F/A Attrition ONLY

[AAStew]

Ed,
As some have pointed out here, you are not seeing the forest because of the trees. Flexibility is what makes this job attractive nowadays. There is no glamour, there is no non-revving that is worth a damn, the starting pay sucks, the work rules we have are the worst in the industry. So tell me, why are you here? These flight attendants that are dropping have paved the way for you, well some of them were probably in your class so I may be wrong there. And I will make my own sexist statement, why would any male (or female) want this job nowadays? Most of you are at 7 years pay....you can make more working at a department store. Does dressing up in our beautiful polyester uniform give you a sense of self-worth you are missing in other parts of your life?
Stop being such a priss and shooting yourself in the foot at the same time. Get over yourself, if the future seems out of your control, now is the time to make a change before you possibly get furloughed again. This is the nature of the airline beast, suck it up or leave.

 

[FA Mikey]

Mikey get one thing straight...In the "real working world" Time = Money. If it takes an EPT instructor to keep a current F/A, or F/A's in this case current, eventhough they are not working, they are spending their "Time" training them which results in your company having to pay that instructor "Money" for doing so...If it takes a secretary "Time" to update a seniority list the company must pay that secretary "Money" to do so...It's simple math...If these F/A's wern't employed then it would mean less "Time" spent resulting in less "Money" out of pocket from the company. Do you understand that?, or is it way too complicated for you? Perhaps instead of dropping those LGA turns why dont u take some "Time" and work them..Maybe even layover and enjoy the city for awhile...You can see a lot of sights in 9 hours.

So as usual Ed, no anwser to the questions I posted above? Some more Ed 1/2 fact, mis-truth and inuendo., Again where is the dollar amount? Lets see how much of a difference it would make.

You have the thought and as usual no facts or numbers. Here is a simple math equation for you to work on. If tomorrow 100 people left how many fewer EPT instructors do they need to keep current as you state?

 

[JFK AA]

I've been several of Flyboy4u's post and he's not going to get it. If this is the person I think it is he was based at LGA and was never happy. He is going to complain no matter what. This seems to come from the the same group of people who complained about being based in NY or having to work a holiday. I guess there were some F/A's when interviewing were not told about relocation or having to work holidays to the end of time. I wonder what these people would have done if they had to serve straight reserve, reserve sucks anyway you cut it, however they do not know how lucky they are to have 1 on 3 off system. Anyway just venting, I'm tired of people complaining about this type of crap and forgetting how good we have it when it comes to the flexibility. Not all junior Flight Attendants feel this way, there is a lot though and they are the sames ones sleeping in the last row, complaing they don't make enough money. Where else in American could you get plaid for sleeping or hiding in a galley not doing your job? Seniority is not going to change, it is something everyone has to earn...deal with it.

 

[Flyboy4u]

So as usual Ed, no anwser to the questions I posted above? Some more Ed 1/2 fact, mis-truth and inuendo., Again where is the dollar amount? Lets see how much of a difference it would make.

You have the thought and as usual no facts or numbers. Here is a simple math equation for you to work on. If tomorrow 100 people left how many fewer EPT instructors do they need to keep current as you state?

Again, I dont understand why you think the fact that a Flight Attendant who doesn't work at all is justified in keeping this job. If 100 people left tomorrow and the math dictated 1 less EPT instructor is needed because of that, then thats one less salary being payed resulting in money saved. How much? I don't have the exact dollars for you Mikey but apparently that little mind of yours can't comprehend those simple FACTS. You all on here talk about my attitude being so bad, Its the senior flight attendants like you Mikey who would rather throw all of us JR people out on the street again, so u can save your preciious "Flexibility" of not having to work.. BTW....Have you ever worked another job besides being a Flight Attendant? I seriously doubt it.. Also. What 1/2 fact mis-truths and inuendos are u ranting about now?

 

[kirkpatrick]

Mikey,

I'm with you and Art on this one. Flexibility is everything, and the number who would actually quit if the job were poisoned is too small to be significant.

MK

 

[Flyboy4u]

I've been several of Flyboy4u's post and he's not going to get it. If this is the person I think it is he was based at LGA and was never happy. He is going to complain no matter what. This seems to come from the the same group of people who complained about being based in NY or having to work a holiday. I guess there were some F/A's when interviewing were not told about relocation or having to work holidays to the end of time. I wonder what these people would have done if they had to serve straight reserve, reserve sucks anyway you cut it, however they do not know how lucky they are to have 1 on 3 off system. Anyway just venting, I'm tired of people complaining about this type of crap and forgetting how good we have it when it comes to the flexibility. Not all junior Flight Attendants feel this way, there is a lot though and they are the sames ones sleeping in the last row, complaing they don't make enough money. Where else in American could you get plaid for sleeping or hiding in a galley not doing your job? Seniority is not going to change, it is something everyone has to earn...deal with it.

Again a comment from another Senior F/A who has absolutely no idea what us "Junior" people have had to endure...BTW...None of us are JR Anymore! The same group of people who complain no matter what? We are the same group of people who have been keeping a safety net under you so you can can sleep at night knowing you will wakeup to your job tomorrow. Relocation? I have personally moved to four bases with my career at this company, and yes I was told I would have to work holidays which I have for the past 5 years. JFKAA, What about those F/A's who don't work at all? Who continue to call in sick because they got thrown on reserve after 20 years? I guess they didn't get the interview speech I did. Earn Seniority? I never said anything to the fact that I "Deserve" seniority. What I have said, as well as, others on this board is that Everyone needs to pull their weight in this job...Apparently, there are those who feel the deserve the right not to have to step on an airplane!

 

[jimntx]

New Numbers posted this evening. I am assuming these are the end of April numbers.

Totals for 2008 & month of April
Domestic 145......................23
Internatl 95......................21
Total 240......................44
Retirees 126......................26

The retirees are still comprising over half the total attrition for the year. Average attrition/month down slightly to 60.

Back to the stated topic. Once again there have been "adjusted" numbers posted to the website. Not enough to represent a whole month; so, who knows what they represent--other than additional attrition in some month this year.


Latest 2008 totals
Domestic.......149
Internatl..........95
Total..............245
Retirees.........128

 

[AAStew]

Again a comment from another Senior F/A who has absolutely no idea what us "Junior" people have had to endure...BTW...None of us are JR Anymore! The same group of people who complain no matter what? We are the same group of people who have been keeping a safety net under you so you can can sleep at night knowing you will wakeup to your job tomorrow. Relocation? I have personally moved to four bases with my career at this company, and yes I was told I would have to work holidays which I have for the past 5 years. JFKAA, What about those F/A's who don't work at all? Who continue to call in sick because they got thrown on reserve after 20 years? I guess they didn't get the interview speech I did. Earn Seniority? I never said anything to the fact that I "Deserve" seniority. What I have said, as well as, others on this board is that Everyone needs to pull their weight in this job...Apparently, there are those who feel the deserve the right not to have to step on an airplane!

STOP YOUR WHINING! What do you mean we don't know what you have to endure? I am on reserve with 17 years seniority. You are not a stewardess, you are a FAA REQUIRED live soul who can be easily replaced. Do not fool yourself for a moment that the company values you. If anybody knows what you go through it is those senior FA's who had crew scheduling in their crew rooms and could get away with nothing! Flight attendants like you are sickening to me. You are not a princess, you are a glorified busboy. Again, I say SUCK IT UP or QUIT.

 

[ArtTang]

Again a comment from another Senior F/A who has absolutely no idea what us "Junior" people have had to endure...BTW...None of us are JR Anymore! The same group of people who complain no matter what? We are the same group of people who have been keeping a safety net under you so you can can sleep at night knowing you will wakeup to your job tomorrow. Relocation? I have personally moved to four bases with my career at this company, and yes I was told I would have to work holidays which I have for the past 5 years. JFKAA, What about those F/A's who don't work at all? Who continue to call in sick because they got thrown on reserve after 20 years? I guess they didn't get the interview speech I did. Earn Seniority? I never said anything to the fact that I "Deserve" seniority. What I have said, as well as, others on this board is that Everyone needs to pull their weight in this job...Apparently, there are those who feel the deserve the right not to have to step on an airplane!

This is the last comment I'll post on this topic because I have to fly. Plus, this horse is DOA and there's no point in beating it further.

Your posts are full of anger, resentment and, most significantly, a woeful lack of understanding of the history of the F/A job at AA. The relocations, reserve horrors, and lack of job security you have endured are certainly not unique to your plight. F/As at AA have been furloughed before, we have had countless base closings that forced employees to relocate (HNL, BNA (twice!), SJU, SEA, BUF, etc.) and we have all suffered through reserve. Many of us have suffered through a reserve system that was much more onerous than the one currently in place. You claim there are no more junior F/As yet you constantly pit junior against senior in your posts. Do junior F/As never call in sick while on reserve?

I agree 100% with your assertion that every employee should pull his/her weight. Slackers are slackers regardless of seniority; a person either has a good work ethic or s/he doesn't. I have always called team players "good hires" when I have the pleasure of working with them. Look, you seem to assign blame for laziness, for 'working' the system, and for your lack of job security on senior F/As in every post. The entire seniority continuum is populated by F/As who posses a less than admirable work ethic, just as it is populated by committed and hard working F/As. One's seniority has nothing to do with it.

I have to ask: If you resent F/As who fly say, 440 hours a year, what is the minimum amount of hours they should fly in your mind in order to "pull their own weight" in this company? 860 hours? 1,200 hours? There is a reason why the union has fought to keep this degree of flexibility in the CBA. Regardless of your personal feelings, the F/A corps values flexibility above all other aspects of the job.
There ain't much else to value in this profession.

I hope things get better for both you and the company. I would love to see all furloughed employees return and the company strengthen. Times are tough...very tough. I tell anyone who will listen to me: make sure you have Plan B in place. Go to school, learn a trade, do whatever it takes to make sure you have something to fall back on in case you are furloughed or this ship goes down.

Good luck,
Art in MIA

 

[Flyboy4u]

STOP YOUR WHINING! What do you mean we don't know what you have to endure? I am on reserve with 17 years seniority. You are not a stewardess, you are a FAA REQUIRED live soul who can be easily replaced. Do not fool yourself for a moment that the company values you. If anybody knows what you go through it is those senior FA's who had crew scheduling in their crew rooms and could get away with nothing! Flight attendants like you are sickening to me. You are not a princess, you are a glorified busboy. Again, I say SUCK IT UP or QUIT.

AAStew....If you would read the start of these posts on here it has to do with the "So called Flexibility" of the job allowing those F/A's who decide they don't want to work their job in order to pursue another career, or to drop their schedule and not fly at all. Sorry you are on reserve with 17 years, but you get no sympathy from me..You SUCK it UP or Quit? Why don't you stand up to your fellow "Senior" F/A's who are sitting in a classroom right now getting a new career while you are working your a** off on reserve? Why don't you tell your fellow co-workers who haven't stepped foot on an airplane in over a year to do their job or get out? Let me guess, because they have "Earned" that right, correct?
I do my job as promised... I work the holidays as promised ,I am the first to take a trip assigned by scheduling on reserve, and I do it with pride, dignity and respect. There are many F/A's that love working with me..The letters from passengers and co-workers in my file tell the story. THe complainers are those like you who feel you have this "Seniority Complex" and have earned their right to do what they want. People like you who have "done their time", and shouldn't have too anymore...I know I will be in reserve the rest of my career. I know what my job entails and I do it. What I don't understand are those who feel that they have the "Right" not to step foot on an airplane, eventhough, that's their JOB!

 

[Skymess]

I won't live long enough to get transferred back to DFW.

If you transferred to LGA you would be in DFW before you knew it. People are constantly transferring into LGA from DFW to get off reserve. Get yourself out of STL and the horizons open wider. It's a dead end base. It might be an easy commute, but you're gonna be stuck there for the rest of your career if you don't leave.

 

[jimntx]

If you transferred to LGA you would be in DFW before you knew it. People are constantly transferring into LGA from DFW to get off reserve.

Well, those people must be sneaking into LGA without telling the company. After reading your post, I went to the Flight Service website and looked at the final transfer lists for the past year and a half going back to Jan07.

Counting the transfer that is effective 01JUN08, there have been 11 f/as who have transferred from LGA to DFW since 01JAN07. Only 2 of those were Domestic Mutual. The others were regular transfers; so, no one for one. The most junior person who held any transfer from LGA to DFW was seniority 16031 in Aug. of last year. At that time my seniority number was over 17000.
Remember a lot of people don't even bother putting their names on the list until a transfer is announced. Right now, I am just below #200 on the systemwide transfer list to DFW. The lowest I have been since I was recalled in NOV04 was about #150. When they had the transfer to DFW last June, on the day they announced the transfer, I was #195. The day they pulled the transfers I was #275.

 

[FA Mikey]

Again, I dont understand why you think the fact that a Flight Attendant who doesn't work at all is justified in keeping this job. If 100 people left tomorrow and the math dictated 1 less EPT instructor is needed because of that, then thats one less salary being payed resulting in money saved. How much?

So with your math, we have over 1,700 EPT instructor's. That seem like a lot to me.

I don't have the exact dollars for you Mikey but apparently that little mind of yours can't comprehend those simple FACTS.

You have no dollar and no facts to back up your statement.

You all on here talk about my attitude being so bad, Its the senior flight attendants like you Mikey who would rather throw all of us JR people out on the street again, so u can save your preciious "Flexibility" of not having to work..

You are the one who seems to think there is this massive amount of FA's who do not fly at all. I came here for the flexibility. I was junior once, oh wait I still am. My best guess is that since I stated I am 5 years junior to holding what I really want.

BTW....Have you ever worked another job besides being a Flight Attendant? I seriously doubt it.. Also. What 1/2 fact mis-truths and inuendos are u ranting about now?

Sure I have, I worked on when I started and was making 14 dollars an hour and was at a base with little to no open time available. I am starting a new career as well, I drop my month and pick up a few hightime turns here and there. Not to worry, I am leaving in 3 years when I will be eligible for the 25,000 early out.

Mis-truths, 1/2 facts? See all of your posts above. Ask your self, why can I not answer any honest questions posed to me. With real facts? See the first sentance in this paragraph.

 

[Flyboy4u]

So with your math, we have over 1,700 EPT instructor's. That seem like a lot to me.


You have no dollar and no facts to back up your statement.

You are the one who seems to think there is this massive amount of FA's who do not fly at all. I came here for the flexibility. I was junior once, oh wait I still am. My best guess is that since I stated I am 5 years junior to holding what I really want.

Sure I have, I worked on when I started and was making 14 dollars an hour and was at a base with little to no open time available. I am starting a new career as well, I drop my month and pick up a few hightime turns here and there. Not to worry, I am leaving in 3 years when I will be eligible for the 25,000 early out.

Mis-truths, 1/2 facts? See all of your posts above. Ask your self, why can I not answer any honest questions posed to me. With real facts? See the first sentance in this paragraph.

Mikey

You seem to be a very angry person..Do you actually have any common sense in your head?...You may not like what I say on these message boards because your hate for individuals on here is pretty apparent...However, if you actually got to know who I really am perhaps you understand it's OK to agree to disagree...In fact you might actually like me. Instead, you would rather rant about how misguided I am, I speak only 1/2 truths etc....You don't to like what I say on these boards, but you dont have to critiscize everything I post...You are the one who seems to be a very angry individual..I hope you do have a new career and are very successful at it.

BTW...Where do you get that i need dollar facts to back up what I am saying? Common sense dictates that if someone needs training then the person doing it (the training) is probably getting paid for it...I doubt that they are doing out of the goodness of their heart. There are individuals like you, on the line, who have never had to endure anything like "we" are currently enduring right now. Those individuals seniority ranges between 10 and 20 years at AA...THose over 20 years completley understand, and those under 10 years are living it. I am not saying everyone between 10 and 20 yrs ,but alot of them...These individuals feel like those JR to them owe them the world..That we should thank them for what they have done for us...Paved the way for us...Sorry, I don't feel that..I will work with you , we can laugh in the galley, cry on the jumpseat, and shake each others hands after the trip..I guarntee you will enjoy your experience on a trip with me, but if you expect me to cherish, and agree with every one of your statements about the company. It won't happen. If you expect me to thank you for your years of service, and for paving the way for us while you are out using your "Flexiblity" to not work .I wont...
Best of luck to you.

 

[BigBangTheory]

Mikey

You seem to be a very angry person..Do you actually have any common sense in your head?...You may not like what I say on these message boards because your hate for individuals on here is pretty apparent...However, if you actually got to know who I really am perhaps you understand it's OK to agree to disagree...In fact you might actually like me. Instead, you would rather rant about how misguided I am, I speak only 1/2 truths etc....You don't to like what I say on these boards, but you dont have to critiscize everything I post...You are the one who seems to be a very angry individual..I hope you do have a new career and are very successful at it.

BTW...Where do you get that i need dollar facts to back up what I am saying? Common sense dictates that if someone needs training then the person doing it (the training) is probably getting paid for it...I doubt that they are doing out of the goodness of their heart. There are individuals like you, on the line, who have never had to endure anything like "we" are currently enduring right now. Those individuals seniority ranges between 10 and 20 years at AA...THose over 20 years completley understand, and those under 10 years are living it. I am not saying everyone between 10 and 20 yrs ,but alot of them...These individuals feel like those JR to them owe them the world..That we should thank them for what they have done for us...Paved the way for us...Sorry, I don't feel that..I will work with you , we can laugh in the galley, cry on the jumpseat, and shake each others hands after the trip..I guarntee you will enjoy your experience on a trip with me, but if you expect me to cherish, and agree with every one of your statements about the company. It won't happen. If you expect me to thank you for your years of service, and for paving the way for us while you are out using your "Flexiblity" to not work .I wont...
Best of luck to you.

All you do is complain about everything. You are full of anger and hate! I have been flyimg for 17 years and yes, I am on reserve. Do I like it? No! Ypu have the glamorous life compared to what I did when I first was hired. If you hate it so much...quit!