AAA Thread 10/26-11/1

[BoeingBoy]

Looks like the document makes it clear that the "the Association" is the MECs.

Repeating fantasies doesn't make them reality.....

If you want to believe that "AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION (hereinafter referred to as “the Associationâ€￾)" doesn't mean what it says, so be it. After all, your theory worked so well with the scope grievience.

Jim

 

[Phoenix]

Repeating fantasies doesn't make them reality.....

If you want to believe that "AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION (hereinafter referred to as “the Association”)" doesn't mean what it says, so be it. After all, your theory worked so well with the scope grievience.

Jim

"represented by the AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION (hereinafter referred to as “the Association”) by and through the Master Executive Councils of the America
West and US Airways pilots



"fantasy... 320" You need to keep your temper under control.
"the Association" means exactly what it says. "by and through the MECs" means exactly what it says.


Are you suggesting that the ALPA EC will refuse to remain neutral?

 

[BoeingBoy]

As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.....you just refuse to take the entire sentence's words into account and pick and choose some words as "proof" of what you want it to say.

"by and through the Master Executive Councils of the America West and US Airways pilots (“America West MECâ€￾ and “US Airways MECâ€￾ respectively)

Notice the part in parenthesis that you left out? The part that says that the East and West MEC's will be referred to as "_____ _____ MEC"?

When the transition agreement uses "the association", it refers to "ALPA ("AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION (hereinafter
referred to as “the Associationâ€￾)".

When the transition agreement uses "MEC" it refers to "through the Master Executive Councils of the America
West and US Airways pilots (“America West MECâ€￾ and “US Airways MECâ€￾ respectively)"

The language concerning withdrawing from JNC talks says "either the Association or the Airline Parties may decide to suspend negotiations". It doesn't say anything about a "MEC" suspending negotiations.

Just like the scope grievience, where the language is "The Airline Parties collectively and the Association,...". How did reading that to mean "MEC" work out?

Jim

 

[Phoenix]

As the saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.....

..work out....?

Jim

Bingo.

It is too early to make any judgements about what is worked out about anything. What do they say about you don't know until you retire. And even that has now been ammended at the hands of ALPA.

 

[Cactus737]

I can recall several times the AWA MEC verbally attacked the AWAPA's attempted raid, and they were less of a threat than USAPA.

Says who?

 

[AAA73Pilot]

If you're referring to Jack's letter dated October 17 then I've read it.

In the MEC Airwaves, or maybe I should have said commentary instead of letter. Still a good read to satisfy the "Half hearted" part.

 

[Bear96]

"represented by the AIR LINE PILOTS ASSOCIATION (hereinafter referred to as “the Associationâ€￾) by and through the Master Executive Councils of the America
West and US Airways pilots
. . .
"the Association" means exactly what it says. "by and through the MECs" means exactly what it says. . . .

Wow. Is it really possible for someone to be in this degree of denial? Especially someone as intelligent as an airline pilot?

Wait a minute. I think I just figured it out. Phoenix / EastUS is not really an East pilot who supports USAPA at all. He is really someone who sees how ridiculous the USAPA / USA320pilot et al position is, and has very cleverly used his posts over the last few months and employed the devices of parody and self-satire to show the absurdity of it. Phoenix / EastUS is a caricature!

Well done. You had us fooled for quite a while.

At least I hope this is the case. No rational person could twist logic and facts (and the law) to this degree.

 

[Piedmont1984]

Well then, what's the delay? Why isn't ALPA national on our property running our MEC with their own people? Let them do it, they haven't pissed enough of us off yet. Let's stop talking the talk.

 

[twoturnin]

With the treat of Trusteeship---USAPA* etc etc I bet the next thing we see juicy looking to keep ALPO on property is a big fat raise offer---many side /relief letters on fourlough etc etc----just to keep the fence sitters happy----some classmates(well ok the ones that havent quit)still have 10 yrs to go--thats who I feel for.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

Folks,

I have think we seen a good demonstration of how USAPA, illustrated by AAA73, will, if elected, conduct their business. No different than ALPA or any other organization! USAPA supporters have free reign to say whatever they want without being encumbered by legalities. The obfuscation over the transition agreement wording just highlights that USAPA has no interest in telling the truth, recognizing the truth, submitting to the truth or most importantly telling those that they would represent the clear, unbiased facts.

USAPA, with the backing of their pilots, will do and say anything to twist the argument in their favor no matter if it is beneficial to their future membership. This is the same thing that the AAA MEC is and has been doing for years. It is the very thing that USAPA rails against yet they are already doing the exact same thing that they say justifies booting ALPA.

If USAPA is elected I would suggest that one of the first resolutions should be that no current or former ALPA MEC member, officer or committee volunteer is eligible to serve in the leadership and committee structure for a period of 10 years.

We don't need a new union. We need fresh blood who hasn't been tainted by any union service. It doesn't matter if it is ALPA or USAPA. Once the realities of the situation confront whoever and whatever union is in service then the story changes dramatically from this utopia that USAPA advertises. The AAA MEC hasn't been dealing with realities and I am confident that the same old ALPA people who will be running the new USAPA will not deal with it either. I'm not buying it. I don't want to hear what any union promises me. I want to hear what they can deliver whether it be good or bad. And right now no union is in a position to deliver much.

Bob

 

[exB717Flyer]

Well then, what's the delay? Why isn't ALPA national on our property running our MEC with their own people?

For the same reason Prater humored you all summer before telling you unequivocally that binding means binding: he's playing for time. And like before, you guys never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

 

[twoturnin]

with myself only 8 months to go but thinking of classmates dilemma---->>talking to recall dude who's father is/was steel workers union officialdom---his father "thinks" that if ALPO is thrown off property then any award made through/whatever with ALPO's scent on it is throw out-----is that correct or not even close ----would seem like a giant selling point for USAPA.

 

[Frank Bama]

with myself only 8 months to go but thinking of classmates dilemma---->>talking to recall dude who's father is/was steel workers union officialdom---his father "thinks" that if ALPO is thrown off property then any award made through/whatever with ALPO's scent on it is throw out-----is that correct or not even close ----would seem like a giant selling point for USAPA.

NOT EVEN CLOSE

 

[Phoenix]

Folks,

I have think we seen a good demonstration of how USAPA, illustrated by AAA73, will, if elected, conduct their business.

Bob, that is the funniest post I have seen in a long time.

You take the words of an anonymous poster on a website called "usaviation.com" and presume to know what USAPA's position is...

USAPA, with the backing of their pilots, will do and say anything to twist the argument in their favor no matter if it is beneficial to their future membership. This is the same thing that the AAA MEC is and has been doing for years.....

ALPA has been twisting the argument in their favor for years??? Well lets see... how many at ALPA national have taken 50% paycuts? How many have been furloughed? How many are loosing vacation and medical bennies? How many have lost their pension, even after they retired? WOW. What argument are they twisting? The one about how the pilots need to negotiate against themselves for twenty years to save the profession? You might have had a point if you had said ALPA ignores their own pilots no matter what and twist the argument for their own benefit, for decades.

We don't need a new union. We need fresh blood who hasn't been tainted by any union service.

Why do you need new reps? Don't they always listen to the argument of the pilots (that can be discovered by reading a couple of posts on usaviation.com). After all, no matter who gets elected they are going to fall in line with the two posters on this board. Aren't they??

This place is a riot. I get accused of being usa320, then of being EastUS, and now someone has fantasies of knowing USAPA's position by way of another poster here on usaviaiton.com.

A never ending source of amusement.

 

[Phoenix]

with myself only 8 months to go but thinking of classmates dilemma---->>talking to recall dude who's father is/was steel workers union officialdom---his father "thinks" that if ALPO is thrown off property then any award made through/whatever with ALPO's scent on it is throw out-----is that correct or not even close ----would seem like a giant selling point for USAPA.

Whoever represents the pilots will be sued by whoever didn't vote for them. That is a given.