US Pilot Labor Thread 10/5 to 10/12 KEEP ON TOPIC

[machtuck]

Dude, as fun as this is, I have to fly too.
I'm leaving you with this, for the last time.
You seem to share the view that because the words "acquired" and "for accounting purposes" show up from Kerr, that AWA bought and owns USAirways. I have shown that even in Kerrs letter, it was a merger....thats all I've ever said. I also referred to the 10-Q for the structure of the "merged corporation".It doesn't matter who the CEO is, or where HQ is...or even what the name of the "new" company is...it was a merger.
Deal with it.
And stop acting like the west owns the east..you do not.

There's nothing left to talk about.

 

[ableoneable]

This topic has been covered to death in previous threads.

If you like I can dig up the links.

Suffice it to say that America West put the deal together and without them there would be no USAirways.

There was no stand alone plan and as far back as LOA 93 the AWA acquisition was the only plan.

The reason your management proposed the LOA 93 payrates was because AWA management told AAA management that USAirs' pilot costs needed to match AWA's before a merger could be consummated.

The LOA 03 payrates were not sufficiant to allow AAA to operate. Their only function was to facilitate the merger with AWA.

 

[machtuck]

Dumb of me to joke with you, Tachmuck, the guy who shivers with ecstasy at the thought of west pilots being terminated. Expecting that call from HR any time now....

Uh, not so dumb after all, tazz <_<
I'm not convinced you were joking though, because this is about the 3rd or 4th time you've referenced this penata party thing...you remember, with Chili and the others'....a few weeks ago...so, a prolonged veiled threat of physical violence against me with a stick at a party you and Chili are going to have? Do I have this right?

I can pull up the old posts if I need to.....

Maybe I should call somebody about this...what do you think, tazz?

 

[tazz]

Uh, not so dumb after all, tazz <_<
I'm not convinced you were joking though, because this is about the 3rd or 4th time you've referenced this penata party thing...you remember, with Chili and the others'....a few weeks ago...so, a prolonged veiled threat of physical violence against me with a stick at a party you and Chili are going to have? Do I have this right?

I can pull up the old posts if I need to.....

Maybe I should call somebody about this...what do you think, tazz?

Like I said in my previous post, DELETED BY MODERATOR, I await the call from HR. I have no doubt that someone of your caliber wouldn't hesitate to make something of that.

 

[tazz]

Machtuck,

Many previous posts of yours are sure to prove that you are gleeful to see west terminations come to fruition..

PERSONAL COMMENT DELETED BY MODERATOR

 

[nic4us]

Dude, as fun as this is, I have to fly too.
I'm leaving you with this, for the last time.
You seem to share the view that because the words "acquired" and "for accounting purposes" show up from Kerr, that AWA bought and owns USAirways. I have shown that even in Kerrs letter, it was a merger....thats all I've ever said. I also referred to the 10-Q for the structure of the "merged corporation".It doesn't matter who the CEO is, or where HQ is...or even what the name of the "new" company is...it was a merger.
Deal with it.
And stop acting like the west owns the east..you do not.

There's nothing left to talk about.

It was indeed a merger. A merger in which the former shareholders of America West Holdings walked away holding 40 plus percent of the new company. While the former US Air stockholders got what exactly. "Aquired for accounting purposes" says to me, we are accounting for the fact you bought it.

 

[TWAFlyer]

Dude, as fun as this is, I have to fly too.
I'm leaving you with this, for the last time.
You seem to share the view that because the words "acquired" and "for accounting purposes" show up from Kerr, that AWA bought and owns USAirways. I have shown that even in Kerrs letter, it was a merger....thats all I've ever said. I also referred to the 10-Q for the structure of the "merged corporation".It doesn't matter who the CEO is, or where HQ is...or even what the name of the "new" company is...it was a merger.
Deal with it.
And stop acting like the west owns the east..you do not.

There's nothing left to talk about.

Tuck,

Nothing was ever said about who owns who. The bottom line is that this was supposed to have been a new entity, with a fresh start. The fact that many agreements were made, but never honored, has blown this once great opportunity. Unfortunately this has been at a great cost to the affected pilots and their families. But as you say........"Deal with it."

If there truely is nothing left to talk about.........then is that going to be your last post?? Somehow, I doubt it!

Cheers

 

[2BorNot2B]

Unionized !!!!!

A dedicated shop steward was at a convention in Las Vegas and decided to check
out the local brothels.

When he got to the first one, he asked the Madame, "Is this a union house?"

"No, I'm sorry it isn't."

"Well, if I pay you $100, what cut do the girls get?"

"The house gets $80 and the girls get $20."

Highly offended at such unfair dealings, the man stomped off down the street in
search of a more equitable shop.

His search continued for a while, until he finally he reached a brothel where
the Madame said, "Why yes, this is a union house."

"And if I pay you $100, what cut do the girls get?"

"The girls get $80 and the house gets $20."

"That's more like it!" the man said. He looked around the room and pointed to a
stunningly attractive redhead. "I'd like her for the night."

"I'm sure you would, sir," said the Madame, gesturing to a fat sixty-year-old
woman in the corner, "...but Bertha here has seniority!"

 

[cactusboy53]

We all need to get this contract through, I think we are ALL due for a raise!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Right after you drop DOH, install the Nicolau award, and properly represent PHX and LAS. We "westies" aren't necessarily ALPA lovers. It's just that USAPA was born from frustration, and is seeking our money, seniority and/or termination.

Can you imagine the power that we could wield if we all walked in lock step? USAPA barely has 1/2 of it's pilots supporting it. Representing 5000?? Hardly.

 

[Phoenix]

.. if we all walked in lock step? USAPA barely has 1/2 of it's pilots supporting it. ..

Lock step.. The trend of LCC among airline stocks has traders betting that LCC is gonna lockstep together in the unemployment line.

 

[Tiger 1050]

Lock step.. The trend of LCC among airline stocks has traders betting that LCC is gonna lockstep together in the unemployment line.

Yeah... I am beginning to wonder if all this tit-for-tat is all a moot point now. What poetic just though! Cut off your nose to spite your face! Classic.

Well at least I am still relatively young and maybe I can get another career path laid out...

 

[Megasnoop]

This topic has been covered to death in previous threads.

and you need to have the last word on a subject we can never agree on. Point is, it doesnt matter who bought who anymore.

Suffice it to say that America West put the deal together and without them there would be no USAirways.

6 months later probably no AWA either. able, weve been all over this how many times before? And none of that matters now.

There was no stand alone plan and as far back as LOA 93 the AWA acquisition was the only plan.

The reason your management proposed the LOA 93 payrates was because AWA management told AAA management that USAirs' pilot costs needed to match AWA's before a merger could be consummated.

The LOA 03 payrates were not sufficiant to allow AAA to operate. Their only function was to facilitate the merger with AWA.

Now theres a new leap to this tired old story. LOA 93 was too complicated to be a short-term fix awaiting an AWA merger. It was a comprehensive revision (downgrade) of LOAs 84 and 85. We signed LOA 93 in October 2004. As I remember, AWA was trying to buy ATA back then. That deal fell thru in Dec 04. Or was the ATA thing all a Parker-fake? if you really believe the equal pay thing, explain the two $35 M lump sums east pilots get to split the next 2 years. snooper

 

[oldcrow]

Lock step.. The trend of LCC among airline stocks has traders betting that LCC is gonna lockstep together in the unemployment line.

There is a consensus by many traders LCC will not exist in its current form by the end of 1Q 09. Either ch 7 or pieced out to other carriers. This is due to expectations that cc companies will start withholding significant proceeds received from the sale of LCC tickets and LCC not being able to meet certain loan covenants. This is not looking good for LCC, all other legacy carriers are holding their own for the most part this week but LCC stock price is dropping 10-20% a day.

Good chance this Nic-USAPA bickering will be over in the not to distant future.

 

[ableoneable]

6 months later probably no AWA either. able, weve been all over this how many times before? And none of that matters now.

All that Parker said was that absent this merger, and any other down the road, AWA would have probably had to file for chapter 11 at some point in time.

AWA was profitable the year the merger was consummated, and in-fact remained profitable afterwards. When finances were combined all debts were consolidated on the west balance sheet, thus showing the west operating at a loss.

As far as it not being relevant; I agree. It is not the west who keeps bringing it up over and over again. When easties like Mach bring it up and misrepresent what happened, I will not let that stand as "the last word."

 

[Piedmont1984]

All that Parker said was that absent this merger, and any other down the road, AWA would have probably had to file for chapter 11 at some point in time.

AWA was profitable the year the merger was consummated, and in-fact remained profitable afterwards. When finances were combined all debts were consolidated on the west balance sheet, thus showing the west operating at a loss.

As far as it not being relevant; I agree. It is not the west who keeps bringing it up over and over again. When easties like Mach bring it up and misrepresent what happened, I will not let that stand as "the last word."

Haven't been posting here much lately, so catch me up. Why is the financial condition of the company - or the competence of the management team - in any way relevant to the seniority list integration of two pilot lists?

And if you say "career expectations", then I would ask - what are your career expectations now? Should a merger be announced with XYZ airline tomorrow - will you go along with whatever the other pilot group wants because your career expectations were nil on 10 Oct 2008?