US Pilots Labor Thread 4/7 to 4/14- ALL US Pilots Labor Issues Here

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Usapa looks to be bent on destroying itself. That rico suit was defensive, and I'm the Queen of England.

Des Snoopo, the rico suit was all about destroying the west pilots ability to bring a legal challenge to usapa's end run around the nicolau award. The 18 individuals were pawns. All in all, pretty disgusting.

 

[cleardirect]

The intent of the RICO was to stop the harassment. It worked. The $700/defendant was a gift. The 17 looked that gift-horse in the mouth and said no. They still have $5000 each at stake, with time running out to counter-sue. But if they want to go that route, fine. They can shell out another $5000 to sue USAPA.

Pay close attention here snoop. It was a TOTAL of less then $700. Not each. Most were offered no cost. There was no gift in that BS offer.

Did Seham hand out some more legal advice? Incorrect legal advice? Time running out on a counter suit? Better check again.

Who cares? The final accounting wont come out until Sep 2010, if all the appeals are over by then. Thanks for kicking in 1/3. Thats a good thing.

September 2010? Did you even read your new constitution?

SECTION 6. FISCAL YEAR
The fiscal year of the Association shall be from April 1 to March 31.

Do you really think that the DOL would let usapa run for two years without bringing out an LM-2? Last one was filed in Sep 2008. Covered two months. Besides how are you going to charge all of the objector germane fees without know and PROVING those fees?

Really there are steps to posting.

Read, understand, THINK, then respond.

It doesnt make any difference how many west members there are. DFR/Empire/RICO bills will be paid out of union dues/agency fees. Youll pay 1/3. "Some damages maybe?" Dream on. Wheres the loss? Were awaiting arbitration results that should get every original AWA pilot back to work. Tazz gets his CA seat back too. If WE (EAST AND WEST) win, thats a good thing. Isnt it? Or maybe youd rather have the arbitrations lose and keep pilots who got screwed by the company on the streets.

Some damages would be the part of the trial that starts right after the conclusion of the DFR trial. If the Susie arbitration goes our way the west may not have to pay dues or fees from April 08 till Dec 08. How does that work for your 1/3 math?

I agree that if usapa wins the grievances on block hours and RJ that is a good thing and could bring back many furloughed west pilots.

Just for the record, McIlvenna fired the 1st shot while he was still MEC Chairman, pledging the destruction of USAPA before it was elected. The Cactus 18 picked up on his call to arms. AWAPPA paid the legal fees of the AWAPPA leadership, but left the 18 high and dry. West leadership you can count on. Snooper-doo

Rhetoric is one thing. Filing a $90 million dollar law suit is another. Disregarding binding arbitration I would call that the first shot.

 

[prechilill]

Thanks, hp. I enjoy read your legal opinions and research. Dont always agree with you, but I doubt if I ever flamed you. You never flamed me. The only "issues" we might have are in Prechilils imagination. She tends to use a scatter-gun to blast here way thru the boards. Curious how she was off the board from November til yesterday, roughly same time Susie started her no-dues campaign til her arbitration was over.

You guys out east all really look, walk, quack alike around here so it gets a little confusing keeping track of who said what...
How is your yellow lanyard working out these days???

 

[nic4us]

Just for the record, McIlvenna fired the 1st shot while he was still MEC Chairman, pledging the destruction of USAPA before it was elected. Snooper-doo

Snoop,

I would say the first shoot was fired by the east when they stormed Herndon, then filed a law suit in the D.C. court. You can counter that was not USAPA, but it makes little difference to the West. USAPA=East from the West perspective.

On a completely different note, I always find it amusing the way you sign off using variations on your screen name.

Happy Easter

 

[Pi brat]

Im sure Schoppaul will be a shoe-in winner. We havent forgotten his barnyard animal references and 14-part U-Tube classic.

Snoop,

You are kind of sugar coating his video. For those that were lucky enough to miss it, it had scenes of US pilots in uniform followed by a goat sodomizing a guy. If he gets even 1 vote it will say a lot about those that voted for him.

 

[Pi brat]

I do not understand your reasoning here, please elaborate.

Are you saying tiger would be fuloughed using the Nic, or are you saying tiger's seniority is of no consequence as compared to any east pilots?

Are the six furloughed pilots, hired on out West then re-furloughed still working east? Because no matter how you slice it Tiger was working at the time of the merger, they were not. So if they are still working, they have in effect taken Tigers job.

All parts of the TA are not complete, so he is being furloughed no matter what list will be used. He is bidding what his seniority bought him. The Nic award means nothing until officially put in to place, it's numbers on paper.

The six pilots were hired by US, not AWA. Thy were allowed to be recalled to the west, then go back east. Tiger never had a job on the east, they did. They never filled an AWA pilot's job on the west, just took a new hires position, right? Since Tiger does not have a number on the east list, if he came east absent a completed sen. list he would be taking an east pilot's job. Did the east pilots use their east or Nic number on the west, or were they put on the bottom? If we didn't have pilots furloughed on the east I would support west pilots coming east before hiring pilots.

 

[nic4us]

The six pilots were hired by US, not AWA. Thy were allowed to be recalled to the west, then go back east. Tiger never had a job on the east, they did. They never filled an AWA pilot's job on the west, just took a new hires position, right? Since Tiger does not have a number on the east list, if he came east absent a completed sen. list he would be taking an east pilot's job. Did the east pilots use their east or Nic number on the west, or were they put on the bottom? If we didn't have pilots furloughed on the east I would support west pilots coming east before hiring pilots.

Thanks for the reply I understand your train of thought.

Tiger may not of had an east number but we have furloughed pilots who did. They were hired at AWA prior to the merger while furloughed from AAA. They were forced to pick between Nic and their east number once the Nic list was completed, not implemented. To me it does not seem fair they are now furloughed while the six I mention get a little special treatment.

According to the TA, the company would have to recall any furloughed West prior to hiring from the street on the east. It could be argued they would have to recall West pilots to the east, prior to recalling furloughed east new hires.

For now lets just hope we win some arbitrations and have some recall issues to deal with.

 

[electricjet98]

The six pilots were hired by US, not AWA. Thy were allowed to be recalled to the west, then go back east.

I can find where the TA allows recalling of furloughed east pilots to the west. Obviously since the east also hired "new-hires" after the recalls were complete, the six east pilots recalled to the west preferred their west placement...commuting, money, whatever. However after choosing to be recalled to the west they were allowed to transfer to the east prior to their furlough from the west. I can't seem to find anything in the TA allowing transfers...maybe you can help us all out on that one? Please tell me that it was not some sort of extra-contractual collusion between the Bradford Bunch and Flight op's management (former east pilots) to help these six USAPA fans!

 

[BoeingBoy]

Apparently no one thought that West would be furloughing during the period of separate ops when they wrote those sections, since you're right. There is no provision for a former furloughed East pilot who accepts recall to a West position to return to the East before separate ops ends, much less to return to the East while East is furloughing. Since former East furloughees who accepted recall to a position at West are considered junior to all West pilots but senior to all new hire pilots, they should be furloughed after all new hires (both sides) but before any West pilots.

Somehow that changed to allow those East furloughees who took positions at HP and later faced furlough to transfer to the East during separate ops as long as there were junior East or new hire pilots still working at East. Since the company screwed up the whole furlough thing, I'm not so sure that it was collusion between USAPA and the company as much as it was just part of the company screwup.

Jim

 

[ClueByFour]

This two-sided nightmare will unfold over the next few months in court/appal, not on this board.
However it ends, Ill live with it. I hope you can.

You know that court really is final and binding, right?

You cannot "flying mulligan" the court.

 

[nycbusdriver]

You know that court really is final and binding, right?

Of course you mean the appeals court, right?

 

[Tiger 1050]

Of course you mean the appeals court, right?

Appeal is not automatic. The Ninth Circuit must agree to hear your appeal.

 

[Metroyet]

Of course you mean the appeals court, right?

You mean the very same court that last week DENIED usapas final attempt at an "emergency" stay?

 

[BoeingBoy]

Appeal is not automatic. The Ninth Circuit must agree to hear your appeal.

HP-FA can certainly give a better explanation, but my understanding is that an appeal doesn't get heard just because one side or the other doesn't like the lower courts decision. There must be some evidence to support a claim that the lower court judge misapplied the law before the Appeals Court will hear the appeal.

Jim

 

[Tiger 1050]

HP-FA can certainly give a better explanation, but my understanding is that an appeal doesn't get heard just because one side or the other doesn't like the lower courts decision. There must be some evidence to support a claim that the lower court judge misapplied the law before the Appeals Court will hear the appeal.

Jim

That's how I understand it too Jim.