Pilot labor thread week 4/27-5/3

[Piedmont1984]

That took all of 9 minutes.

Thanks for proving my point.

I think what I did was provide you with a point which was previously lacking. The point being, USAirways has widebodies "at the gate" and on order. Lets not handicap ourselves in any future merger by minimizing what we bring to the table.

Are you and 767jetz good buddies?

 

[aquagreen73s]

Do us all a favor. If you can't even get the widebody count on the east correct (not including future orders), I would prefer someone else to represent our interests when sitting across the table from the UAL group.

I spell it out for you...the A330s are more akin to a 767-300 than a 777, much like the A330 was matched against the 767 for the KC-135 replacement contract. Therefore, the paltry A330 fleet should warrant a couple of 767-300s at UAL - and nothing more.

 

[fr8tmastr]

All this "SPIN" on 3 sides proves why all the expectation crap is just that. For crying out loud, now you are arguing over what a widebody really is. No one questioned that one before, but now look out. It would be nice if some of you would just come out and tell the truth. "I want it all so the heck with you"

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

USAPA R & I Committee Update
April 29, 2008

As reported, USAPA will provide all pilots, USAPA members and non members, Aeromedical Services through Monday June 3, 2008. USAPA fully understands we are in a transitional period, however, after June 3, 2008, any pilot who is not a member of USAPA will be required to arrange direct billing and be responsible for the fees if they elect to keep the service. Free Aeromedical services simply require that the pilot be dues current and submit a USAPA Membership Form prior to the close of business Monday, June 3, 2008

For a covered pilot, if a medical issue develops that affects the pilots' certificate, the first step is to contact Harvey Watt and Co. (800-241-6103 x222). They will act as a consultant and provide the steps necessary to resolve the issue. The next step is to choose the best medical provider for your specific circumstance. That provider may be your local Primary Care Physician, a Specialist, local AME, or you may contract the services of Dr. Peter Lambrou. Please check the US Airways Benefits page on the HUB and the USAPA website for any updates or new information.

Thank you,

 

[AAA73Pilot]

FYI:

USAPA
Grievance Committee Update
April 29, 2008

Any West pilot who wishes to file a grievance should contact me via email at [email protected] until such time as we can get a copy of the new grievance form loaded on the website. I will then forward the form as a word document to them, which should be filled out and emailed back to me for filing with the Company.

East pilots who wish to file a grievance should first contact their Reps and then the grievance committee.

ALPA is in the process of sending letters to each pilot (East and West) who have grievances filed and telling them that USAPA is now responsible for the continued prosecution of the grievance. There is no need for them to contact USAPA – as soon as ALPA makes the documents available to us we will proceed with a seamless transition.

Thank You,

Tracy Parrella
Grievance Committee Chairperson

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Well, LCC has something like 24 more 330s on order, plus AB350s. Last I checked, UAL had NOTHING on order.

I thought airplane orders didn't mean anything?

 

[luvthe9]

Every UAL 747 and 777 should be off limits to every East and West pilot because neither group had an expectation for flying a true widebody. In other words, the most junior UAL pilot on their list as this is being typed, I guess we'll call him the "UAL Dave O'Dell," should have priority bidding before any West or East pilot ever sees the cockpit of a 777 or a 747 - regardless of how many grey hairs are on their head. That was his expectation when he hired on to UAL and that should remain his expectation when this merger becomes a reality.
The best the East should expect is to be ratioed into UAL's 767-300 fleet on account of their...what....9(?) A330s.

Leave it up to the West and we'll have a deal with UAL on seniority in no time. Might only take one bar tab!

I agree with you we (the east) are not entitled to the to those planes we did not bring to the table, just as the west should not have any our our wide body flying as liilte as it is.

 

[aquagreen73s]

I agree with you we (the east) are not entitled to the to those planes we did not bring to the table, just as the west should not have any our our wide body flying as liilte as it is.

No argument here and I wouldn't have provided for that if I were the arbitrator. But then again, I would have started the ratio at the top of each seniority list and not just arbitrarily give 500 spots to the East. Oh well...such is the nature of arbitration; you win some and you lose some.

 

[Tiger 1050]

The only problem the West thinks they are entitled to all you 74s and 777s since "they" saved you from your next bankruptcy

Not true at all! I would say from my personal perspective that the west looks forward to an integration that reflects what you brought to the merger and then we all equally share from that point forward... Just like Nic would provide! But the USAPA idiots will screw that up for us with their DOH B.S. i'm sure.

 

[sharktooth]

Not true at all! I would say from my personal perspective that the west looks forward to an integration that reflects what you brought to the merger and then we all equally share from that point forward... Just like Nic would provide! But the USAPA idiots will screw that up for us with their DOH B.S. i'm sure.

Since no pilot I have met ever had any input to the number and type of aircraft an airline had at merger time and, therefore, no pilot could ever be considered to have "brought" an aircraft to a merger, how would one determine what one brought? Perhaps you know something other than length of service or date of hire? and, no, charming wit does not count

 

[luvn737s]

QUOTE
USAPA
Grievance Committee Update
April 29, 2008

Any West pilot who wishes to file a grievance should contact me via email at [email protected] until such time as we can get a copy of the new grievance form loaded on the website. I will then forward the form as a word document to them, which should be filled out and emailed back to me for filing with the Company.

East pilots who wish to file a grievance should first contact their Reps and then the grievance committee.

ALPA is in the process of sending letters to each pilot (East and West) who have grievances filed and telling them that USAPA is now responsible for the continued prosecution of the grievance. There is no need for them to contact USAPA – as soon as ALPA makes the documents available to us we will proceed with a seamless transition.

Thank You,

Tracy Parrella
Grievance Committee Chairperson

I don't think that's the way the west contract reads that a grievance is handled. Remember USAPA is representing west pilots (not USAPA members) and enforcing contract compliance (not east contract).

Whether they want to or not.

 

[Tiger 1050]

Since no pilot I have met ever had any input to the number and type of aircraft an airline had at merger time and, therefore, no pilot could ever be considered to have "brought" an aircraft to a merger, how would one determine what one brought? Perhaps you know something other than length of service or date of hire? and, no, charming wit does not count

Okay! I get it. But it is all semantics smarty. You get my point just as the other readers do.

 

[nycbusdriver]

"I'm afraid we've woken a sleeping giant"

(emperor Hirohito 1941)

Like most everything else you post here, you got that one wrong, too.

The quote is commonly attributed to Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto, although there is speculation that, although he said something similar, he didn't really say it exactly that way. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isoroku_Yamam...ing_giant_quote

Keep on posting. Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn once in a while; maybe you'll get something right!

 

[767jetz]

Sorry I didn’t know ual was so much financially better off then the rest of the airline industry
They better stay were there at.Stand-alone financially good carrier

Actually, re-read my post. I freely admitted that UA's performance was far from good. I'm only saying that when you delve into the details, you can see two obvious thing:
1) It's not as bad as many of you on this board are claiming.
2) USAirways has a smaller cash position and I higher daily cash burn rate.

So if it is a race to the bottom (BK 2 or 3), guess who will get there first?

But to claim that in a merger with UA, USAirways would be the savior and in the driver's seat, and would insist on UA's pre-packaged bankruptcy goes beyond logic by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[767jetz]

Well even if you use those statistics, US has 63+9=72 falling into the 757 gauge or higher category. In addition we have future AB350's on order. I don't know what UAL's future widebody order is.

My point being, don't make concessions before you even begin to negotiate.

OK. So if 63+9=72, then 132+82=214 (757's-97, 767's-35, 777's-52, 747's-30)

And since the A330 is comparable to the 767-300 and not a 777 or 747, you could further speculate that:
US has 19 A330's & 767's to UA's 35
US has 0(zero) to UA's 82 777's & 747's
US has 70 757's and A321's to UA's 97 757's

Orders are just that... orders. They can be canceled, converted into 319's, or delayed indefinitely. Just like UA could order a fleet of 787's tomorrow if they wanted. If the plane is not physically on the property it doesn't count.

And I remember in 2000 the USAirways MEC trying to convince everyone that an A330 is the same as a 777. Ridiculous. Let's see an A330 fly to China.