IAM WINS!

[737823]

Everyone should find out for themselves. Its just better that way. Won't be bias or skewed. 
 
Btw i got the answer i was looking for. Get yours. I'm over it!
 
You can chase me on another thread if you want, but josh will get right back to you......I think?

Email went out on Tuesday, going to give it a few days and hopefully get a response. If not I will call later this week. This is a government agency we are working with, which even in ideal conditions means they work s-l-o-w-l-y, even more so considering the Thanksgiving holiday.

Josh

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

With all the misinformation being posted on this thread, and others, I certainly hope the AA/US members take the time to educate themselves on this alliance and the NMB election process.
 
Understand what it is you'll be voting on.
 
The AA/US membership WILL NOT be voting on the formation of the IAM-TWU Alliance. The IAM & TWU already agreed to this without the memberships consent.  The NMB has nothing to do with this process.
 
The AA/US membership WILL be voting on representation by the IAM-TWU Alliance. The NMB will oversee the vote for the purpose of representation NOT formation.
 
 
If you do not wish to be represented by the IAM-TWU alliance, then collect cards for your representative of choice. When single transportation system is declared on AA/US you'll have a window to file. As this is an election due to a merger, there can be no repeat of the AA/ibt debacle.
 
In the end its up to the AA-US mechanics to choose your representatives. If you don't want the IAM/TWU, then throw them out.

 

[700UW]

I find it so funny that WN and UA mechanics think they are lawyers and RLA experts, you dont work for US your not IAM members and the alliance paperwork is quite clear on how things will occur.
 
I know the man that wrote the alliance and I stand by my words, even Mike33 got the same answer from the NMB that the IAM and TWU have been forthcoming with.
 

• 
  Transport Workers and Machinist Union to Jointly Represent Ground Workers at the "New" American Airlines
  
  Questions relating to joint announcement
• Mechanic and Related Associated Agreement
• Stores Associated Agreement
• Joint Agreement on Pensions
• Seniority List Integration Agreement

 

[blue collar]

From what I've been hearing from former coworkers, and what I've been reading here, the alliance doesn't sound like it's going to come to fruition- at least in mx.

 

[737823]

The alliance would be a big win for the company, divided work force and less leverage for the union(s).

Josh

 

[700UW]

Actually it would be more, you dont get it.
 
The IAM has Section 6 negotiations going on the US side, the new AA arent in negotiations and cant be till the SCS is filed and approved then JCBA talks can start.
 
But the IAM and the TWU have to agree to file the SCS together, and it wont be filed till US and the IAM reach and approve a new CBA before any JCBA talks start.
 
So that gives leverage now and after, you just dont get it.

 

[blue collar]

So the IAM wants the opportunity to get through section 6, but wasn't the Ibt in section 6 when US and HP merged? They stopped the IBT's section 6, and want the TWU to allow their's to continue?

 

[700UW]

I couldnt tell you if they were, I dont remember.
 
There was a card signing drive at HP, the IBT failed to get enough cards for an election and then HP AMTs became IAM and a JCBA was negotiated.

There was no alliance between the IAM and IBT.

 

[blue collar]

They were in section 6. There was no alliance, but the same concept exists. Why not let one union's section 6 get better conditions to build off of for all?
Seems to me they need to figure out what to do next, cos this alliance sounds like it's d.o.a.

 

[swamt]

Everyone should find out for themselves. Its just better that way. Won't be bias or skewed. 
 
Btw i got the answer i was looking for. Get yours. I'm over it!
 
You can chase me on another thread if you want, but josh will get right back to you......I think?

Mike, your actions show that you are hiding information. Why are you not willing to share the info you were told? As a union member that cares for all members would be willing to do so. You are out here sharing all kinds of other info with everybody, but this one topic you refuse to share info, Hmmm, speaks volumes. I bet you did get your info, and I bet it was exactly as I said it would be, and this is why you say that your "over it". Almost the exact same BS 700 gave when he was proven wrong, his was, "I'm done with this". It is very obvious that you and 700 are in fact misleading the membership for the upcoming alliance election to create fear and scare tactics to try and force the membership into voting for this alliance BS, as you I'm pretty sure you guys are afraid of what is really going to happen, just like another group of F/A's has told their alliance group to go pack sand, then there will be a real election between the IAM and the TWU with other unions getting the options to join in, and this scares the the living crap out of the TWU as well as the IAM of losing all the dues from, what, 12-15,000 members and prob even more than that.
Not chasing you nowhere Mike, your the one that piped up and said you called, asked, and received from the NMB information about the up coming alliance election and now you are scared to share it with your fellow members,- speaks volumes. You want me to call on Mon morn and share my information, but you won't. You are just like 700 and the industrial unions who want to mislead and force their members into keeping the 2 inions on the property after the merger. They have seen what will happen if there is another AMFA vote and they are scared to death and will say and do anything in order to keep the dues flowing into the industrial international.
I will say, at least you, (only as you claim you have) gave an effort to gain information prior to you voting, but I am not convinced that you really did call the NMB, as I am sure others out here do not believe you either. Carry on sir...

 

[swamt]

Email went out on Tuesday, going to give it a few days and hopefully get a response. If not I will call later this week. This is a government agency we are working with, which even in ideal conditions means they work s-l-o-w-l-y, even more so considering the Thanksgiving holiday.

Josh

Josh, I have received your email copy that you have sent to NMB. Looks fine to me, as it's in your own words. Just so you know I do not answer PM's. I would rather you repost your copy here for all to see. I have had numerous PM's from 700, as well as others, but I do not answer them, I prefer to answer them out here in the open.

Now as far as the NMB answering your letter. It will more than likely be Mon or Tues morn as they will be playing catch up from the long weekend. Don West was always very punctual in answering my phone calls the very same day or the next day if too late in the day. Emails were returned within one day max. One time he delayed longer than one day so I resent email thinking it did not get to him and he then returned an answer about 10 minutes later.
Josh, I do appreciate, finally someone has taken the time to gather some info on their own that this vote will effect directly. Look forward to your NMB response this week some time.

 

[mike33]

I will say, at least you, (only as you claim you have) gave an effort to gain information prior to you voting, but I am not convinced that you really did call the NMB, as I am sure others out here do not believe you either. Carry on sir...

Ha Ha...you guys really crack me up. In all your ego you have the morale ordacity to claim I'm lying. My opinion is based on my phone call ( which you can make also ). As far as dues money?. I could care less as dues will be collected whomever is the representation party. Like i said, anyone can call. Its a live person ...
 
 Either " Fish or Cut Bait "
 
DCA 1-202-692-5049....
 
I don't write or email because direct contact is faster and easier. And stop asking me about my conversation will you?.....You're sounding like a kid. Just call and get your info.

 

[swamt]

With all the misinformation being posted on this thread, and others, I certainly hope the AA/US members take the time to educate themselves on this alliance and the NMB election process.
 
Understand what it is you'll be voting on.
 
The AA/US membership WILL NOT be voting on the formation of the IAM-TWU Alliance. The IAM & TWU already agreed to this without the memberships consent.  The NMB has nothing to do with this process.
 
The AA/US membership WILL be voting on representation by the IAM-TWU Alliance. The NMB will oversee the vote for the purpose of representation NOT formation.
 
 
If you do not wish to be represented by the IAM-TWU alliance, then collect cards for your representative of choice. When single transportation system is declared on AA/US you'll have a window to file. As this is an election due to a merger, there can be no repeat of the AA/ibt debacle.
 
In the end its up to the AA-US mechanics to choose your representatives. If you don't want the IAM/TWU, then throw them out.

The NMB will oversee the vote for the purpose of representation NOT formation.
Not sure what you mean by "oversee" in this quote from you. I know that the NMB will have to cert who ever does get voted in. However, below I have provided the emails between the NMB and myself, and they flat out say they will have no jurisdiction of an "election" between them. And, my email the issue after the formation of the alliance where the membership is voting in the representational part of it. If Mr West is thinking this entire time that I was only speaking about the "formation" of the alliance than he and I were not on the same page. I am clearly speaking about voting on the "election" of the alliance and not the formation. I will get this clarified Mon morn. BTW here the emails I sent, and all this can be followed in this thread starting at post number #52, including these emails listed in post #89:-



'700UW', on 30 Aug 2013 - 4:58 PM, said:


I talked to the man that wrote the alliance for the IAM, they are going to have the NMB run the election. And other will be speak in.

Also the certification will be transferred from the IAM and TWU to the alliance, only the NMB can do that.

OK 700, here it is yet again. Only this time I sent e-mail in order to have it in writing from the NMB to post for ALL to see. The only items left out of the e-mails between Don West and myself are my name and the Q and A from the TWU/IAM alliance web site. You know if I were any of you guys at US or AA I would no longer trust what they are telling you guys. Get involved yourselves and e-mail the NMB for your answers, DO NOT trust what the union that is trying to force it's members into this so called "Alliance". Now 700, take particular attention to the very first para where he answers rather the NMB will be handling the election or not, as I told you before, and you now have it from the NMB, and I quote; "the NMB has no jurisdiction over the alliance or merger of unions and DOES NOT CONDUCT SUCH ELECTIONS."
Here's the emails, starting with Don West answering my e-mail, happy reading:-

RE your Question: My main issue with this "Alliance" vote is, who will run it?


Just how a union chooses to represent its members is an internal-union matter, not under the jurisdiction of the National Mediation Board. The NMB has no jurisdiction over the alliance or merger of unions and does not conduct such elections.





RE your Question: Another question; How long does the NMB normally take when a union files an appeal to protest against the one year limitation term of filing again at a carrier where another union has pulled out of a representational election? Just curious to a possible time frame of the outcome.


I'm not sure I understand this question, but if you are talking about a Representation case, it seems you may be asking about Time limits on applications. If so, you may want to see Section 1206.4 of NMB Rules at http://www.nmb.gov/d...brules1099.html




RE your Question: Question #5 is the way they are now saying they will ask for the NMB to run the election:


We cannot address hypothetical applications. Applications actually received by the NMB for the Investigation of Representation Disputes are handled on a case-by-case basis.







My original e-mail below:

Don West,

As we have been discussing about the TWU and IAM combining, yes some things have changed on their side since we last spoke. My main issue with this "Alliance" vote is, who will run it? And what options will the mechanic and related have to choose from, and what results would be obtained from voting on each option?
We are being told that the NMB will run the election. We are also being told that there will only be 2 options on the ballot for this "Alliance" vote; 1- Yes, for the Association and 2- No which would be a vote for no-union or non-union. Then after I informed them that I was contacting the NMB to get answers we were told that there would be a third option of "other", with no explanation of what "other" meant. I suggested to them that the "other" option (with the NMB running the election) generally means "write-in" or "speak-in" option where the one could "write-in" or "speak-in" any choice of union they wish. It took constant pressure and inquiries but they finally admitted (after 2 weeks) that the "other" option does mean a "speak-in" option. Here is what I suggested the options would be with the NMB running such an election: 1- Yes, for the Alliance (Association) 2- No, against the Alliance (Association) 3- "Write-in" or "speak-in" 4- No union or Non-union. Then we were all told that this is a different type of an election than a regular card collection and vote for representation, therefore the options I listed above will not be the same. Mr. West can you please indicate what will happen? And what the options will be? And this is even if the NMB will run the election. As we have spoke before, you mentioned that the NMB wouldn't conduct an election unless you were asked to by the unions, well as #5 Q&A states below, both associations will be filing with the NMB to conduct the election. If this is all true, would you be so kind to provide the options on the ballots that the members will receive for this type of an election?

Another question; How long does the NMB normally take when a union files an appeal to protest against the one year limitation term of filing again at a carrier where another union has pulled out of a representational election? Just curious to a possible time frame of the outcome.

Again Mr. West thanks so much for time and patients with me. It seems a lot of my previous information has changed due to the IAM/TWU Alliance has changed some of their information after some of us have proven them wrong. I just cannot see 2 unions coming together with a vote that forces you to vote for the Alliance or vote No and be non-union. It sounds to me like the members actually don't have a choice.

Here is the TWU and IAM Q&A. Question #5 is the way they are now saying they will ask for the NMB to run the election:
Sincerely, Very concerned mechanic

Attached was the Q&A from the TWU/IAM alliance web page. Did not want to bore you with that as we all know what it says.

Again guys, PER THE NMB, they will not conduct such an election for the new alliance, combination or merger of the TWU and IAM. You guys are soon to be screwed by your own union as they (unions) will control what options are on the ballots as it will be handled internally. You guys better hope AMFA gets another chance and put a stop to this ridiculous controlling unions.

 

[swamt]

Ha Ha...you guys really crack me up. In all your ego you have the morale ordacity to claim I'm lying. My opinion is based on my phone call ( which you can make also ). As far as dues money?. I could care less as dues will be collected whomever is the representation party. Like i said, anyone can call. Its a live person ...
 
 Either " Fish or Cut Bait "
 
DCA 1-202-692-5049....
 
I don't write or email because direct contact is faster and easier. And stop asking me about my conversation will you?.....You're sounding like a kid. Just call and get your info.

And direct contact shows no proof. Therefore you can say what ever you want. The emails I wrote and received above are why I believe the NMB will not conduct such elections between the 2 unions combining and becoming the representational alliance of the 2 groups. IF you are being told something different from the NMB than you should share this with others so this can get ironed out before any election is started. It would be stupid to continue forward with out having all the correct information. Do you not agree with that at least?

 

[mike33]

Bait