ALPA/USAPA Thread for the Week 5/22 to 5/29

[commuter]

It will be sad to see the piloting profession's most experienced right seaters go back on furlough (again). What a career!

It would be sad to see any pilot furloughed, regardless of east or west. It's no picnic for those above them either......... What is your point here???

 

[20 YEAR FO]

Quit calling me a westy. I'am tired of the usapa rhetoric at this point. Show me the money! I want results. I sat on the fence for too long,expecting doh and a new contract by now. Oil is through the roof, I have NO doh and a better contract? A little late for that , don't you think? Am I the only easty getting a little bent? Some of you posters seem to be in the know. Fill me in with facts, and not the usual RA-RA crap I hear on the line. It's getting old, while the industry is getting worse.From what I hear, Parker is basically jerking usapa around. I feel sick being broke and in limbo with ZERO leverage. I heard the west has funded over a million dollars for legal fees to protect themselves from us imposing doh.They call it awapa/lenidas. I can't afford to write you guys checks , to end up in a long,expensive legal battle, and possibly sued.I know what Lee said. I'am trying to be real here people, I don't believe in shirting in one hand and wishing in the other.SHOW ME THE MONEY

 

[fr8tmastr]

Yea its been a month, where is my contract with a 25% raise.

20 year, your not fooling anyone.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

Quit calling me a westy. I'am tired of the usapa rhetoric at this point. Show me the money! I want results. I sat on the fence for too long,expecting doh and a new contract by now. Oil is through the roof, I have NO doh and a better contract? A little late for that , don't you think? Am I the only easty getting a little bent? Some of you posters seem to be in the know. Fill me in with facts, and not the usual RA-RA crap I hear on the line. It's getting old, while the industry is getting worse.From what I hear, Parker is basically jerking usapa around. I feel sick being broke and in limbo with ZERO leverage. I heard the west has funded over a million dollars for legal fees to protect themselves from us imposing doh.They call it awapa/lenidas. I can't afford to write you guys checks , to end up in a long,expensive legal battle, and possibly sued.I know what Lee said. I'am trying to be real here people, I don't believe in shirting in one hand and wishing in the other.SHOW ME THE MONEY

Are you saying you're not on the west side? Give me a break! I've read your posts. I haven't seen nor heard of ANY lawsuits yet. Where are they spending all of your "money"?

 

[nostradamus]

"Negotiations
You cannot disenfranchise one or a group of members at the bargaining table. Non-members who are assigned to your bargaining unit can be forced to pay dues to cover negotiations."



Duty of Fair Representation article.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Quit calling me a westy. I'am tired of the usapa rhetoric at this point. Show me the money! I want results. I sat on the fence for too long,expecting doh and a new contract by now. Oil is through the roof, I have NO doh and a better contract? A little late for that , don't you think? Am I the only easty getting a little bent? Some of you posters seem to be in the know. Fill me in with facts, and not the usual RA-RA crap I hear on the line. It's getting old, while the industry is getting worse.From what I hear, Parker is basically jerking usapa around. I feel sick being broke and in limbo with ZERO leverage. I heard the west has funded over a million dollars for legal fees to protect themselves from us imposing doh.They call it awapa/lenidas. I can't afford to write you guys checks , to end up in a long,expensive legal battle, and possibly sued.I know what Lee said. I'am trying to be real here people, I don't believe in shirting in one hand and wishing in the other.SHOW ME THE MONEY

Five weeks from opening the doors to a new DOH contract and a pay raise? What are you on?

USAPA never guaranteed anything to you, it was just a better bet to cover your 20 year f/o butt. Do you really think that had ALPA prevailed you would have a new pay raise and DOH by now? If ALPA had prevailed, a new contract would have been years in the making because your buddy 20 year f/o's would have never ratified an ALPA contract because of Nicolau.

 

[CactusFlyr]

Not only that, but USAPA may decide it needs to help the company in this time of crisis and give tacit approval to the November, 2005, Hemenway letter. The company already thinks it can use LOA 93 for the entire pilot group (per that Hemenway letter.) Without objection from the union, why not? For the east it would simply be business as usual. And think how much money the company would save in this time of need.

The easties have been demanding equal pay for equal work. Maybe USAPA and the company will finally agree on how to accomplish it in the short term.

(N.B. - Only members in good standing get to vote. Keep that dues money in your pocket. Have you heard the term: "Pissing into the wind"?)

You guys give yourself way to much credit, and authority for that matter. Your union is illegitimate and always will be. :blink:

 

[CactusFlyr]

I would think that there must be some levelheaded leader among the West pilots who is sick and tired of the amature-hour that has been the Prater administration and is prepared to offer the USAirways pilots true leadership.

Someone who sees the futility of clinging to the anchor of Nicalau and is ready to unite east and west. The West merger committee has continued to delude the West pilots into believing that they can deliver on his promises and that Nicalau will ever be a viable option in a joint contract. He has embraced the concept of whipsaw and has tried to convince his supporters that it only cuts one way.

How about an original thought for once instead of following like sheep, never mind.

 

[nycbusdriver]

You guys give yourself way to much credit, and authority for that matter. Your union is illegitimate and always will be. :blink:

Hmm. Did you suggest that to the NMB? They seem to have a different opinion.

NMB or CactusFlyr? NMB or CactusFlyr? NMB or CactusFlyr?

Which one to believe?????

It IS a puzzlement!

 

[luvn737s]

Do you really think that had ALPA prevailed you would have a new pay raise and DOH by now?

Had cooler heads prevailed, during mediation, ALPA could have provided a better contract to both sides before the current economic mess began. There would have been no Nicolau decision. If cooler heads had prevailed after Nicolau, ALPA still could have provided a much better contract in the remaining good times if USAPA had not used the fear of west integration to wedge itself into power.

Now the pilots of US are left with a broken and divided pilot group that may never heal. The cooler heads have been ignored and the self-serving principals of USAPA are left trying to convince everyone that ousting ALPA was worth the losses that both sides have and will suffer.

Bradford demands legitimacy with his Cartman-esqe "respect my authorityy" antics with Parker, but fails to deliver the real tangible benefits to those who elected him. Ironically, Bradford is proving to be even more in-over-his-head than Prater is. Both are demonstrating the difference between acting like a leader and really leading.

There are still pilot-leaders out there who could turn USAPA around simply by finding the common ground between east and west and divesting the divisive issues like DOH. A pragmatic solution that includes Nicolau and provides some protection for the east (although time has eaten up much of the need for that) would be win-win. USAPA could be a model and not a joke, but it would take the vast middle group of pilots to drown out the vocal extremes and move things forward with unified progress, not fear. The seeds of "majority rules" have produced nothing and the growing season has passed. Now is the time to prepare for the future and it will take a wholesale rejection of the past strategy to make it a future worth pursuing.

 

[CactusFlyr]

Hmm. Did you suggest that to the NMB? They seem to have a different opinion.

NMB or CactusFlyr? NMB or CactusFlyr? NMB or CactusFlyr?

Which one to believe?????

It IS a puzzlement!

If you want to get int the whole character assassination thing I can start talking about your sister, but that won't get us anywhere will it.

 

[sharktooth]

If you want to get int the whole character assassination thing I can start talking about your sister, but that won't get us anywhere will it.

How do you get "character assassination" out of that?

He said, who is more credible about legal status of a union, you or the NMB? If your character is intertwined in that I would suggest that you have more problems than you know.

 

[nycbusdriver]

How do you get "character assassination" out of that?

He said, who is more credible about legal status of a union, you or the NMB? If your character is intertwined in that I would suggest that you have more problems than you know.

But that's typical of the west. They make this stuff up, pulling it all out of nowhere, and think that if they yell it loud enough and long enough it somehow becomes true. Even a decree by the federal government doesn't seem to faze their illusions.

Not much one can do about folks like that except sit back and watch the show.

 

[elixir]

hmmm...20 year FO...thats original.
I recall reading that as a generality describing the East guys from the West.

For the sake of argument, lets assume he's "bonafide".....his points are not lost on me, but his issue is not with USAPA...it's actually with ALPA...and their lack of tangible protections /negotiations for him/her in the past.

This high intensity frustration is not unique to you, sir, everyone feels what you do...so recognize that, understand that, punch a pillow for an hour...then shut the hell up.

The simple fact is this...and you all better start wrapping your mind around it: with oil at $130+ and the economy in the $hitter.....we all better figure out a way to work this out...and soon.

Otherwise, all you "senior guys" both West and East might just get what you're proudly talking about....a "time-out" as in...BK...FUR...whatever.

Like it or not (mostly not..apparently) you have forcibly inherited each other (with the baggage)...and the future you anticipate is influenced by the other...therefore I suggest you work together to prevent you bumping into a (Eastie/Westie) in the unemployment line....

Time to wake up.

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Quit calling me a westy. I'am tired of the usapa rhetoric at this point. Show me the money! I want results. I sat on the fence for too long,expecting doh and a new contract by now. Oil is through the roof, I have NO doh and a better contract? A little late for that , don't you think? Am I the only easty getting a little bent? Some of you posters seem to be in the know. Fill me in with facts, and not the usual RA-RA crap I hear on the line. It's getting old, while the industry is getting worse.From what I hear, Parker is basically jerking usapa around. I feel sick being broke and in limbo with ZERO leverage. I heard the west has funded over a million dollars for legal fees to protect themselves from us imposing doh.They call it awapa/lenidas. I can't afford to write you guys checks , to end up in a long,expensive legal battle, and possibly sued.I know what Lee said. I'am trying to be real here people, I don't believe in shirting in one hand and wishing in the other.SHOW ME THE MONEY

Man, what a bunch of BS. Nice try though.