No Entry Allowed!

[Checking it Out]

Raptor I stand with my numbers, since it is obvious you are ill informed I will give you the benifit of your lies.

Amfa has always said they wanted a debate. Two oppurtunities came about and they ran scared both times. Just like they did when the TWU members crossed the street.

It was a classic, If you had seen the scared looks on the faces of the amfa wantabes, and seen them running into the brady! you would have laugh. One of the police officers hit it on the nose, The amfa wantabes hurried out made several stupid remarks and ran back inside.

You should have seen the looks on the amfa wantabes faces when the float pulled up with the coffin. That was a classic also.

The TWU was ready to debate and amfa refused! It was that simple.

 

[Superside]

"I do have to give them credit, they did allow a few Members to attend, as long as they did not have on TWU items..."

CIO,
Two (2) TWU guys right in front of me, wearing TWU coats, and I recognized several others, Mr. Gormans was there also, although he left soon after the start.

GO BACK TO SLEEP CIO, IT'S JUST A BAD DREAM, AMFA DOESN'T EXCIST!?
PSSST! Don't look under your bed! HAR HAR HAR!

 

[Raptor]

Listen TWUer I was not at the door, and I did not hear anyone say that someone was turned away, I will ask around for myself to see if there is any truth to your claim, my problem right now with your claim is that the TWU lies so often, that I can't tell when you are lieing and when you are telling the truth, point in fact there were less people outside than inside, I know that for a fact, and you know it too, so allready I know you are lieing some, I honestly do not know if you are lieing about not being able to come in yet, but I will know once I am able to talk with someone that I trust to tell me the truth, let me put it this way if you are lieing about being denied entrance I will not be surprised.

You know the story about the boy who cried wolf, he lied so often that no one believed him when he finally told the truth.

Are you lieing to me TWUer ?

 

[Ed Norton]

:down: Punks, drunks, cowards AND knuckle draggers

The laughs on TeAAm TWU!

They couldn't get enough people to attend Thursday's debacle so they had to call up retirees, fleet service clerks, stores clerks and the usual TWU vermin on UB.

Now fast forward to today and they couldn't get enough TeAAm twuers to come on their own so they had to get some Teamsters to fill in.

HOW PATHETIC IS THAT???!!!!! :down:

 

[Raptor]

What is so sad is that there were more TWU supporters there outside wanting to get in than there were AMFA suupporters inside. I saw the clip on the news. Poor showing Raptor

TWUer I thought the same thing about the showing for the TWU vs AMFA debate I saw it on the news and in the newspaper picture, in all honesty it looks like both debates had about the same showing, when you consider how many members will be affected by this vote, I would agree that both had a very poor showing, as for why this is the case. I don't know why anymore than you do. :huh:

 

[Checking it Out]

Raptor again, since you are ill informed. Two meetings thursday, Standing room only 4 pm. total through out the day=1000.

Classic, today's Qoute from Delle; " Amfa is for mechanic's and they also represent a few splinter groups". I suppose Ed these are what you mean on your post.

I will repeat! everyone has an expertice in their area of employment and should be given the respect. Amfa continues to shoot themselves in the foot. Another me too attitude!!!!

Amfa is willing to sacrafice everyone in order to survive!!!

 

[Raptor]

Well AMFA must be doing something right they do have 54% signed cards and that is more than enough to call for an election, AMFA will call for an election by March at the latest.

I allways like to post this when someone says that AMFA is shooting themselves in the foot or doing something wrong.

Also CIO you had 150 at best for the first meeting and 200 at best for the second meeting that adds up to 350 at best so stop lieing I am tired of hearing that lie.
you lie about every number that you give and it is getting old.

8636 Total Signed Election Authorization Cards by Station and Title Group:
Updated, Friday January 16, 2004 at 0411 AM. Our goal is to obtain 60% of the Craft and Class of
Mechanic and Related, and at this time, our estimate of that number, with 'elbow room' is approximately 9,634 cards.
Using that number, at this time, we are about 89.7% to our goal, or approximately 53.8% of our Craft and Class. Good job so far, and let's
REDOUBLE our efforts and GET THIS DONE!

 

[twuer]

Listen TWUer I was not at the door, and I did not hear anyone say that someone was turned away, I will ask around for myself to see if there is any truth to your claim, my problem right now with your claim is that the TWU lies so often, that I can't tell when you are lieing and when you are telling the truth, point in fact there were less people outside than inside, I know that for a fact, and you know it too, so allready I know you are lieing some, I honestly do not know if you are lieing about not being able to come in yet, but I will know once I am able to talk with someone that I trust to tell me the truth, let me put it this way if you are lieing about being denied entrance I will not be surprised.

You know the story about the boy who cried wolf, he lied so often that no one believed him when he finally told the truth.

Are you lieing to me TWUer ?

Raptor,

You might want to watch the 10 o'clock news, channel 8, tonight. Or it might be on Fox 23 as well. I'm sure there will be some pictures soon.

We came out and were sent away. It's that plain and simple. No matter from which side you are looking. We had an impressive amount of supporters come out this morning!

You guys preached that you were going to pack the house. I saw maybe 100. They had a pretty wide shot (channel 6 news). Those in attendance were so spread out that it was hard to tell. Did you have any in the balcony that maybe I missed?

Who were all those men on the panel? I'm just curious.

Be sure to watch the news tonight. . .

 

[Raptor]

I will agree I was somewhat impressed that you could round up a 100 TWU supporters in a group like you did, I was not impressed with the show that your group put on across the street, it was very unprofessional to say the least, we did not act that way at your debate, as for our numbers there were more than 100 people at our meeting, I know the exact number but will not tell you as you will not tell the correct number for your debate, as for who was on the panel, I don't remember all but will tell the ones I know, on the right side was Delle, Kevin Wildermuth, Terry Harvey, and Lee Seeham, I don't remember who was on the left, I have never seen them before. sorry :huh:

 

[Raptor]

Just curious TWUer who was it that said that no one from your group across the street could come in, can you give me a name ?
or are you just lieing, with a group of 100 people I would think it would take alot of people at the door to keep you out if you wanted in ?

There were alot more than 100 people inside but very few at the doors.





I am really kind of surprised that TWU Informer has not logged in to confirm or deny your claim that you were denied entry, I have no doubt that he will sooner or later though.
He is our top poster.

 

[twuer]

I will agree I was somewhat impressed that you could round up a 100 TWU supporters in a group like you did, I was not impressed with the show that your group put on across the street, it was very unprofessional to say the least, we did not act that way at your debate, as for our numbers there were more than 100 people at our meeting, I know the exact number but will not tell you as you will not tell the correct number for your debate, as for who was on the panel, I don't remember all but will tell the ones I know, on the right side was Delle, Kevin Wildermuth, Terry Harvey, and Lee Seeham, I don't remember who was on the left, I have never seen them before. sorry :huh:

It was a peaceful demonstration Raptor. You have heard of them?? As a matter of fact, I heard that Gary and Dan came over across the street where the TWU supporters were and tried to start something. They were in people's faces Raptor. That is an undisputable fact!!! No denying that!! Now, you tell me, how professional was that? :down:

You didn't act that way at our debate???? You didn't even show up!!! What were there maybe 4-5 AMFA supporters at each meeting. And as for our numbers, the room held about 200, they opened the partition (thanks Buck!!) to seat the rest who were coming in. The article in the paper said 400 but they were just at the first meeting. They left the partition open for the second meeting and at the start it looked quite full to me. I am really not exaggerating! There were people standing on the sides and there were people outside the room. We did have a big number show up.

I appreciate you telling me who was on the panel. I recognize those names. Were there any rank and file members up there or do you think they were all officials?

 

[twuer]

posted twice. . oops! DELETED

 

[MCI AFL-CIO]

AMFA will not debate TWU officers or members, Instead the prefered method for a few, namely Ken McTiernan,is to write a letter to ARPEY claiming the TWU workforce is divided, in effect "stabbing" all union members back, No wonder we were asked to take concessions? Just a thought. I am curious, Dave, Don, Gary,Buck, Bob, and any other AMFA supporter, do you abide with thsi form of communication as Ken has? I will not call any names, but it was Ken who called a few TWU members "RATS" for stating their actions, To me, isnt this the same as being a rat? Writing notes to management allowing management to know the inside business of our unions? Is this what we are to beleive the actions will be if AMFA does win election? AMFA will sya we are as good standing members, go to supervision and "rat" on employees?
If we are, as the grapevine claims to have another round of concessions coming, maybe we should take along hard look at who is writing letters to ARPEY?



Mr. Arpey, my name is Ken MacTiernan and I am an Aircraft Maintenance Technician Crew Chief in SAN with 17 1/2 years
I write to you today to save you some time and money. Recently AA has reported that they plan on inviting AA union leaders to ask what can be done to return the moral to the work force. The answer does not need to be asked to the union officials
Nor do I write this as a "loose cannon". I am writing to you as a skilled professional Aircraft Maintenance Technician. I am writing to you as an employee that is tired of lies, greed and ineptness. If executives in today's airlines do not know how to run an airline then these individuals need to step down and allow those who know how to do so. The overwhelming feeling amongst AMTs is that we are being taken advantage of through weak industrial unionism. We are penalized for providing a safe, airworthy aircraft just so AA can offer free tickets and to provide retention bonuses for executives that got us into this position to begin with.
I alluded to weak unionism and I speak of the TWU. The TWU will be removed from representing AMTs this year at AA. You will no longer have a toy union to achieve the company's bidding. We will have a new craft union that understands that respect breeds moral. They will treat the M&E Department at AA with openness and accountability. Why is moral so low? Maybe it is because we were not given a full revote on the stripping of contractual gains. Maybe it is because all that is repeated from corporate mouths like some Tibetan Monks chanting daily prayers is ,"We have to compete with low cost competitors. We have to compete with Southwest/Jetblue." Well, taking money from skilled Technicians is not the answer. Concessions do not work. Look at USAir, they will not be around much longer. Concessions will not save them. Except their top executives because they do not share the sacrifice either.
If you want to return the moral to the employees of the best airline flying then give me back my money and benefits. Give me back my respect. Shrink the airline and grow as travelers return
Don't talk to the self serving industrial self appointed officials


Notice also, Ken asks that: Shrink the airline and grow as travelers return.

Is this the action of a true UNION? No, A true union keeps all employees not ask to "shrink" the workforce, but I forgot, AMFA claims that when TWU attempts to keep everyone working, all the TWU is really doing, is keeping their payroll, GIVE ME A BREAK

Delle, if you read this, please respond, I am curious to know your views about this also, Is it ok for an AMT to write alluding to division in the rank and file?
Also, notice also, Ken is the CHAIRMAN? of AMTA?

Its ok Ken, I still respect your views, always have, you have opinions as I do, but as you claim in so many of your posts against the TWU, or supporters, your union of choice is DEMOCRACY? mine, according to you, is Communist?

 

[Raptor]

It was a peaceful demonstration Raptor. You have heard of them?? As a matter of fact, I heard that Gary and Dan came over across the street where the TWU supporters were and tried to start something. They were in people's faces Raptor. That is an undisputable fact!!! No denying that!! Now, you tell me, how professional was that?

I was inside most of the time and did not hear about any trouble outside, so I do not know if you are telling me the truth or not, and you are right most supporters did not show up at your meeting due to lack of interest but atleast you had a peacefull meeting with no one outside chanting and carrying on, everyone on the panel was an officer, there were no Rank and File on the panel.
remember the debate was suppose to be Leaders not Rank and File, so AMFA Leaders were on the panel.

Please answer my question and be truthfull, you say you were not allowed to come in, who told you and your group that they could not come in, PLEASE do not lie.

I really was expecting every single person in your group to come inside, we were even discussing as to where we thought your group might sit inside, we figured that you guys would probably sit in the back somewhere as a group.

Every individual is just that an individual would you have us judge the TWU by Randy Mcdonalds actions, I think not, as for Ken's letter I don't personally have a problem with it, but that is just my individual opinion.

Ken is intitled to his opinion just as you are.

 

[Checking it Out]

Delle, stated he would not debate!

In one of the amfa flyers it stated everyone was welcome. When many of the members showed they were turned away and denied access. Police were their to ensure they were not allowed to come in. Cunningham and several others stated several names of members who were not allowed.

Simple fact is amfa refused to debate!!!!!

Simple fact is amfa was afraid to debate!!!!!!

Simple fact is Delle dictated the terms and changed them!!!!

Simple fact is the Members do not control amfa!!!!!!

Simple fact is over 10,000 members are unemployed under amfa watch!!!!!


Simple fact is after 42 years amfa record speaks for itself!!!!!!!

Simple fact is amfa has done more damage in the industry than any management personal!!!!!!