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TWU negotiations.........what?

Hmmm, I work @ TULE and all these so called facts (rocket science) are news too me... Line mechs vs OH mechs..lmao..never ceases to amase me the comedy I read from people playing the blame game. One day it's the TWU's fault..next it's TWA's....It's the line guys...it's OH guys...oh wait it's TULE's now..pffffff. Make up your minds or look in the mirror at whose fault it really is. Bob, Ken, Dave and a handful of others on here actually are in the thick of things trying to make a change...while others sit behind their keyboards trying to change the world by posting BS that they think must be true. The way I read it is a handful of dumb @ss's from TULE think one way so blame everyone @ TULE cause they all must be that way ? Ignorant

If the "Dave" you are making reference to is me then take note:

I am no longer trying to make any change. I have seen enough selfish, blame callers, to know that it really makes NO DIFFERENCE anymore, I am done standing beside back stabbers and have no reason to attempt change. The real change that is required within this Union and even the Profession as a whole will take at least twice the amount of time I have left on the payroll. After bitching about the "I got mine, Brother" and the overpaid appointee sellout crowd while bearing witness to no consesus of direction, no defined enemy, no path of success, I conceded sometime back. The enemy appears to vary depending on who you are talking with at any give time. And given the change of enemy for many I am convinced that the truth is we are weak as a group and this is due to a very wrongfully placed idea that the enemy is anyone other than our weak individual selves. The group will always only be as strong as the indivduals that make up the group. There is always someone or something else to blame. This appears to be a staple of liberal thinking and since most union leaders are liberals, that character flaw has now been passed on and is learned behavior by every union member. Thus we see nothing more than weak blamers and no more unionism as it was founded.

Me personally, I would be satisifed to just be able to keep what I have and keep it long enough to just leave. Now the chest pounding save the profession pretenders have cost me early retirement medical while playing a game of chicken with nothing more than a bluff. It is not anyone elses fault, it is not something elses fault, it is each and every one of us as individuals in one way or another that is too blame. Each of us has ownership of our own blame. But since that is too hard to admit, we pay 2 hours pay per month to blame and point the finger at someone else. Some of us have done more than others to attempt change, but a campaign of fear by TWU scared the cowards into status quo unionism. Now the TWU with their enlisted bunch of cowards runs full steam for the cliff on nothing more than a bluff and a hope.

I predict the bluff will be called soon, and in the end, we end up with an even weaker union and a worse agreement than the failed T/A.

Just look at the example of change seekers. At one time, we were seeking change with a union that has the wonderful idea of placing all AMT's in one union and negotiating experience recognition. This is still the best idea never tried. But now change seekers want to isolate ourselves into an independent union using the Pilots and Flight Attendants as the example. Well guess what? The Pilots and the Flight Attendants do not have overhaul bases facing global competition and to my knowledge do not publicly have one union group bashing another union group. The idea of Mr. O.V. Delle-Femine has still never been tried because the AA/TWU supporting cowards were afraid of change and when the dust all settles history will say Delle-Femine was right and that we should have gone that direction long ago. But the true democratic nature of the AMFA Constitution allowed a group chest pounding and emotionally angry thrill seekers to be taken to the mat and the whole movement destroyed because that group got selfish and failed to remain focused on the goal of making the whole profession stronger before attempting such a major battle. Once they won the smaller battles against the AFL-CIO, The IAM, and NMB they falsely felt unbeatable up against NWA the second time around and became easy and over confident targets. Admirable group in AMT history but a mistake that will go down in history as to how the best idea and the only idea that would have changed things for the better was permanently squashed. Not to mention that group was 10 times stronger than what we have with the TWU/AA boot licking membership and the appointed leadership of the TWU.

Change What? Instead of change, most of you should be focusing on salvaging what little is left over from the stronger union days of a regluated industry. Just look at the TWU and place de-regluation of the airline industry as the turning point. Then enlist the only accurate slogan I have heard since being a TWU member. And that Quote is this:

TWU - 40 Years Strong - 30 Years Wrong!
 
If the "Dave" you are making reference to is me then take note:

I am no longer trying to make any change. I have seen enough selfish, blame callers, to know that it really makes NO DIFFERENCE anymore, I am done standing beside back stabbers and have no reason to attempt change. The real change that is required within this Union and even the Profession as a whole will take at least twice the amount of time I have left on the payroll. After bitching about the "I got mine, Brother" and the overpaid appointee sellout crowd while bearing witness to no consesus of direction, no defined enemy, no path of success, I conceded sometime back. The enemy appears to vary depending on who you are talking with at any give time. And given the change of enemy for many I am convinced that the truth is we are weak as a group and this is due to a very wrongfully placed idea that the enemy is anyone other than our weak individual selves. The group will always only be as strong as the indivduals that make up the group. There is always someone or something else to blame. This appears to be a staple of liberal thinking and since most union leaders are liberals, that character flaw has now been passed on and is learned behavior by every union member. Thus we see nothing more than weak blamers and no more unionism as it was founded.

Me personally, I would be satisifed to just be able to keep what I have and keep it long enough to just leave. Now the chest pounding save the profession pretenders have cost me early retirement medical while playing a game of chicken with nothing more than a bluff. It is not anyone elses fault, it is not something elses fault, it is each and every one of us as individuals in one way or another that is too blame. Each of us has ownership of our own blame. But since that is too hard to admit, we pay 2 hours pay per month to blame and point the finger at someone else. Some of us have done more than others to attempt change, but a campaign of fear by TWU scared the cowards into status quo unionism. Now the TWU with their enlisted bunch of cowards runs full steam for the cliff on nothing more than a bluff and a hope.

I predict the bluff will be called soon, and in the end, we end up with an even weaker union and a worse agreement than the failed T/A.

Just look at the example of change seekers. At one time, we were seeking change with a union that has the wonderful idea of placing all AMT's in one union and negotiating experience recognition. This is still the best idea never tried. But now change seekers want to isolate ourselves into an independent union using the Pilots and Flight Attendants as the example. Well guess what? The Pilots and the Flight Attendants do not have overhaul bases facing global competition and to my knowledge do not publicly have one union group bashing another union group. The idea of Mr. O.V. Delle-Femine has still never been tried because the AA/TWU supporting cowards were afraid of change and when the dust all settles history will say Delle-Femine was right and that we should have gone that direction long ago. But the true democratic nature of the AMFA Constitution allowed a group chest pounding and emotionally angry thrill seekers to be taken to the mat and the whole movement destroyed because that group got selfish and failed to remain focused on the goal of making the whole profession stronger before attempting such a major battle. Once they won the smaller battles against the AFL-CIO, The IAM, and NMB they falsely felt unbeatable up against NWA the second time around and became easy and over confident targets. Admirable group in AMT history but a mistake that will go down in history as to how the best idea and the only idea that would have changed things for the better was permanently squashed. Not to mention that group was 10 times stronger than what we have with the TWU/AA boot licking membership and the appointed leadership of the TWU.

Change What? Instead of change, most of you should be focusing on salvaging what little is left over from the stronger union days of a regluated industry. Just look at the TWU and place de-regluation of the airline industry as the turning point. Then enlist the only accurate slogan I have heard since being a TWU member. And that Quote is this:

TWU - 40 Years Strong - 30 Years Wrong!

Informer(I know who you are, and you know me from FX-if you saw my face, talked with me)
The NWA mechs were merely attempting to stop the Co from gutting the entire OH facilitys & many other jobs. The Co didn't give an inch and could n't have cared less. They were going to bust AMFA. So the NWA mechs struck. At that time, there were a lot of mechs on the street/hungry for a job(and apparently willing to scab-unbelieveable to me), NWA capitalized on the situation and spent an enormous amount of time and money to achieve the strike busting scheme successfully. This is something that could(but won't, casue the TWU won't allow it-thatis if you guys could get released by the NMB)play out at American. The TWU knows better. They know in less than a months time, TULE would be non-union. Not so much because of the imported scabs, rather because of those that'll cross at TULE. If AA knew the TWU(and more importantly, you TULE union members)had teeth and would in fact, strike & HOLD the line. I can promise you, they would take another tone in the negotiations. They feel pretty sure the line would hold out, but TULE, no way..."those boys aren't gonna hold out for 30 days"....gauranteed, that's the statement in mgt circles.

Strikeforce, Hopeful...I know it's no secret. When I was there in TULE for a yr & half, I saw the good ol boy sys play out, how the TWU had those guys buffaloed. Amazing.
I still see AMP or AMFA as the ONLY key to freedom from the oppression known as the TWU cancer. Half the TULE base being unlic mechs, know, they wouldn't have a job if it weren't for the sweetheart deal made by the TWU. I've followed this on forums for years guys...just looks like TULE could band with AFW anyway...but I know the Alliance guys hate TULE too...so... :blink:
 
If the "Dave" you are making reference to is me then take note:

I am no longer trying to make any change. I have seen enough selfish, blame callers, to know that it really makes NO DIFFERENCE anymore, I am done standing beside back stabbers and have no reason to attempt change. The real change that is required within this Union and even the Profession as a whole will take at least twice the amount of time I have left on the payroll. After bitching about the "I got mine, Brother" and the overpaid appointee sellout crowd while bearing witness to no consesus of direction, no defined enemy, no path of success, I conceded sometime back. The enemy appears to vary depending on who you are talking with at any give time. And given the change of enemy for many I am convinced that the truth is we are weak as a group and this is due to a very wrongfully placed idea that the enemy is anyone other than our weak individual selves. The group will always only be as strong as the indivduals that make up the group. There is always someone or something else to blame. This appears to be a staple of liberal thinking and since most union leaders are liberals, that character flaw has now been passed on and is learned behavior by every union member. Thus we see nothing more than weak blamers and no more unionism as it was founded.

Me personally, I would be satisifed to just be able to keep what I have and keep it long enough to just leave. Now the chest pounding save the profession pretenders have cost me early retirement medical while playing a game of chicken with nothing more than a bluff. It is not anyone elses fault, it is not something elses fault, it is each and every one of us as individuals in one way or another that is too blame. Each of us has ownership of our own blame. But since that is too hard to admit, we pay 2 hours pay per month to blame and point the finger at someone else. Some of us have done more than others to attempt change, but a campaign of fear by TWU scared the cowards into status quo unionism. Now the TWU with their enlisted bunch of cowards runs full steam for the cliff on nothing more than a bluff and a hope.

I predict the bluff will be called soon, and in the end, we end up with an even weaker union and a worse agreement than the failed T/A.

Just look at the example of change seekers. At one time, we were seeking change with a union that has the wonderful idea of placing all AMT's in one union and negotiating experience recognition. This is still the best idea never tried. But now change seekers want to isolate ourselves into an independent union using the Pilots and Flight Attendants as the example. Well guess what? The Pilots and the Flight Attendants do not have overhaul bases facing global competition and to my knowledge do not publicly have one union group bashing another union group. The idea of Mr. O.V. Delle-Femine has still never been tried because the AA/TWU supporting cowards were afraid of change and when the dust all settles history will say Delle-Femine was right and that we should have gone that direction long ago. But the true democratic nature of the AMFA Constitution allowed a group chest pounding and emotionally angry thrill seekers to be taken to the mat and the whole movement destroyed because that group got selfish and failed to remain focused on the goal of making the whole profession stronger before attempting such a major battle. Once they won the smaller battles against the AFL-CIO, The IAM, and NMB they falsely felt unbeatable up against NWA the second time around and became easy and over confident targets. Admirable group in AMT history but a mistake that will go down in history as to how the best idea and the only idea that would have changed things for the better was permanently squashed. Not to mention that group was 10 times stronger than what we have with the TWU/AA boot licking membership and the appointed leadership of the TWU.

Change What? Instead of change, most of you should be focusing on salvaging what little is left over from the stronger union days of a regluated industry. Just look at the TWU and place de-regluation of the airline industry as the turning point. Then enlist the only accurate slogan I have heard since being a TWU member. And that Quote is this:

TWU - 40 Years Strong - 30 Years Wrong!
Dave,
American Airlines mechanics exist and work in other places such as hubs and OH bases outside of Tulsa. We here on the outside of TULE maintenance base, see what is wrong with the twu, and are willing to go down the well worn path of change, like other union brothers, to protect what we have and try to get back what we lost. Your five paragraff rant on how you have given up, reflects your personal character, and from past, and current card counts in Tulsa, the majority of Tulsa may feel as you do. Please do not group AFW and the rest of the system with the twu/boot licking cowards that you have there in TULE. We Want Change, but the majority in TULE does not !!!!
 
I talked to one of the AMP guys before he left ORD to go back to TUL, he was saying that a majority of TUL mechs do not want to go with AMP and he says he needs a lot of line mechs to sign cards to out number the TUL mechs.

I do believe te informer is correct in one aspect, that we are not united, I for one do not believe that TUL maintaning weekends off is not a big deal to me.
 
I talked to one of the AMP guys before he left ORD to go back to TUL, he was saying that a majority of TUL mechs do not want to go with AMP and he says he needs a lot of line mechs to sign cards to out number the TUL mechs.

I do believe te informer is correct in one aspect, that we are not united, I for one do not believe that TUL maintaning weekends off is not a big deal to me.


Pfffttt.......there ya have it.
Unbelievable.
 
It's not rocket science 787......Do you think it was just by coincidence that AA has it's largest maintenance base in Tulsa OK. TULE mechanics don't see the light because they have the majority, and can manipulate the vote to THEIR liking, and screw everyone else. Bottom line.....the rejected T/A would have passed, but Tulsa didn't like the fact that Line was getting structural increases and they were getting a bonus. Period! It had nothing to do with 24/7 coverage and all the other non-sense. Let's just call a spade, a spade.

Tulsa has the largest number in their Local but they no longer have the majority. Haven't for some time. Yes the 24/7 is a big issue but so was the money. You have to remember that they were used to a certain standard of living and the pay cuts and freezes affect them as well. They may be used to living large compared to us but then again you are living large compared to a cop, no scatch that, large compared to a Garbage man, no scratch that as well, a Janitor, damn, well you are living large compared to somebody that doesnt have a job OK!? Like FWAAA and Eoleson like to point out having a job at AA is better than being unemployed, but not much else!!

Things are looking better for mechanics, even inside the industry, if not at AA:

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2011/06/22/358628/paris-boeing-warns-airlines-times-running-out-for-training.html
 
Like FWAAA and Eoleson like to point out having a job at AA is better than being unemployed, but not much else!!

When have I ever said that, Bob? Proof, please. Dates, links, quotes....
 
I do believe te informer is correct in one aspect, that we are not united, I for one do not believe that TUL maintaning weekends off is not a big deal to me.
When have we ever been united? The twu has been watering down our profession for years, yet a little less than half of us care, and want change, the other half have been neutered by the twu, and are numb to the swift kick in the nuts we get year after year.
If you want to use card counts as the bellweather for change, percentages show that TULE maintenance base is perfectly happy and content with what benefits and pay they gave up. Until we get TULE to grow some nuts and think outside the box, get ready to give some more.
 
Until we get TULE to grow some nuts and think outside the box, get ready to give some more.
I gave up on Tulsa when their apathy allowed the NMB/TWU/AA axis of evil to deny M&R the right to exercise their hard won fundamental right, through blood and tears, to vote for the union of choice. Bob claims the line has the majority. Knowing Tulsa will never show enough interest in change to make a difference, I sincerely hope the line will unite and force change on an unsuspecting herd of sheeple.
 
Tulsa has the largest number in their Local but they no longer have the majority. Haven't for some time. Yes the 24/7 is a big issue but so was the money. You have to remember that they were used to a certain standard of living and the pay cuts and freezes affect them as well. They may be used to living large compared to us but then again you are living large compared to a cop, no scatch that, large compared to a Garbage man, no scratch that as well, a Janitor, damn, well you are living large compared to somebody that doesnt have a job OK!? Like FWAAA and Eoleson like to point out having a job at AA is better than being unemployed, but not much else!!

Things are looking better for mechanics, even inside the industry, if not at AA:

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2011/06/22/358628/paris-boeing-warns-airlines-times-running-out-for-training.html
Well said, Bob!

So, when you live LARGE compared to colleagues across the system......why replace the hand that feeds you?????????

So, would it be fair to say that when most people associate TWU/AA as ONE company......can we now say TWU/AA/TULE.....as ONE company??? We're Doomed!!!!!
 
Bob claims the line has the majority. Knowing Tulsa will never show enough interest in change to make a difference, I sincerely hope the line will unite and force change on an unsuspecting herd of sheeple.
No, I claimed that Tulsa doesnt have the majority anymore. OH, Tule + AFW + DWH is still the majority but Tulsa alone dose not have the majority.
 
No, I claimed that Tulsa doesnt have the majority anymore. OH, Tule + AFW + DWH is still the majority but Tulsa alone dose not have the majority.
Correction noted. I stand by by premise that Tulsa cannot be counted on, to the "axis of evils" delight, in order to bring about change.
 
Let me get this straight. A couple of weeks ago there was a carnival in the AA parking lot. If the union had encouraged its members to attend, and as a result there was a 100% refusal of OT, there would have been judicial consequences? I believe a real union would say "bring it".

Is the carnival in town for 180 days or just a weekend? If the former, and leaders encourage attendance every day, and thus overtime is declined en masse for six months, then that's a problem. If the carnival is a short-term thing, then there's very little risk of a finding of encouraging and illegal slowdown.

But you knew that already, didn't you?
 
Maybe the carnival had mimes instead of clowns, trying to get out of the box, or a room with no walls.
 
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