TWU negotiations.........what?

[Buck]

Oh Buck you havent been keeping up the new AA/TWU job saving plan is to make most of us OSM's working the plane with limited A&P's on every dock

I am aware of that. But it is more. The TWU will do whatever they have to to keep jobs, it does not matter what we are paid.

 

[iluvaa]

I am aware of that. But it is more. The TWU will do whatever they have to to keep jobs, it does not matter what we are paid.

I will vote with my feet and my toolbox getting loaded up

VOTE NO
VOTE NO
VOTE NO

 

[Buck]

The company wants to use licensed OSMs anywhere they can use an AMT. So the answer is YES, they would be able to do anything any other A&P can do, they would just get paid $10/hr less.

Oh I get it and do not have a problem with either Geo or line pay.

What I have a problem with is certain line mechanics coming on here and blaming OH for all of their miseries. Of course I am going to defend against the attack.

Now that the overall mechanic wage is going to be even lower, do you really believe that the company will give you either?

You are in the negotiations, has the company asked the line to come up with a way to fund Geo or line pay?

Could be that the job savings created by a higher percentage of OSM'S, would be used as a way to pay for Title groups that we to be axed obviously the original Term Sheet and at the same time fund line and/or Geo pay?

 

[Buck]

Remember the OSMs you speak about, after the threatened lay off will all be demoted A and Ps
AMTs with at 15 years or more experience. IF THEY STAY ON AFTER BEING REWARDED FOR YEARS OF DEDICATED SERVICE.

That's what I hear, "I am not going to stay in aviation " if I have work for $20

 

[Tex-Mech]

Could be that the job savings created by a higher percentage of OSM'S, would be used as a way to pay for Title groups that we to be axed obviously the original Term Sheet and at the same time fund line and/or Geo pay?

That is what is being said at AFW. The OSM's are in exchange for title 2 jobs. So AMT's are going to be bumped to OSM in order to keep facility mechanics working at full pay. Have not heard anything about OSM's for GEO pay.

 

[odie01]

Oh I get it and do not have a problem with either Geo or line pay.

What I have a problem with is certain line mechanics coming on here and blaming OH for all of their miseries. Of course I am going to defend against the attack.

Now that the overall mechanic wage is going to be even lower, do you really believe that the company will give you either?

You are in the negotiations, has the company asked the line to come up with a way to fund Geo or line pay?

Could be that the job savings created by a higher percentage of OSM'S, would be used as a way to pay for Title groups that we to be axed obviously the original Term Sheet and at the same time fund line and/or Geo pay?

Remember Buck that we rejected the last TA with a NO vote of over 2 to 1, so most of the line agree's with your setiment. Don't let a couple of Jackwagon's speak for everyone else, remember this is a message board and the majority of mechanics and related do not read this.

 

[Buck]

Remember Buck that we rejected the last TA with a NO vote of over 2 to 1, so most of the line agree's with your setiment. Don't let a couple of Jackwagon's speak for everyone else, remember this is a message board and the majority of mechanics and related do not read this.

Yes, I am like most people, I get a "Little" worked up once in awhile.

I just about puke when one of the states that no real union man votes Republican. Neither party has done anything for airline maintenance and it is the Obama party that is supposed to be our friend.

As for the move to keep Title II Facilities, there is more to it than just jobs. Every A&P mechanic, with the potential of becoming an OSM, had better get off their rear ends and hit their local leadership hard and get clarification as to why they are trading OSM's for Facilities.

This a move by the TWU to keep another union out. If the potential OSM's don't in mass, hit the Local 514 union haul, you will get left behind.

 

[Birdman]

That is what is being said at AFW. The OSM's are in exchange for title 2 jobs. So AMT's are going to be bumped to OSM in order to keep facility mechanics working at full pay. Have not heard anything about OSM's for GEO pay.

I'm not buying it. It's been said before that there is not enough MRO capacity, nor outsource facilities personnel for that matter, to handle AA's work so they must get the supposed savings elsewhere. The compAAny has 2 legacy airlines to emulate in order to make money so why would the creditors buy into an experiment that is unproven and will likely be very unpopular with the rank and file? It's a blatant lie to claim to be preserving wages in the 1113(c) when so many A&P's will be losing $10 an hour doing the same work as before in a/o.

 

[Bob Owens]

Oh I get it and do not have a problem with either Geo or line pay.

What I have a problem with is certain line mechanics coming on here and blaming OH for all of their miseries. Of course I am going to defend against the attack.

Now that the overall mechanic wage is going to be even lower, do you really believe that the company will give you either?

You are in the negotiations, has the company asked the line to come up with a way to fund Geo or line pay?

Could be that the job savings created by a higher percentage of OSM'S, would be used as a way to pay for Title groups that we to be axed obviously the original Term Sheet and at the same time fund line and/or Geo pay?

The company has approached this the same way they approached section 6 negotiations, if we move towards them they move further away only now their demands are even more unrealistic.

I believe we should look at where the company can reasonably claim that our contract is onerous and give them that, that means agreeing to cut 4500 jobs and outsourcing a lot of stuff that everybody else outsources. I think they would choke if we told them that just as they did in 2003 but by agreeing to it then they really dont have an arguement for abrogation, not that they need it but it at least makes it look like they are being unreasonable to any reasonable person. I think that there will be layoffs, just not as much as they are asking for, remember the layoffs in 2009, and 2010? Well they didnt happen even though they announced them. Even the company claims that the outsourcing would be phased in. You have to remember that AMTs will likely attrit out by at least 500 per year, so by 2018 3000 of the 4500 will have left on their own. The remaining 1500 guys would have a job worth coming back to if they had not found anything better by then. So Retiree Medical would be gone as well, but we could get both halves of the fund back, the DB pension too, but we would need to get the 401K match on all earnings not just 2080 hours, sick time at 12 days, not 4, vacation the same as industry average with a minimum of two weeks, maybe we wont see 7 after 30, and of course our wages would have to be at least median.

I say make this a job worth coming back to and not try and "save some jobs" by destroying all of them and dragging down the entire profession as well.

We will see what happens, sure, if the International allows it Tulsa and Title II could roll call whatever they want in order to try and preserve the fact that AA is the only Airline in the US that does the scope of OH we do and maybe the company would accept it, but maybe they wouldnt, maybe they will say despite the concessions they still want the heads. They did not present an "either-or", they wanted both, they wanted the heads, like everybody else got, and they wanted a littany of concessions that nobody else has. Then what would happen? To me it sounds like they would have just set the stage to bust the union.

 

[Chuck Schalk]

I can not and will not voluntararily vote for a concessionary T/A that will destroy our professions, our families, our seniority, and the entire industry! And the kicker, we would all get blamed for accepting it by our governing body.

I will vote NO again and again and again....

 

[Buck]

I can not and will not voluntararily vote for a concessionary T/A that will destroy our professions, our families, our seniority, and the entire industry! And the kicker, we would all get blamed for accepting it by our governing body.

I will vote NO again and again and again....

Great now can we stop supporting those things the TWU supports?
Not attacking you Chuck, but our energies need to be focused on the replacement of the TWU and possibly stopping the creation of a split mechanic workforce. The International has the power to stop this trading of work groups to save some that the company has already deemed expendable on their original term sheet. If the International has to split the mechanic workforce then we should treat it as the original B-scale and reduce the incoming mechanics instead of cutting the current mechanics throat.

 

[Hopeful]

Yes, I am like most people, I get a "Little" worked up once in awhile.

I just about puke when one of the states that no real union man votes Republican. Neither party has done anything for airline maintenance and it is the Obama party that is supposed to be our friend.

As for the move to keep Title II Facilities, there is more to it than just jobs. Every A&P mechanic, with the potential of becoming an OSM, had better get off their rear ends and hit their local leadership hard and get clarification as to why they are trading OSM's for Facilities.

This a move by the TWU to keep another union out. If the potential OSM's don't in mass, hit the Local 514 union haul, you will get left behind.

The Title 2/OSM rumor may be just that...RUMOR...
However, the TWU's main goal is saving jobs....Which equates to union dues...

Everything is heresay and rumor until we read it in writing like the term sheets...
I don't expect much deviation from the original "ASK"

But having said that, if there is any validity to that rumor, I look at this way....If the union agrees to anything so detrimental to the AMT, they will be singing the "WE SAVED JOBS" theme song!

 

[Hopeful]

Well if things continue in this direction at 51 I may as well stay another four years till I can collect a pension, then when I start a new Job the pension will offset the time it takes to get back up to top pay, and I can keep my flight benefits. If Southwest put Maint in ISP I would submit an application tomorrow and leave without hesitation if they called. Would not bother to wait for the Pension.

But.....If the pension is frozen, will you still be able to leave at 55? Does that provision still remain?

As far as the Video, I didnt make any promises, I'm one guy on a committee of 20 that legally has the authority of a witness, and lets not forget Roll Call. I said we need to say No and keep saying No till either we get what we need or we get released, I said that then and I say it still.

it's funny how people continue to blame you for the company's CH.11 filing....the international has made it clear that it OWNS the contract,,,but yet people see you as the root cause...They need to contact little and find out who's actually in charge of negotiations!

 

[Flying low]

it's funny how people continue to blame you for the company's CH.11 filing....the international has made it clear that it OWNS the contract,,,but yet people see you as the root cause...They need to contact little and find out who's actually in charge of negotiations!

Bob gets blamed because, he's the only local president that comes on here with his own name and voices his opinion.

 

[737823]

Bob gets blamed because, he's the only local president that comes on here with his own name and voices his opinion.

If the TWU were a democratic union, Bob would make a great international president.

Josh