US Pilots Labor Discussion 1/6- OBSERVE THE RULES OF THE BOARD!

[Barrister]

Read closely what he wrote.

You are correct my bad. Plus what part of seat protection do you not get. How many East F/os would commute to PHX versus how many West F/Os would comute east for a wide body slot. No comparison. You have what you have until there is a joint contract.

VNIIMN
NPJB

 

[cleardirect]

You are correct my bad. Plus what part of seat protection do you not get. How many East F/os would commute to PHX versus how many West F/Os would comute east for a wide body slot. No comparison. You have what you have until there is a joint contract.

VNIIMN
NPJB

Just how many of those oh so desired F/O WB spots are there?

At a 2 east to 1 west ratio just how many spots are available to the west? How many west pilots do you think want to go east?

How many captain spots are out west? How many east captains and 2-1 ratio F/O want to move to PHX?

So lets see maybe 300 total F/O spot 2-1 leaves a max of 100 west pilots that would want to commute to fly all nighters. As opposed to a lot more captain openings out west. Who is going to get the short end of this deal?

It is time to start thinking about the facts not the fear.

Make an effort and ask a west crew the next time you see them. How many want to move or commute to the east coast. you are going to find very few.

 

[HPDriver]

You are correct my bad. Plus what part of seat protection do you not get. How many East F/os would commute to PHX versus how many West F/Os would comute east for a wide body slot. No comparison. You have what you have until there is a joint contract.

VNIIMN
NPJB

You'd have more east pilots coming west then the other way around.

We don't stovepipe bid over hear like you guys do. We don't chase seats. Yes, you'll have some west guys going east, but really only those that live out there. Not too many of us care about the wide body flying or commuting across country for a junior Captain position.

I'm guessing between 75 and 100 at most.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Yes, that's EXACTLY was Prater was thinking.

That I know for a FACT.

VNIIMNBIWMBMOYWVFTM

The only possible way that can be true is if you are, in fact, John Prater? Are you?

If not, WRONG (yet again.)

 

[nycbusdriver]

Interesting evolution going on here. This is an open forum but when an outsider neutral disagrees with the east position then that outsider just doesn't understand and has no right to talk and they are wrong (Nicolau, Wake, the jury, maybe the Ninth, Delta pilots, ect).

Is this anything like the east pilots bringing up the Baptiste & Wilder RLA blog and the west pilots immediately attacking that pretigious law firm for disagreeing with them and Judge Wake?

Pot, meet Kettle.

 

[HPDriver]

The only possible way that can be true is if you are, in fact, John Prater? Are you?

If not, WRONG (yet again.)

Nope.

Usually never wrong to begin with and I'm spot on with this.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Nope.

Usually never wrong to begin with and I'm spot on with this.

I reiterate:

Unless you are John Prater, it is humanly impossible to know "for a fact" anything the man is thinking. Ever.

Even if he tells you personally what he is thinking, there is no way for you to judge the truth or falsehood of his statement. Prater is a politician, and my experience is that politicians rarely say what they REALLY think....to anybody.

 

[HPDriver]

Even if he tells you personally what he is thinking, there is no way for you to judge the truth or falsehood of his statement.

Oh come on.

You guys jumped up and down for DOH, tell ALPA and Nicolau its "DOH all the way" and then don't get it. National new well before Nic came out with the list that there was going to be a meltdown out east if it was anything less than DOH.

And it wasn't just Prater - it was every single National Officer, including Bebee.

 

[goneflyin]

Ok Gone Flying lets see if you got any skin in the game. Since you don't belong to any of the 2 groups and this is the U board what is your DAL hire date and what is the hire date of the NW guy just below and above you. Ante up or get out of the game. And answer the original question: What would be happening to your company right now if your guys lost 10-15-20 years, simple question and I'll bet you won't answer. The Q ain't where is the 17 year guy as much as where is the NEW HIRE!! Plus don't forget we recalled 500 guys before NIC was decided. So much for snapshots. PS we won't forget that your CEO was on records that your recovery plan was based on U going out of business. How is that going!! Last I looked your merger ain't exactly paying off.

VNIIMN

Tell ya what-- I'll post whenever I feel like it. I do read this board from time to time; I started during Doug Parker's attempt to buy Delta. Now it's my version of watching Jerry Springer--

FWIW, if I worked for a company where, after 17 years, I was still junior, I would be gone in search of greener pastures. If, for whatever reason, I stayed at that struggling company, my expectations would be fairly low in the event of a seniority merger.

For your reference, I was hired by Delta in 1987, and am a 777 captain. The former NWA guys on either side of me were hired in 1984, and are 747 or A330 captains. (Note: the hire date of the NWA guys on either side of me is irrelevant. What equipment they're on is what matters.)

As to the success of our merger, look again. Most of us are pretty happy with it. We just had a system-wide bid. Since our seniority was fairly integrated, there was no wholesale displacement of either former DAL or former NWA pilots, despite having only a couple of C&Rs on our SLI.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Oh come on.

You guys jumped up and down for DOH, tell ALPA and Nicolau its "DOH all the way" and then don't get it. National new well before Nic came out with the list that there was going to be a meltdown out east if it was anything less than DOH.

And it wasn't just Prater - it was every single National Officer, including Bebee.

What does that answer have to do with your ability to read Prater's mind?

 

[Barrister]

Tell ya what-- I'll post whenever I feel like it. I do read this board from time to time; I started during Doug Parker's attempt to buy Delta. Now it's my version of watching Jerry Springer--

FWIW, if I worked for a company where, after 17 years, I was still junior, I would be gone in search of greener pastures. If, for whatever reason, I stayed at that struggling company, my expectations would be fairly low in the event of a seniority merger.

For your reference, I was hired by Delta in 1987, and am a 777 captain. The former NWA guys on either side of me were hired in 1984, and are 747 or A330 captains. (Note: the hire date of the NWA guys on either side of me is irrelevant. What equipment they're on is what matters.)

As to the success of our merger, look again. Most of us are pretty happy with it. We just had a system-wide bid. Since our seniority was fairly integrated, there was no wholesale displacement of either former DAL or former NWA pilots, despite having only a couple of C&Rs on our SLI.

Please re-read your own last paragraph. And you would be where if the top 2000 had not taken early retirement. I rest my case.

VNIIMN
NPOB

 

[Barrister]

Just how many of those oh so desired F/O WB spots are there?

At a 2 east to 1 west ratio just how many spots are available to the west? How many west pilots do you think want to go east?

How many captain spots are out west? How many east captains and 2-1 ratio F/O want to move to PHX?

So lets see maybe 300 total F/O spot 2-1 leaves a max of 100 west pilots that would want to commute to fly all nighters. As opposed to a lot more captain openings out west. Who is going to get the short end of this deal?

It is time to start thinking about the facts not the fear.

Make an effort and ask a west crew the next time you see them. How many want to move or commute to the east coast. you are going to find very few.

Dude ya just ain't getting it and I am tired of trying to educate you. AT THIS OUTFIT YOU MAY (Probably) NOT HAVE A CHOICE WHERE YOU FLY!!!!!!!!!

VNIIMN
NPJB

 

[goneflyin]

Please re-read your own last paragraph. And you would be where if the top 2000 had not taken early retirement. I rest my case.

VNIIMN
NPOB

Wow! That was some strong case you just made! Is your last name Seham?

 

[hp_fa]

You ain't paying attention to my posts. The "Westies" basically have nothing to do with it. I blame NIC. He simply got it wrong by setting a ratio with a company that had been around for for 25 years with one who had been around for 50 years (estimate for you BB and HP who will call me out if I am wrong by a year or two).

I really had not thought about this in this way before, but in legal terms AWA was the company that had been around the longest. US Airways, as we all know, reorganized twice between 2002 and 2005. AWA last went through reorganization in 1992. As you no doubt know when a company goes all the way through reorganization the entering company fails to exist upon exit and a new company or organization is the end result. So a compelling argument can indeed be made that AWA was the longer existing company at the time of the merger.

 

[700UW]

Your analogy is not quite right, my longevity and hire date and everything else did not change upon US emerging from bankruptcy.

In the first bankruptcy everyone kept their pension except the pilots and we did not have to work five more years to vest.