US Pilots Labor Discussion 10/14-10/22

[luvn737s]

USAPA continues to prove it can't negotiate anything. Instead it prefers to insult everyone with whom it has to work inorder to ever hope to produce a contract.

But then again, maybe USAPA doesn't think serving ALL its pilots should overshadow serving it's own interests.

The sooner Cleeary and Co. is sent packing the sooner the pilots of US will begin to see the benefits of union membership.

 

[cubfan]

Bottom line east/west/north/south ALPA negotiated weak language that negatively effects every front line employee

True, that is why ALPA will never be back..........

 

[cleardirect]

Bottom line east/west/north/south ALPA negotiated weak language that negatively effects every front line employee

Did ALPA national negotiate your agreements or was it the east pilots that were in the room? Was it ALPA national that voted to approve the language or was it the east pilots that agreed to the language?

Stop trying to shift the blame. You have no one to point to except yourself. If you did not like the language vote the agreement down. Simple.

 

[boeingplt]

Pull up all the flights with flight numbers above 700 that transit PHX or LAS and take about 70% of that number and you'll be pretty close. Did US east fly PHX/SAN, PHX/LAX, PHX/SJD or PHX/MCO, just to name a few, prior to the merger?

And how many cities did yuens westies fly to out of CLT and PHL prior to the merger?

 

[BoeingBoy]

And how many cities did yuens westies fly to out of CLT and PHL prior to the merger?

I'm not sure you really want to go there. I doubt an accounting of block hours that the East is now flying on routes that they weren't flying on the merger date vs the same for the West would be bad for your argument.

Jim

 

[boeingplt]

I'm not sure you really want to go there. I doubt an accounting of block hours that the East is now flying on routes that they weren't flying on the merger date vs the same for the West would be bad for your argument.

Jim

Why don't you provide some data my mustachioed friend?

 

[HPDriver]

Yes, only about 1300 westies in front of me who were hired after me. Seems fair to them though.

They weren't hired after you because they didn't work at your airline.

Those that were hired after you are still behind you.

Figure it out.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Why don't you provide some data my mustachioed friend?

You get me all the East and West block hours for Sept 2005 and Oct 2009 (or complete sets of trip pairings will do in a pinch) and I'll do the math. Two good indications of the result are 1 - West being under minimum block hours while East was/is above minimum block hours and 2 - East fleet is down less than 10% compared to Sept 2005 while the West fleet is down at least 15% - the only new planes to replace lease expirations on the West side are the recent 321's while the East got the 25 190's, 3 757's and 3 or 4 332's so far to replace the planes that left in early 2006 due to the BK2 agreement with GECAS and lease expirations since then.

Jim

 

[Freighterguynow]

Fact is the west block hours were down because of transfer of flying to the east.

Ahhh - that or the most routes losing money were (and continue to be ) out West.

 

[Hawkhunter]

They weren't hired after you because they didn't work at your airline.

Those that were hired after you are still behind you.

Figure it out.

Oh brother, keep trying to make it look right. I think the average person knows what DOH is. Other companies other than airlines have merged. Your argument about your airline my airline is weak. You go figure it out because I know you Westies got a major winfall and deep down so do you. If I was you I would not worry to much. I think it wont be to much longer that you guys will be able to steal our jobs. You should try to be more humble though.

 

[BLT]

Oh brother, keep trying to make it look right. I think the average person knows what DOH is. Other companies other than airlines have merged. Your argument about your airline my airline is weak. You go figure it out because I know you Westies got a major winfall and deep down so do you. If I was you I would not worry to much. I think it wont be to much longer that you guys will be able to steal our jobs. You should try to be more humble though.

And your argument is so strong that it..................? Fell on deaf ears? Arbitrators and pilot neutrals aren't average people? The planets weren't properly aligned? Oprah endorsed your plan?

 

[BoeingBoy]

Ahhh - that or the most routes losing money were (and continue to be ) out West.

Why, then, is East still flying so many of those "unprofitable" former HP routes? Just a quick check shows that East flies more departures from PHX alone than West does from CLT and PHL. I sure didn't know that before the merger East flew such routes as PHX-MCO (now there's a high yield route LOL), PHX-MSP, PHX-ORD, PHX-DCA yet East flies most of the departures on those routes today. From LAS, East is flying to MCO(another high yield flight LOL), DCA and most of the PHX departures. Yep, I sure do remember those long time East routes. Plus, of course, all the flying on additions to the fleet post-merger until just recently when new A321's started arriving.

Jim

 

[ableoneable]

Oh brother, keep trying to make it look right. I think the average person knows what DOH is. Other companies other than airlines have merged. Your argument about your airline my airline is weak. You go figure it out because I know you Westies got a major winfall and deep down so do you.

Not at all.

DOH would have placed the bulk of east Furloughees above west lineholding captains. The conditions and restrictions were a joke. (If a RIF was necessary within 12 months of a recall then the east furloughees would return to the street. After 12 month DOH would control furloughs.)

Your idea of fairness is for a west captain and an east furloughee to exchange places. This somehow is not a windfall for the east but instead epitomizes the east's idea of fairness.

The Nicolau award merely allows the west pilot to hold the same seat/equipment he/she held the day before the merger. Your idea of fairness requires the west pilot to relinquish his seat to the east pilot.

Keeping what we had does not constitute a windfall.

If I was you I would not worry to much. I think it wont be to much longer that you guys will be able to steal our jobs. You should try to be more humble though.

I think you mean we have been able to keep you from stealing all of our jobs.

 

[lynyrdskynyrd]

An awful lot of east planes can also be seen at gates in Las Vegas. Sometimes, just eyeballing it, it looks like a third of the planes at the gates are east.

 

[cleardirect]

Ahhh - that or the most routes losing money were (and continue to be ) out West.

Any data to back up that bold statement? Other then opinion or wishful thinking?