could come if the simply said:

Now every one of you has good reason to be critical of me. I want to say to each of you, simply and directly, I am deeply sorry for my irresponsible and selfish behavior I engaged in.

The issue involved here was my repeated irresponsible behavior... What I did is not acceptable, and I am the only person to blame.

I stopped living by the core values that I was taught to believe in. I knew my actions were wrong, but I convinced myself that normal rules didn't apply. I never thought about who I was hurting. Instead, I thought only about myself. I ran straight through the boundaries. I thought I could get away with whatever I wanted to. I felt that I had worked hard my entire life and deserved to enjoy all the temptations around me. I felt I was entitled.

I was wrong. I was foolish. I don't get to play by different rules. The same boundaries that apply to everyone apply to me. I brought this shame on myself.

I've had a lot of time to think about what I've done. My failures have made me look at myself in a way I never wanted to before. It's now up to me to make amends, and that starts by never repeating the mistakes I've made. It's up to me to start living a life of integrity.

I once heard, and I believe it's true, it's not what you achieve in life that matters; it's what you overcome... Character and decency are what really count.

Parents used to point to me as a role model for their kids. I owe all those families a special apology. I want to say to them that I am truly sorry.

It's hard to admit that I need help, but I do.

I recognize I have brought this on myself, and I know above all I am the one who needs to change. I owe it to my family to become a better person. I owe it to those closest to me to become a better man. That's where my focus will be.

I ask you to find room in your heart to one day believe in me again.

Well done Tiger. Stephen, Mike are you up to the task? Do you have the moral foundation to admit you need to do some serious work on your character and integrity?

 

[EastUS]

The only thing that we are angry about is the unprofessional behavior from some of you guys. That because of your entitlement attitude and lack of integrity .....

Is that possibly in reference to the westies denying east people jumpseats? After a few west folks posted that they too would never deny any from the east a jumpseat, as I neither then nor will ever refuse any of yours professionally cordial transport, Well...I tested the waters and found myself denied, with a very satisfied smirk from the "captain" I might add. After that spiritually enlightening experience....well...suffice it to say that I lost any and all possible residual sympathy for the west's "Integrity"-laden position, and as for "unprofessional behavior"?....You folks have set the bar as low as is possible with such as the jumpseat antics/public video and other tantrums....Even borrowing from a west supporter's postings = "High School pranks".....

I've long wondered though; Where did/do you guys get this bizarre and utterly childish fantasy that some arbitrator can magically bestow "Integrity" on anyone?...much less any entire group? Did Nic/Wake/whomever have you all kneel and Knight you enmasse or something? Was it perhaps a mass blessing from the Vatican?...or at least some group sweat lodge and peyote ritual? Seriously; If your side ever seeks real credibility at any level; you would do well to present yourselves in a less preposterous light.

 

[EastUS]

Perhaps Bradford, Cleary and the ardent supporters of USAPA could take a long, hard introspective look at Tiger Wood’s statement and be moved to make the same.

I see you've a golf club at the ready! OK! OK!....Mea culpa! I confess it all!....Just keep away from my windows!

 

[EastUS]

Well done Tiger. Stephen, Mike are you up to the task? Do you have the moral foundation to admit you need to do some serious work on your character and integrity?

Ummm.... "Well done Tiger"???? Ummm again...Do I actually have this right? According to you; Mr. Woods nowadays has suddenly/magically/instantly developed a "moral foundation"? :blink: Man...it must be really easy and an immediate process to obtain such then??? Waitta' minute!...AH!...NOW I finally understand the west's so easilly obtaining instant "Integrity" via some arbitrator's whim. Thanks for the inadvertant explanation of the thought processes involved.

 

[Freebird]

B.S.

The '79 Granada is for the derby. Im building a Rat Rod for the next step in my racin' career. I'd like to buy a better car but Usapa is keeping my funds low. At least the rent is cheap in Gastonia.

When the Rat Rod is up and runnin' we should drag race down to Shelby for some BBQ. Just for fun though, cause I know if I beat you in the race, you'd have a hard time paying up.

Not because you dont have the money. Instead, because you'd argue that you won, and you'd probably try to sue my sponsors.

 

[EastUS]

I think usapa has about 5 defendants phone numbers tied to "jamming organizational phone lines", .....

Let's assume, purely for the sake of argument, that said five are the only ones uncontestably proven to have done such. Let's further assume (again, only for the sake of argument), that the west properly pride themselves on their clearly established "Integrity". Well....What do you feel should be done about the five?

 

[cleardirect]

Is that possibly in reference to the westies denying east people jumpseats? After a few west folks posted that they too would never deny any from the east a jumpseat, as I neither then nor will ever refuse any of yours professionally cordial transport, Well...I tested the waters and found myself denied, with a very satisfied smirk from the "captain" I might add. After that spiritually enlightening experience....well...suffice it to say that I lost any and all possible residual sympathy for the west's "Integrity"-laden position, and as for "unprofessional behavior"?....You folks have set the bar as low as is possible with such as the jumpseat antics/public video and other tantrums/etc.

I've long wondered though; Where did/do you guys get this bizarre and utterly childish fantasy that some arbitrator can magically bestow "Integrity" on anyone?...much less any entire group? Did Nic/Wake/whomever have you all kneel and knight you enmasse or something? Was it perhaps a mass blessing from the Vatican?...or even some group sweat lodge and peyote ritual? Seriously; If your side ever seeks real credibility at any level; you would do well to present yourselves in a less preposterous light.

So we are back to the JS issue. I have not heard of anyone being denied or dening a JS in a very long time. Perhaps it is just you. Maybe it is your attitude when you approach the captain.

Nicolau had nothing to do with bestowing integrity. It has to do with how you react after things do not go your way. Did you observe the reaction when we lost the Suzie arbitration? Not name calling, no crying just acceptance.

Let us see who has integrity when the ninth rules.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

Is that possibly in reference to the westies denying east people jumpseats? After a few west folks posted that they too would never deny any from the east a jumpseat, as I neither then nor will ever refuse any of yours professionally cordial transport, Well...I tested the waters and found myself denied, with a very satisfied smirk from the "captain" I might add. After that spiritually enlightening experience....well...suffice it to say that I lost any and all possible residual sympathy for the west's "Integrity"-laden position, and as for "unprofessional behavior"?....You folks have set the bar as low as is possible with such as the jumpseat antics/public video and other tantrums....Even borrowing from a west supporter's postings = "High School pranks".....

I've long wondered though; Where did/do you guys get this bizarre and utterly childish fantasy that some arbitrator can magically bestow "Integrity" on anyone?...much less any entire group? Did Nic/Wake/whomever have you all kneel and knight you enmasse or something? Was it perhaps a mass blessing from the Vatican?...or even some group sweat lodge and peyote ritual? Seriously; If your side ever seeks real credibility at any level; you would do well to present yourselves in a less preposterous light.

Integrity comes from living up to your promise of binding arbitration. You can't just pick and chose what you like and don't like after signing on for binding arbitration. Denying jumpseats is bad, I am against it, but denying the entire company of getting this merger done is reprehensible.

 

[CallawayGolf]

Ummm.... "Well done Tiger"???? Ummm again...Do I actually have this right? According to you; Mr. Woods nowadays has suddenly/magically/instantly developed a "moral foundation"? :blink: Man...it must be really easy and an immediate process to obtain such then??? Waitta' minute!...AH!...NOW I finally understand the west's so easilly obtaining instant "Integrity" via some arbitrator's whim. Thanks for the inadvertant explanation of the thought processes involved.

It might help if you actually read the post before replying to it. Neither Mr. Woods nor I claimed that he suddenly has integrity. Quite the opposite - so ummm, wait a minute - no you didn't get it right.

What he did was to unequivocally confess to substantial moral flaws in his behavior and in his thinking. Of course he spent three months in a rehabilitation clinic to come to the point where he could admit what the rest of the world knew the instant the news broke concerning his affairs. IT WAS WRONG! So, that's what he did right so far today. Perhaps some USAPA leaders and their supporters could enroll in an intensive, locked-in character rehabilitation and extreme narcissism program so that they too could know the joy of coming clean by publically admitting their substantial moral failings and duties related to the pilots of US Airways. Everyone else knows where USAPA lies on the morality/integrity scale, but Bradford, Cleary and gang haven’t had the courage to admit it yet. :down:

 

[nycbusdriver]

...Almost like a union suing your own pilots for, even if all allegations are true, what amount to high school pranks. There is no reason on Earth why this lawsuit should have ever been filed, much less continue to be prosecuted. ...

I agree. Had the defendants stopped the high school pranks when asked nicely (several times,) there would have been no Cactus 18. But NOOOOOOO! "We're going to show those east pilots they can't have a union we don't like, so let's just ignore the official requests to cease and desist, then see how they like that! What are they going to do? Take us to court?"

 

[EastUS]

So we are back to the JS issue. I have not heard of anyone being denied or dening a JS in a very long time. Perhaps it is just you. Maybe it is your attitude when you approach the captain.

Nicolau had nothing to do with bestowing integrity. It has to do with how you react after things do not go your way. Did you observe the reaction when we lost the Suzie arbitration? Not name calling, no crying just acceptance.

Let us see who has integrity when the ninth rules.

1) Nice try. Conversation (with hand shake included) progressed no further than your "captain's" inquiry = "Where are you from?" at which point I was denied. It's most telling though, that you assume some particular "attitude" should be appropriate though. Not to worry, as I've no such requirements for any I'll host.

2) Nic sure didn't bestow any "integrity". We can agree there unconditionally. "It has to do with how you react after things don't go your way". Uh Huh/OK..so...the west reaction to USAPA's inception and the east's firmly held position since, has resulted in "Not name calling, no crying just acceptance" lout west?

3) Ah!...I see that, despite your protestations to the contrary, that "Integrity" will indeed be just a product of arbitrator whims and/or courtroom proceedings?