US Pilots Labor Discussion 9/23- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[aquagreen73s]

The Kirby video was very interesting. Now we all know where this thing stands.

Yeah, when you lose your LOA 93 snapbacks, you should insist that he compromise with the East because you *EXPECTED* a win, but didn't get it. See what his answer is.

 

[767jetz]

The real question ? Because it is really hard to believe a supposed UAL pilot with his/her own merger going on devotes more time to the one that does not directly involve same. Does that help explain our suspicions?

Actually it does not explain your suspicion at all. Sounds more like disbelief that anyone but a west pilot could have an opinion that opposes that of USAPA and the hardliners. In fact I spend less time here than you claim I do, and quite a bit of time engaged in the UA merger. I attend every council meeting (one coming up this Thursday in fact), read every update, and speak personally with my LEC Chairman on a regular basis. But honestly, there is very little drama with the UA/CO merger since the Joint CBA process is moving forward with good result, and merger integration hasn't started yet.

It really makes no sense. What purpose would it serve for a west pilot to claim to be a UAL pilot? There must be other conspiracy theories that interest the east population on this forum more than my motivation for expressing my opinion about what USAPA is trying to do to the west. I am ever so flattered by the attention though.

 

[Pi brat]

You'll never convince anyone in a court room that putting a Reserve F/O or a guy with no job ahead of a Captain makes any sense.

Good thing that's not what they are trying to do.

 

[mikey60]

You'll never convince anyone in a court room that putting a Reserve F/O or a guy with no job ahead of a Captain makes any sense.

No court room is going to see it,this will be a internal union thing. DONE.

 

[cleardirect]

No court room is going to see it,this will be a internal union thing. DONE.

Two courts have already seen it. Another court is looking at the company version.

The facts and the merits remain. It will be back in court if usapa ever does their job and manages to get a contract. At this point not likely to happen.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Look in the mirror,pal! IT'S You! The East pilots knew that by saving this company, the reward was to move up a rapidly retiring pilot list.

Why all the complaints about "saving the company" then. The outrage over the loss of the pension? The dislike of LOA 93? All the concessions that "saved the company"?

Jim

 

[Pi brat]

You'll never convince anyone in a court room that putting a Reserve F/O or a guy with no job ahead of a Captain makes any sense.

TJ,

You are out of sync with about 98% of the F/Os I know. Could you explain why you feel the way you do? Do you think the Nic was fair? Do you think it doesn't matter because the process delivered it? You are entitled to feel the way you do, I'm just curious. Thanks.

 

[KTM300]

The problem with your theory is that the East pilots did not single-handedly save the company at all. If you had taken concessions and avoided bankruptcy, (or emerged by yourselves) and survived as a stand alone airline (like AA, UA, DL or CO for example), then you could claim that to the victors go the spoils. But the reality is that the merger saved your airline, and what you did was stay on life support long enough for that to happen. I'm not bring up who saved whom. For the sake of argument you both saved each other. Therefore you can not claim all the rewards for yourselves. That's plain theft.

There is absolutely no problem with my theory. Quite frankly, I never made the claim that we, the pilots "single-handedly" saved the company. I also would never make the claim ,"to the victor go the spoils." I have been in this business too long and through enough mergers and seen enough mergers to never believe that. You mentioning it makes me understand how you think, however.
Frankly,Your post/reply wasn't relevant to the point I made, and didn't the moderator say he would send someone to the cornfield if they brought up the 'who bought/saved issue.'

 

[KTM300]

Why all the complaints about "saving the company" then. The outrage over the loss of the pension? The dislike of LOA 93? All the concessions that "saved the company"?

Jim

1) We did help save the company

2) You're damn right we are outraged over losing our pension and if you are not outraged then you should be just as any hard working American when their pension is mishandled and mismanaged would be!

3) Are you saying we should like LOA 93?

4) see number 1, but for a moment, put the pilot merger issue aside, take the blinders off, and see the big picture. I know your smart enough to know how things really are.

 

[luvthe9]

1) We did help save the company

2) You're damn right we are outraged over losing our pension and if you are not outraged then you should be just as any hard working American when their pension is mishandled and mismanaged would be!

3) Are you saying we should like LOA 93?

4) see number 1, but for a moment, put the pilot merger issue aside, take the blinders off, and see the big picture. I know your smart enough to know how things really are.

Yo, KTM remember you are talking to someone that wears thier ALPA lanyard to the grocery store. Those ALPA people are the ones that sold us on LOA 93 and gave our pension away in the middle of the night with no vote.

 

[luvthe9]

TJ,

You are out of sync with about 98% of the F/Os I know. Could you explain why you feel the way you do? Do you think the Nic was fair? Do you think it doesn't matter because the process delivered it? You are entitled to feel the way you do, I'm just curious. Thanks.

Don't be surprised PI, your talking to the best friend of "My money is on Doug Parker" aka 924ps, I have no idea what's the matter with "traitorjake" we all know who he is in CLT and no F/Os can stand flying with him. He could care less about anyone below him.

 

[BoeingBoy]

You are out of sync with about 98% of the F/Os I know.

And you find that strange? Those doing the seniority leapfrogging rarely see anything wrong with it. Pick any pilot merger and there'll be a percentage that see whatever is to their advantage seniority-wise as eminently fair. [Note the use of "seniority" and not "longevity" or "DOH" since they are not the same]

Jim

 

[Run Like Hell]

And you find that strange? Those doing the seniority leapfrogging rarely see anything wrong with it. Pick any pilot merger and there'll be a percentage that see whatever is to their advantage seniority-wise as eminently fair. [Note the use of "seniority" and not "longevity" or "DOH" since they are not the same]

Jim

Curious, what did Northwest/Delta do?


How did that work out?


Why are they flying together already?



Why are we Different?

 

[767jetz]

There is absolutely no problem with my theory. Quite frankly, I never made the claim that we, the pilots "single-handedly" saved the company.

Frankly,Your post/reply wasn't relevant to the point I made

But you did say this:

The East pilots knew that by saving this company, the reward was to move up a rapidly retiring pilot list.

What else could a person derive from this statement but the fact that you believe the east pilots deserve the right to move up rapidly since the east pilots allegedly "saved the company."

And as I reminder, I did not say that anyone saved anyone else. I did say for the sake of argument that you saved each other. That is the accepted vernacular on this forum, since the discussion you mention is forbidden.

Again, the east pilots are not entitled to everything since the east pilots did not save your airline. The merger of both airlines did.

 

[Pi brat]

And you find that strange? Those doing the seniority leapfrogging rarely see anything wrong with it. Pick any pilot merger and there'll be a percentage that see whatever is to their advantage seniority-wise as eminently fair. [Note the use of "seniority" and not "longevity" or "DOH" since they are not the same]

Jim

Ah, the moral thing again. Anytime someone is that's far out of the average, it interests me. They made a movie about a German guy that was that far out of the norm during the Nazi reign. My post was to really find out what he was thinking,not to tear him apart. Since we have talked about the whole DOH thing, I thought that at least you would know that. I don't like his condescending style, but I think he is entitled to his opinion, and just as with you , I might agree with one or two of them.