US Pilots labor thread 4/17-

[aquagreen73s]

Silence from the East posters.

Reality must be setting in.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

Silence from the East posters.

Reality must be setting in.

Just hang on a little bit, one of them will be along shortly with one of those cool links.

 

[CallawayGolf]

USAPA Legal Update


Today, Friday, April 23rd, the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled to deny the motion to stay the District Court injunction as well as the emergency motion recently filed by USAPA. The Circuit Court also ordered that their denial of the emergency request was without prejudice, meaning that USAPA is free to bring its motion back to the District Court at anytime going forward. This ruling was not entirely unexpected given the context, since it follows the public announcement that the merger discussions between United and US Airways have been terminated, which was the basis for the emergency motion.

In its motion, USAPA was reacting to public announcements, and as a merger remains a possibility USAPA is prepared to renew its request as needed going forward. The ruling has no impact on the pending merits of the appeal. As we previously communicated to the pilots, the District Court in February stayed all lower court proceedings pending a decision by the Ninth Circuit, leaving only the injunction. Also, as it has been almost 5 months since USAPA’s oral argument, a full decision is expected from the Ninth Circuit sooner than later.

A copy of the Ninth Circuit’s ruling will be posted shortly to the Legal Library on the USAPA web site.

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Ya gotta love the spin. Like the judges were somehow influenced by the merger rumors.

Why is it every time USAPA loses in court they come out with a statement that the loss was not entirely unexpected? Could one say that USAPA leaders were "supremely confident" that they were going to lose? Funny, I was supremely confident they were going to lose too.

 

[Metroyet]

Silence from the East posters.

Reality must be setting in.

There's nothing for them to worry about...as predicted, the official USAPA communique said so. USAPA claims that the dual denials have no bearing on the outcome of their appeal to the 9th. Sure. It's a good sign that the court refused to relieve USAPAs perceived burden. $eham has been planning on this and everything is falling into place perfectly....according to Lee $eham. It's all a good sign and gives NO INDICATION as to what the 9th is thinking.

Sleep Well Easties. Nothing is wrong here. Reed Richards is right. This is just two MORE wins for $eham and the brain trust running USAPA. Great Job $eham! Keep up the expert legal coun$el!!

Hopefully USAPA sent out all the sec.29 letters this week. Honestly, for all the expert services that USAPA and Lee $eham have provided over the last two years, nobody should be reluctant to pay 2% (ALPA rate) for such experti$e. With any luck, USAPA will be able to threaten the careers and families of their own membership adequately enough to force payment to Lee $eham. He'$ worth all that ca$h.

Deep breaths Easties:

DOH is the gold standard, and it was all ALPA's fault. Nothing is wrong here.

Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong........

 

[HP2USFA]

Wow. I'm shocked there hasn't been a single reply from the East camp. BS, Veritas, Mutandis, Hate... they all in the cornfield or just speechless?

 

[Coach Cabin]

Wow. I'm shocked there hasn't been a single reply from the East camp. BS, Veritas, Mutandis, Hate... they all in the cornfield or just speechless?

They have slinked off to an undisclosed viper pit in the east to nest with the other "disappeareds" such as Megasnoop, EastUS, NicStoleMyJob, et. al. Rest assured they will resurface to spew their venon again, very possibly under new screen names. Meanwhile the beacons of of truth such as Nic4us, Cleardirect , Metroyet and others will continue to shine through.

 

[HP2USFA]

Indeed. The future should be interesting to say the least 🙂

 

[oscarjazz]

There's nothing for them to worry about...as predicted, the official USAPA communique said so. USAPA claims that the dual denials have no bearing on the outcome of their appeal to the 9th. Sure. It's a good sign that the court refused to relieve USAPAs perceived burden. $eham has been planning on this and everything is falling into place perfectly....according to Lee $eham. It's all a good sign and gives NO INDICATION as to what the 9th is thinking.

Sleep Well Easties. Nothing is wrong here. Reed Richards is right. This is just two MORE wins for $eham and the brain trust running USAPA. Great Job $eham! Keep up the expert legal coun$el!!

Hopefully USAPA sent out all the sec.29 letters this week. Honestly, for all the expert services that USAPA and Lee $eham have provided over the last two years, nobody should be reluctant to pay 2% (ALPA rate) for such experti$e. With any luck, USAPA will be able to threaten the careers and families of their own membership adequately enough to force payment to Lee $eham. He'$ worth all that ca$h.

Deep breaths Easties:

DOH is the gold standard, and it was all ALPA's fault. Nothing is wrong here.

Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong here
Nothing is wrong........

It reminds me of Kevin Bacon in Animal House. "ALL IS WELL, STAY CALM."

 

[aquagreen73s]

Given the time of day that the order was published, early afternoon, I'm wondering if we'll have an opinion on Monday now. Opinions are published by 10AM on the day they are to be released. The blanket denial of USAPA's stay which was filed 8 months ago clearly telegraphs which way the court is going to rule, but those orders are released at any time of the day. So perhaps the panel got together one last time yesterday morning, signed the opinion and sent it on its way through normal channels for publishing (the following business day by 10AM which would be Monday) and then released the order denying the stay.

 

[Freebird]

Wow. I'm shocked there hasn't been a single reply from the East camp. BS, Veritas, Mutandis, Hate... they all in the cornfield or just speechless?

Thats because they are all the same person.

 

[hp_fa]

Given the time of day that the order was published, early afternoon, I'm wondering if we'll have an opinion on Monday now.

I'm not sure that I fully buy into that because they still may be writing, proofing and re-writing. I do agree that the Order released on Friday is an indication that the 9th is not buying into Seham's argument and, IMO more importantly, his tactics. It seems to me that he has gone out of his way to provide reasons for every court to decide they have had enough of his methods, which clearly go beyond the applicable rules. The latest example is him bypassing the trial court, who clearly still had jurisdiction over the injunction and decides issues of fact, and filing that Emergency Motion directly with Court of Appeals who only **review** issues of law..

 

[aquagreen73s]

The Monday morning date for an opinion was just a guess. What's apparent is that the judges agree that the injunction should not be stayed, period. That decision was not made in a vacuum; due consideration was given as to how the panel was going to rule with respect to the parties, otherwise the decision to deny the stay would be in direct conflict with an opinion that either reverses or remands back to the trial court. The stickier issue for the judges (my guess) is the wording of the decision because that's where the ideological fractures will be seen. Bybee is on the opposite end of the spectrum from Graber. It's easy to see how they can agree as to the parties just like nine Arizonians from all walks of life were able to agree very quickly, but an opinion makes case law that affects our entire system of governance and commerce. It would have been awesome to listen in on the Graber-Bybee jousting over the case law being formulated. Regardless, the staying of the first injunction at at time when a decision is about due on the merits is telling. We'll see, and probably very soon. Hopefully Monday!

I respectfully disagree that what's motivating the decisions in favor of the West - it's not Seham's tactics. I agree with you that the 9th isn't buying Seham's "ripeness doesn't begin until ratification" argument, but his tactics are nevertheless on the periphery. They don't affect the core legal issues IMO. What the 9th does know is that the trial judge is best suited and equipped to deal with the Seham tactics. All the 9th has to do is send the case back to "the desert judge" and he'll take it from there.

 

[hp_fa]

I respectfully disagree that what's motivating the decisions in favor of the West - it's not Seham's tactics. I agree with you that the 9th isn't buying Seham's "ripeness doesn't begin until ratification" argument, but his tactics are nevertheless on the periphery. They don't affect the core legal issues IMO. What the 9th does know is that the trial judge is best suited and equipped to deal with the Seham tactics. All the 9th has to do is send the case back to "the desert judge" and he'll take it from there.

I'm sorry if I wasn't clear. Obviously the law is what will drive whatever decision is reached. The point I was trying to make is that the periphery stuff gives them additional rationale in viewing the entirety of the case, including Judge Wake's harsh language in his Findings of Facts and Law.

 

[aquagreen73s]

Yes. I think that if anything it reminds the judges what nebulous law can do in the hands of malevolent majorities and opportunistic lawyers. The entire USAPA crusade was rooted in the unreasonable case law interpretations of a lawyer who has a penchant for telling his clients what they want to hear instead of what they need to hear. The harm caused by this lawyer and his client is bad for not just all US Airways pilots, but bad for labor; which also affects labor-management relations, etc. Hence, the judges need to (and probably will) speak directly to these tactics and they can do it in the opinion. That way other lawyers like this one will be on notice. It's rare that appellate courts speak about the tactics of a counsel, but it does happen and I've read a few opinions that rip a lawyer. Other than that, the trial court is best equipped to handle lawyers whose advocacy is not in accordance with the duties of candor and respect to the tribunal.

 

[HPearlyretiree]

It reminds me of Kevin Bacon in Animal House. "ALL IS WELL, STAY CALM."

Exactly what I was thinking...but with a bit of Baghdad Bob thrown in for good measure.

It sounds like USAPA is not making friends with the 9th, you would think they would have learned when they did the same with Wake.

Hopefully the 9th will rule soon, and USAPA will accept reality...