TWU negotiations.........what?

[Overspeed]

Dude the difference between then and now is simply that unions did not believe that the poltical arena was the answer to everything, Quill and others were known to violate law and cause unrest. Your opinons match the weak ass cop out spewed by the cowards we have in charge now. Thinking James C Little, Trumpka, Hoffa or any other leader would break the law for the good of workers is laughable. The only law breaking going on in unions these days is them illegal lining their own pockets while we get shafted.

WE no longer have labor leaders we have over paid representatives just like our political system and both are failing the people/workers.

The reason we are not getting our way is because our representatives do not want to offend their Democratic Political Allies by using Quill type of tactics.

Weak? No, Quill had strength in numbers to back him. Labor unions need to organize more. I have said many times that we need to organize the MROs so don't take my statements out of context. But we all have a right to our opinions. If you think breaking the law will help that is your right. So far the law is on the side of big business and it will take a well thought out strategy to get out of this mess. Using Quill type tactics now in a down economy with so many out of work? Quill was using a strategy during a time of record labor strength and economic prosperity, he may have done something different now.

The first Hoffa did line his pockets if you remember your history with illegal activity regarding the pension funds. And we do have great labor leaders out there, Stern at the SEIU is a great one.

 

[TWU informer]

Weak? No, Quill had strength in numbers to back him. Labor unions need to organize more. I have said many times that we need to organize the MROs so don't take my statements out of context. But we all have a right to our opinions. If you think breaking the law will help that is your right. So far the law is on the side of big business and it will take a well thought out strategy to get out of this mess. Using Quill type tactics now in a down economy with so many out of work? Quill was using a strategy during a time of record labor strength and economic prosperity, he may have done something different now.

The first Hoffa did line his pockets if you remember your history with illegal activity regarding the pension funds. And we do have great labor leaders out there, Stern at the SEIU is a great one.

Spoken from the learnings right out of the TWU cultist book of weakness.

It matters not how many are out of work. What matters is do you have a skill that those out of work cannot quickly replace.

If everyone in this industry would stick together and simultaneously ignite a work stoppage there would be plenty of strength and power to bring this country and economy so quickly to its knees that Congress would be eating out of our hands asking what were our demands and negotiating a settlement to the distruption. Do you dispute this to be fact? Take a lesson form Europe instead of "without further ratification" James C Little and the AFL-CIO.

Stern is great? Somehow I am not surprised you think so given your cultist training and views of labor.

The FBI and U.S. Labor Department are looking into two deals involving Andy Stern -- over a six-figure book contract given to the former head of the Service Employees International Union and payments to a labor leader convicted on separate fraud charges, a source familiar with the case told Fox News on Tuesday.

Alejandro Stephens, who was sentenced early this month to four months in prison and three months of home confinement for defrauding a non-profit organization in "bogus consulting agreements," is former president of SEIU local 660 in Los Angeles.

Questioning of Stern, who is a member of President Obama's debt commission, revolve around whether he paid Stephens $150,000 to do nothing as the local union boss. Stephens and Stern met with federal agents this summer to answer questions about the relationship

The SEIU is no stranger to thuggery and doesn’t hesitate to use those tactics against anyone, including its own members (see SEIU Watch – Campaign Manual Promotes Breaking the Law and SEIU Thugs Beat Up State Worker Ken Hamidi in Sacramento). Much like they do during their Corporate Campaigns, the SEIU uses not only physical intimidation, but also psychological warfare through misrepresentation of the facts. Is thi s SEIU Propaganda – Lies or Just Carelessness? The SEIU also likes to distort the facts in addressing its own members on its labor television network (see Channel 100). These are all standard “playbook” tactics developed and used by the SEIU, as discussed in Corporate Campaigns: Vehicle to Forced Unionism and Political Payback.

In addition to its questionable financial practices, member intimidation and misleading propaganda the union is now being charged with irregularities during union recognition elections exposed by its own members. “Mariam the Mighty” observed ballots with no U.S. postmark (as required by the SEIU) being opened and counted. When she challenged the process, she was forced to leave the room, as stated in the “Unfair Practice Charge” filed with State of California’s Public Employment Relations Board (see SEIU Ballot PERB). The response from the SEIU was typical propaganda. They stated that Mariam acknowledged there was no problem before sh e left on her own accord (see SEIU Ballot Response). In another long drawn out representation election, between the SEIU and NUHW, SEIU members exposed questionable electioneering by the SEIU in an attempt to discredit NUHW (see SEIU Electioneering in Kaiser Conference Room). This led to an election rematch between the two rival unions as the Administrative Law Judge who presided over the case, brought by the NUHW and disgruntled SEIU members, wrote a 34 page decision citing a long list of irregularities by the SEIU (see Kaiser Election Results Koed NLRB Judge Orders Rematch).

The sad part of this activity is not only that the SEIU big labor bosses are betraying the trust of their own members, but that they are supported by a political system that encourages the corruption. Even more astounding is the fact these stories represent activities in one state! Multiply this by 50 and you will understand why we as a country are failing to address the disease of labor corruption as noted in Addressing the Symptoms, Not the Disease.

 

[Overspeed]

Spoken from the learnings right out of the TWU cultist book of weakness.

It matters not how many are out of work. What matters is do you have a skill that those out of work cannot quickly replace.

If everyone in this industry would stick together and simultaneously ignite a work stoppage there would be plenty of strength and power to bring this country and economy so quickly to its knees that Congress would be eating out of our hands asking what were our demands and negotiating a settlement to the distruption. Do you dispute this to be fact? Take a lesson form Europe instead of "without further ratification" James C Little and the AFL-CIO.

Stern is great? Somehow I am not surprised you think so given your cultist training and views of labor.

But that's the point isn't it, our work can easily be replaced. Why do you think the term sheets gut the TWU membership but barely touch the APA and APFA. Time to step back and re-examine your perceived strengths.

Your right, if everyone in our industry would organize including the MROs we would have strength. Now how will we do that given MROs may not be under the RLA? Organizing will be tough. Europe is a very socialist country and union membership is not mandatory. Things like health care, dental, retirement, sick time, ID, and many other benefits are mandated under European laws. Companies have two boards to answer to before workers are laid off and that is per the law. Also, executive pay is highly regulated and companies that have negative valuations must be shutdown per the law. If not executives go to jail. If the European laws had been in place in our country, CO would be long gone as would US and many other airlines that chose to reorganize. AA would be making money hand over fist because we would be in a oligopoly with probably just a healthy AA, UA, and DL. I doubt WN would have grown as large as they did not start rapid growth until the majors became weak due to airlines that should have died a long time ago. Instead executives got big bonuses for gutting labor agreements, dumping pensions, and outsourcing work and Wall Street loved it.

Stern's views on organizing are great. In 14 years the organization grew from 2 million to 2.9 million members in under his leadership along with upgrading the wages and benefits of those newly organized members.

Listen, I'm on labor's side. Open dialogue is great however if your strategy is to say my union and most other's suck where do you expect that will get you?

Cultist? Hardly.

 

[TWU informer]

But that's the point isn't it, our work can easily be replaced. Why do you think the term sheets gut the TWU membership but barely touch the APA and APFA. Time to step back and re-examine your perceived strengths.

Your right, if everyone in our industry would organize including the MROs we would have strength. Now how will we do that given MROs may not be under the RLA? Organizing will be tough. Europe is a very socialist country and union membership is not mandatory. Things like health care, dental, retirement, sick time, ID, and many other benefits are mandated under European laws. Companies have two boards to answer to before workers are laid off and that is per the law. Also, executive pay is highly regulated and companies that have negative valuations must be shutdown per the law. If not executives go to jail. If the European laws had been in place in our country, CO would be long gone as would US and many other airlines that chose to reorganize. AA would be making money hand over fist because we would be in a oligopoly with probably just a healthy AA, UA, and DL. I doubt WN would have grown as large as they did not start rapid growth until the majors became weak due to airlines that should have died a long time ago. Instead executives got big bonuses for gutting labor agreements, dumping pensions, and outsourcing work and Wall Street loved it.

Stern's views on organizing are great. In 14 years the organization grew from 2 million to 2.9 million members in under his leadership along with upgrading the wages and benefits of those newly organized members.

Listen, I'm on labor's side. Open dialogue is great however if your strategy is to say my union and most other's suck where do you expect that will get you?

Cultist? Hardly.

So you think it's great that the only Labor Growth in this country is that which you and I pay the salary? Unionized Government Workers are the expense of the workers via payroll taxes of which I am tired of paying more to fund those jobs.

Why is that every goal you and the TWU has is for me and other workers to subsidize a job for someone else by taking money from my paycheck via taxes or concessions? That is hardly success in my view.

Organizing would be a hell of alot easier if you and the other stooges would stop working on legislation to protect the non-union worker. Stop subisidizing every worker and non-union worker for that matter using that 2 million man army of government workers and those workers might actually call on the unions instead of the unions knocking on the workers door begging for more members. Your types #### about Right-to-Work Laws that allow for representation without dues payment, but yet daily you are doing your best to help non-union workers who have not paid a dime in dues. Why should they join? You help them for free!

So if not SUCK then what? You think we are succeeding in this political arena game of who has the most cash for campaigns and lobbying don't you?
Just have the TWU put out a membership survey ballot and ask the membership if they think your union sucks. Of course we all know what the outcome would be and thus it will not ever happen.

I personally see no difference if I support it or state that it sucks, the outcome is still decimation and lowering of our standard of living.

And just as the arguement between Buck and Red was a waste of time, so is this discussion with you. It is getting us nowhere and we are still going backwards as we type, either through concession negotiations, or tax increases to pay for your celebrated 2.8 million Government workers.

 

[Overspeed]

So you think it's great that the only Labor Growth in this country is that which you and I pay the salary? Unionized Government Workers are the expense of the workers via payroll taxes of which I am tired of paying more to fund those jobs.

Why is that every goal you and the TWU has is for me and other workers to subsidize a job for someone else by taking money from my paycheck via taxes or concessions? That is hardly success in my view.

Organizing would be a hell of alot easier if you and the other stooges would stop working on legislation to protect the non-union worker. Stop subisidizing every worker and non-union worker for that matter using that 2 million man army of government workers and those workers might actually call on the unions instead of the unions knocking on the workers door begging for more members. Your types #### about Right-to-Work Laws that allow for representation without dues payment, but yet daily you are doing your best to help non-union workers who have not paid a dime in dues. Why should they join? You help them for free!

So if not SUCK then what? You think we are succeeding in this political arena game of who has the most cash for campaigns and lobbying don't you?
Just have the TWU put out a membership survey ballot and ask the membership if they think your union sucks. Of course we all know what the outcome would be and thus it will not ever happen.

I personally see no difference if I support it or state that it sucks, the outcome is still decimation and lowering of our standard of living.

And just as the arguement between Buck and Red was a waste of time, so is this discussion with you. It is getting us nowhere and we are still going backwards as we type, either through concession negotiations, or tax increases to pay for your celebrated 2.8 million Government workers.

Your right, arguing about this now is a waste of time but for the future. Labor needs a long term strategy because winging it ain't working.

 

[Buck]

It says they broke into sub groups, but what it doesn’t say is that Don V. has been having private meetings with management and the folks from Tulsa about taking our work and other contractual changes. Nor does it say anything about Don having private meeting with the company and local 565 President Gary Peterson concerning DFW and DWH. The feedback we keep getting from the members at DFW is that Gary has been telling them not to worry, that there will be a 10% cap on anyone bumping into either station in the event of a station shutdown or a RIF. It would be nice if they were to share those discussion with us or at least the other presidents of the negotiations team, then again that would be an honest, open dialogue and we can’t have that. Otherwise you would find that their (international) pensions amongst other perks are still in tack. I just hope more senior members are not displaced while junior folks are protected at TUL, DFW and DWH.

 

[Buck]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6FSiaUu0Ww



A new Video......

 

[Kev3188]

Stern at the SEIU is a great one.

Stern's been gone since '10...

IMO, he set labor progress back decades...

 

[Mr Red]

It says they broke into sub groups, but what it doesn’t say is that Don V. has been having private meetings with management and the folks from Tulsa about taking our work and other contractual changes. Nor does it say anything about Don having private meeting with the company and local 565 President Gary Peterson concerning DFW and DWH. The feedback we keep getting from the members at DFW is that Gary has been telling them not to worry, that there will be a 10% cap on anyone bumping into either station in the event of a station shutdown or a RIF. It would be nice if they were to share those discussion with us or at least the other presidents of the negotiations team, then again that would be an honest, open dialogue and we can’t have that. Otherwise you would find that their (international) pensions amongst other perks are still in tack. I just hope more senior members are not displaced while junior folks are protected at TUL, DFW and DWH.

Sounds like a bad rumor, Seniority means nothing unless you have it.If I were in the 4000 bottom of seniority list I would have the resume ready to go !

 

[Overspeed]

It says they broke into sub groups, but what it doesn’t say is that Don V. has been having private meetings with management and the folks from Tulsa about taking our work and other contractual changes. Nor does it say anything about Don having private meeting with the company and local 565 President Gary Peterson concerning DFW and DWH. The feedback we keep getting from the members at DFW is that Gary has been telling them not to worry, that there will be a 10% cap on anyone bumping into either station in the event of a station shutdown or a RIF. It would be nice if they were to share those discussion with us or at least the other presidents of the negotiations team, then again that would be an honest, open dialogue and we can’t have that. Otherwise you would find that their (international) pensions amongst other perks are still in tack. I just hope more senior members are not displaced while junior folks are protected at TUL, DFW and DWH.

I had heard TULE was working on how to absorb the 767 and 777 HC work from AFW and that DWH wants to pick up the 767 and 777 LC.

The line may get hit with several hundred RIFs if the BC's get outsourced like the term sheet says up to the 40% outsourcing cap the company wants. If the company gets that cap on all work, even the line could get outsourced at any time without any consultation with the union. That could mean bumping from the line in to those new OSMs in the bases. Gotta love it. All that talk about TULE guys going to JFK may be the other way around.

Sounds like everybody is trying to do a lot of stuff locally to protect their stations.

 

[Overspeed]

Stern's been gone since '10...

IMO, he set labor progress back decades...

TWU Informer and Kev3188 I give. I was looking just at the membership growth. It sounds like with just about everything, you gotta look everywhere.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=125914077

 

[767 mechanic]

Very strong rumor in Taesl is that our top dogs are wanting to reduce the mechanics head count by roughly 15% on top of the 60 or so present openings. Bring in about 20% OSMs to do teardown. Along with doing away with all facility maintenance in the building. We have about 450 title 1 right now so things are go get interesting in Taesl real soon.

 

[Buck]

There is not a 10% cap, nor has there been any discussion on a 10% cap, on any RIF into DFW or DWH.
There are no secret meetings being held with me and AA about DWH and Larry is free to observe any negotiations that I have regarding the future of DWH.
Unfortunately, AA has made it very clear they intend to close AFW, currently minus TAESL, and some work from AFW may ultimately transition over to DWH. As of today, AA has not said what, if any work, will be transitioned into DWH.
If work is moved from AFW to DWH, my position and that of Local 565 is that Local 567 members would transition with DWH vacancies; if they elect that choice as their option per the CBA.

 

[AAOHNO]

There is not a 10% cap, nor has there been any discussion on a 10% cap, on any RIF into DFW or DWH.
There are no secret meetings being held with me and AA about DWH and Larry is free to observe any negotiations that I have regarding the future of DWH.
Unfortunately, AA has made it very clear they intend to close AFW, currently minus TAESL, and some work from AFW may ultimately transition over to DWH. As of today, AA has not said what, if any work, will be transitioned into DWH.
If work is moved from AFW to DWH, my position and that of Local 565 is that Local 567 members would transition with DWH vacancies; if they elect that choice as their option per the CBA.

Buck,
Are you quoting Gary P. or is this statement from you? h34r:

 

[Tex-Mech]

Buck,
Are you quoting Gary P. or is this statement from you? h34r:

I think he is quoting him, because i got the same email if which he responsed to Kenny "stir the sh*t" Powell who was claiming that DFW was blocking AFW from bumping. Like everything else that has come out of this local lately, is was BS that Kenny made up.

FYI there is more to the conversation than was posted, including something along the lines of bumping will be done per the contract and arbitration decision, unless changed by the international or bankruptcy judge. And it said something about how Pike just has to knock on the door when the door is locked, instead of claiming a super secret meeting to end our bumping rights was going on.