2014 Pilot Discussion

[traderjake]

From reading the PIC update you seem to be talking about the Silver Eagles suit.

 
You're right, I'm wrong.
 
 
 Pension Investigation Committee Update

Jul. 09, 2014
 


Dear Pilots:
 
It has come to our attention that there is some confusion regarding our planned appeal of the recent ruling in our case against the PBGC, and the recent developments in the Soaring Eagles case. Although both cases involve pilots of US Airways, and both cases were brought against the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (“PBGC”), the two cases are very different substantively, and are at very different procedural points.
 
The Soaring Eagles case involved claims by retired pilots of US Airways, which basically challenged the pension calculations and distributions PBGC made following the termination of the pilots plan. The Soaring Eagles challenge was unsuccessful at the trial court level, was unsuccessful at the appellate level, and the US Supreme Court has refused to review the appellate court decision. As such, the Soaring Eagles case is essentially over.
 
Our case against PBGC -- for breach of fiduciary duty with regard to the agency’s service as trustee of our terminated plan -- is still ongoing. In an earlier update, we informed you of last month’s decision by Judge Frederic Scullin in our case and explained the positives and negatives of that decision. In a recent meeting, the Board of Pilot Representatives reaffirmed its authorization for the pursuit of an appeal of Judge Scullin’s decision, and we intend to move forward with that appeal this month
.
We anticipate briefing on the appeal will extend over a period of several months, that the case will be argued several months following the completion of the briefing, and that our appeal will be decided several months after argument. While not assured, we hope to have a ruling from the appellate court within 12 -18 months from the filing of our notice of appeal.
 
Please feel free to be in touch with any member of the Pension Investigation Committee if you have any questions or concerns about our appeal. In any event, we will keep you updated as our appeal progresses.
 
Sincerely,
The Pension Investigation Committee

 

[nycbusdriver]

 
Appealed to whom?
 
High court denies US Airways pilots’ request in pension case
By Terry Maxon tmaxon@dallasnews.com
10:18 am on June 30, 2014 | Permalin

"In a decision released Monday, the U.S. Supreme Court declined to review a case in which US Airways pilots were challenging the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp.’s calculation of their benefits.

The prolonged case stems from US Airways’ termination of its pension plan more than 10 years ago, giving the pilots’ pension responsibility to the PBGC. The pilots were appealing a decision from the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in the District of Columbia."

 
That's the Soaring Eagles case.  Not USAPAs.
 
TRY to keep up.  But a TV set.

 

[traderjake]

 
But a TV set.

 
I won't be doing that.

 

[Freighterguynow]

 
"ALPA’s Team Approach to Negotiations
The best way to put more pay in your paycheck, get better work rules and
improved quality of life, grow your pension, and get stronger scope language in
your contract is to turn to ALPA—the best pilot negotiating support team ever
assembled. Learn more…

[/quote]

A little birdie once told me ALPA EF and A did not answer nor return a single phone call from the US Airways guys during the last 2 weeks ending in the pension being terminated.

 

[Phoenix]

Neil Roghair, Allied Pilots Association VP is not a reliable source of information?

 
 
Neil Roghair talking to a known airline journalist, in order to be published, is by definition a strategy of negotiating.  But really... don't we already know the APA and their desires.  Who is surprised?  You want to discredit John Davis because he won't pay for your company pension, and the APA wants to staple.  What's new?  😀
 
On other hand, there is no way that an arbitrator will here anything until a judge compels it (both the issue(s) to be arbitrated and the parties compelled to participate).  But again, what's new?  

 

[Phoenix]

 
That's the Soaring Eagles case.  Not USAPAs.
 
TRY to keep up.  But a TV set.

Is Alex Jones on TV?  

 

[Claxon]

Holly Hegeman's Comments: July 8, 2014
 
 


Before we get to Laura, last week I had a chance to run a few questions past Neil Roghair, Allied Pilots Association VP, about how things look on the pilot side of the house.
The most burning question that everyone is asking of course is about the seniority question. Is there any chance that there will be a negotiated seniority agreement?
Neil's answer? No.
"There is zero chance of a negotiated seniority list. It is the most complex integration in the history of seniority integrations. But that isn't to say that there might not be a few issues that we negotiate which trim down the issues for the arbitrators to address," he explained.

Roghair will be remembered as the American Airlines F/O 1999 hire who allowed an arbitrator to open up the 777 fleet and 767 fleet to the east and west pilots. Eric Auxier will be remembered as the america west pilot who produced those wacky videos. Eric Ferguson will be remembered as the west pilot who sucked millions away from his fellow pilots. For nothing.
Mike Cleary will forever be remembered for destroying the Nicolau, and positioning the east pilots for 777 bids and huge attrition.

 

[traderjake]

 
You want to discredit John Davis because he won't pay for your company pension, and the APA wants to staple.  What's new?   😀

 
You were duped by John Davis  and his ilk and yet you still defend them.  What's new?

 

[Phoenix]

 
You were duped by John Davis  and his ilk and yet you still defend them.  What's new?

 
You adore Chip but not John.  What do you expect from everyone else?  You wouldn't be happy if everyone agreed with you. 😀
 
Chip, John, and I won't pay for your pension.... That triad has gotta make your head hurt.  😀

 

[Claxon]

doug and scott need all of the involved pilots cooperation.  You decide if you want to be bent over or standing in front of them, during these opportunistic type communication experiences. 
 
Take advantage of watching other videos listed to your right of the one playing. 
 
SZYMANSKI, Wilder and Seham. Attorney Labor Geniuses.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYG7_21wW6w&index=13&list=PL06m41A7I7KgzZm-UKznxlD5UNouP-DuR

 

[traderjake]

 
You adore Chip but not John.  What do you expect from everyone else?  You wouldn't be happy if everyone agreed with you. 😀
 

 
You were played by John and his ilk and still don't realize it.

 

[Phoenix]

 
You were played by John and his ilk and still don't realize it.

 
 
Chip, John, and I won't pay for your pension, and neither will the company.   That alliance makes your head explode, even if the tooth fairy were to magically restore your pension that 13 ALPA reps forgave.  

 

[snapthis]

Roghair will be remembered as the American Airlines F/O 1999 hire who allowed an arbitrator to open up the 777 fleet and 767 fleet to the east and west pilots. Eric Auxier will be remembered as the america west pilot who produced those wacky videos. Eric Ferguson will be remembered as the west pilot who sucked millions away from his fellow pilots. For nothing.
Mike Cleary will forever be remembered for destroying the Nicolau, and positioning the east pilots for 777 bids and huge attrition.

Mike, would you like your bust to be placed in the entrance to the soon to be busted Usapian HQ? Would you like an urn where one can worship at Usapian temple of dupe? The Church of LBS.

Let Courtney know I found out about the LBS faith on the internet......

"The Legacy Airline pilot Belief system. This Legacy Belief System (LBS) incorporates a certain hierarchy of entitlement and position within the industry ranking system amongst pilots based on aircraft type, airline and LOS/DOH. The hierarchy is Legacy, Major, Regional; legacy subcategory shifts but is currently Delta, AMR, United, SWA then the dead legaciesTWA, Eastern etc. The East did not mouth off to DAL in 2006 because DAL was Top Dog. Then you have wide body vs. narrow and DOH, which is why the EAST introduce themselves as wide body international Captain before speaking to Dougthey are displaying their rank in the LBS. FEDEX and UPS trump legacy airlines.

The LBS provides the justification for pilot on pilot violence, be it stapling TWA, AWA, AirTran during mergers or wide body vs. narrow or senior vs. junior pilot groups during contract negotiation strategies (UEL vs. RC4 at AAA). They believe only the best pilots were selected at their airline and everyone else just did not cut the mustard during the interview process. The losers went somewhere else, somewhere else being a lesser airline within the belief system hierarchy of airlines.

According to the belief system, no matter how bad it is in a legacy, no other place is as good, regardless of contract superiority. Pay defines status amongst the legacy pilot mind, which is why being highest paid during some point in history is worn like a credentialing badge of honor defining the pecking order amongst the big 3 legacy airline pilot groups. This bias and belief system is written into our MOU, as we are compared to DAL and UAL pay. The pay thingy does not apply if a major airline contract pays more than a legacy contract as in AWA vs. AAA because legacy trumps major. Even liquidating airlines or liquidated legacies trump major in this LBS Collective Mind as we continuously see.

The LBS provides the justification to abuse power to backstab lesser groups for money or use them as furlough fodder via staple because as lesser pilots, they are waiting in line to some day be lucky enough to be a Legacy Pilot. Non-legacy pilots are Rookies, period. James Anderson explained the LBS to Silver in his manifesto letter. While LBS provides the moral justification for abuse, Pilot Numbers provide the power to execute and apply this system of Airline Pilot Crow on other, lesser pilots. How far they go down the slope depends upon the groups core values development; we were wed to the bottom feeders in this area, unfortunately.

Unfortunately, in every step of arbitration and litigation, we battle this belief system of prejudice. We battle it in the public media too. Good old Ted biases the public every other month or so and that public might include judges. Only the fear of lawsuits keeps things in check, a fact recognized by legacy pilots too as evidenced by them putting paragraph 10 in the MOU as a risk mitigation strategy as they commit DFR to uphold the LBS and their position within it."

 

[snapthis]

James Anderson, a loyal LBS member was slapped by Judge Silver:

IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
FOR THE DISTRICT OF ARIZONA
Don Addington, et al.,
Plaintiffs,
vs.
US Airline Pilots Association, et al.,
Defendants.
)))))))))))
No. CV-13-00471-PHX-ROS
ORDER
The Court recently received another letter from a pilot. That letter will be docketed,
as was a prior letter from a different pilot. (Doc. 198). These letters are not appropriate and
the parties will be directed to communicate to all pilots that no additional letters should be
sent. In the event the Court receives future letters, they will be returned to sender rather than
docketed.
Accordingly,
IT IS ORDERED the parties shall immediately communicate to all pilots that they
should not send letters directly to the Court and any letters will be immediately returned to
sender.
DATED this 26th day of November, 2013.

 

[Phoenix]

Mike, would you like your bust to be placed in the entrance to the soon to be busted Usapian HQ? Would you like an urn where one can worship at Usapian temple of dupe? The Church of LBS.
Let Courtney know I found out about the LBS faith on the internet......
"The Legacy Airline pilot Belief system. This Legacy Belief System (LBS) incorporates a certain hierarchy of entitlement and position within the industry ranking system amongst pilots based on aircraft type, airline and LOS/DOH. The hierarchy is Legacy, Major, Regional; legacy subcategory shifts but is currently Delta, AMR, United, SWA then the dead legaciesTWA, Eastern etc. The East did not mouth off to DAL in 2006 because DAL was Top Dog. Then you have wide body vs. narrow and DOH, which is why the EAST introduce themselves as wide body international Captain before speaking to Dougthey are displaying their rank in the LBS. FEDEX and UPS trump legacy airlines.
The LBS provides the justification for pilot on pilot violence, be it stapling TWA, AWA, AirTran during mergers or wide body vs. narrow or senior vs. junior pilot groups during contract negotiation strategies (UEL vs. RC4 at AAA). They believe only the best pilots were selected at their airline and everyone else just did not cut the mustard during the interview process. The losers went somewhere else, somewhere else being a lesser airline within the belief system hierarchy of airlines.
According to the belief system, no matter how bad it is in a legacy, no other place is as good, regardless of contract superiority. Pay defines status amongst the legacy pilot mind, which is why being highest paid during some point in history is worn like a credentialing badge of honor defining the pecking order amongst the big 3 legacy airline pilot groups. This bias and belief system is written into our MOU, as we are compared to DAL and UAL pay. The pay thingy does not apply if a major airline contract pays more than a legacy contract as in AWA vs. AAA because legacy trumps major. Even liquidating airlines or liquidated legacies trump major in this LBS Collective Mind as we continuously see.
The LBS provides the justification to abuse power to backstab lesser groups for money or use them as furlough fodder via staple because as lesser pilots, they are waiting in line to some day be lucky enough to be a Legacy Pilot. Non-legacy pilots are Rookies, period. James Anderson explained the LBS to Silver in his manifesto letter. While LBS provides the moral justification for abuse, Pilot Numbers provide the power to execute and apply this system of Airline Pilot Crow on other, lesser pilots. How far they go down the slope depends upon the groups core values development; we were wed to the bottom feeders in this area, unfortunately.
Unfortunately, in every step of arbitration and litigation, we battle this belief system of prejudice. We battle it in the public media too. Good old Ted biases the public every other month or so and that public might include judges. Only the fear of lawsuits keeps things in check, a fact recognized by legacy pilots too as evidenced by them putting paragraph 10 in the MOU as a risk mitigation strategy as they commit DFR to uphold the LBS and their position within it."

Yes, new material for your next video production. Harry Potter will be jealous.