NMB

[NYer]

Can someone explain why the NMB would release us. After all, wasn't it just last month or so the TWU and company settled with two more groups. Maybe in the eyes of the NMB, it shows progress being made.

Despite all the self-serving rhetoric on this page, the NMB is not there for the Union and it is not there for the Company. It is there to prevent a economic calamidty that would be caused by a national corporation which is directly tied to the flow of commerce. The following excerpt comes from the NMB site itself and should answer your question.

"NMB's statutory authority as national mediator for the airline and railroad industries is critical to public interest in maintaining an uninterrupted flow of U.S. Commerce. Strikes, lock-outs, and other forms of self help in these industries may occur only after the NMB has determined that further mediation would not be successful and after a cooling-off period of 30 days following NMB release from mediation."

In short, they could care less about the employees or the Company.

 

[BoeingBoy]

And Obama took the PEB option yesterday to prevent a possible railroad strike...

Jim

 

[Observer]

You better read article 11(h).

Understand what you read. 11h explains how and the restrictions cross-utilization is implemented. So if you were given a job to do a PM on a jetway, your pay would stay the same. Too many misunderstand crossutilization. Deicing is NOT crossutilization because that job is described in several agreements. If you are working at ORD as a mechanic and given a job that an avionics amt is usually assigned, it is not cross utilization because it is in our job description. Cross utilization is BETWEEN job Title groups and outside the job description of your classification.

 

[AAmt TCC]

How did a union of 130,000 who have only been in negotiations since January of this year, already get released, have a strike vote, and plan to go on strike as of midnight last night? That is, until the president stopped it.

 

[eolesen]

They had professional negotiators, and a very clear position going into negotiations?

 

[Overspeed]

Heard M&R voted to ask the NMB for release November 30, 2011.

Looks like if we get release from NMB we will walking the line by Christmas. Start saving now for the war effort.

 

[Frank Szabo]

Heard M&R voted to ask the NMB for release November 30, 2011.

Looks like if we get release from NMB we will walking the line by Christmas. Start saving now for the war effort.

That would make perfect sense - that way, we'll be out for Christmas and we'll be saving them some money during the slower time of the year 'til things pick up in the spring.

That sure was nice of the International to think of their employer during these hard times, wasn't it?

 

[Buck]

Wait a minute are you two suggesting a strike?


It is still good to have a laugh now and then.....

 

[Overspeed]

Wait a minute are you two suggesting a strike?


It is still good to have a laugh now and then.....

Strike? Maybe but odds are against it. The NMB will probably not even answer the request like they have done with the APA. But of they do there are several outcomes. Union can seek self help, AA can impose their last offer, NMB can offer binding arbitration, or we could go to a PEB.

 

[Flying low]

Can someone explain to me why the NMB would release us? It was just a month or two ago that the TWU and company settled with 2 work groups. I think it was the mechanics for the flight simulators and I forget the other. Wouldn't that show the NMB that the 2 sides have been talking.

 

[Frank Szabo]

Can someone explain to me why the NMB would release us? It was just a month or two ago that the TWU and company settled with 2 work groups. I think it was the mechanics for the flight simulators and I forget the other. Wouldn't that show the NMB that the 2 sides have been talking.

It's a dog and pony show - not to worry. Certain actions must take place to keep up the appearance of union action for the membership's "benefit".

 

[eolesen]

Can someone explain to me why the NMB would release us? It was just a month or two ago that the TWU and company settled with 2 work groups. I think it was the mechanics for the flight simulators and I forget the other. Wouldn't that show the NMB that the 2 sides have been talking.

If the accepted terms are similar to what the company has been proposing for the unresolved workgroups, then yes, if the same mediator was involved. I don't think that information would have been shared as easily if the various contracts have different mediators assigned to them.

 

[Bob Owens]

Why aren't all the unions getting together to sue the NMB their in bed with American and Obama

Probably because the people who make those decisions earn six figures and would rather use their political influence to make is easier to organize (ie collect more dues to pay their salaries) than to try and get those who already have to pay dues better contracts.

 

[Bob Owens]

what suit would you propose? The NMB is a quasi-government department that is for mediation purposes to PREVENT strikes basically, to find common ground in the bargainning process. There has to be reasonable bargainning from both sides. The NMB does not care what happened in the past, they are more concerned in the here and now, "real time". All the positioning taken with all the posts here serves no one, except to inflame more rhetoric. Neither Owens or the Company can deliver the bacon so to speak, without both sides moving to a position more favorable to an agreement. The NMB will let the parties twist in the wind until forever if need be.

Thats not what the NMB website says.
If the NMB determines that further mediation will not produce an agreement, which is what they said last August, then they are supposed to proffer binding Arbitration, if either side declines then they are supposed to start the 30 day cooling off period, like they recently did in the rails. If they decide that the dispute could result in a negative economic impact then the President has the right to delay self help another 30 days for a PEB, Like they did with the rails.

Nothing in their about swinging in the wind, I think thats Dons strategy. "They turned down the TA, well let them sit out there for another year, bring them back something worse so they never turn down a TA again."

Jim Little told us years ago, "Never turn down a TA because they will never sweeten the pot" He later added "Without a Strike". So if Jim knows that the company will not sweeten the pot what are we dragging out getting to the point of self-help? Is it to weaken the company or weaken the resolve of the membership? Its a dangerous game, because there's a good chance that if the TWU gets AA what they want that right on the heels of a ratification vote there could be a representational dispute filed.

 

[Bob Owens]

all you state is accurate. But if the NMB in their view of the process feel either side is not being real in their specific proposals, or are not within the realm of reasonableness, they won't release anyone. They won't allow either party to drive the bus over the cliff unless BOTH sides have exhausted all "good will". If the mediator has said to either party you aren't being real in your demand, then That party is put on notice to look at the proposal and make a change. As long as the NMB makes the decision to keep the parties going because there is optimism a bargain can be reached, then the NMB will not alter the process. Another point is also the environment the bargainning is being done in, high unemployment, poor economic climate and etc. Those facts unfortunately affect the process.

Ok, then explain why the rails were released.

You say that the NMB can tell one side to lower their demands, well is he a mediator or an arbitrator? What does he use to determine what is reasonable and what isnt and how do you know what he uses to make such a determination? The fact is I sat in front of them and heard from them what they said. Did you? The Mediator doesnt determine whether or not we get released the NMB does. The Mediators are employees of the NMB. All they determine is whether or not their input will help produce an agreement, and they already determined it wont when they said they see no point in scheduling further sessions. Everything that pro company former President of AIRCON Laryy Gibbons said was his biased opinion. Not fact. Show me where in the law it says that movement through the process is influenced by the economy, high unemployment etc. The fact is it doesnt, those factors may play a part in a PEB or Congressional intervention but not in the process of moving through the steps.

The NMB doesn't pick and choose anything. The NMB ensures neutrality by not taking a side. The NMB is aware that we took concessions, but that fact does not mean it is part of mediation. Your compalint that the deck is stacked against us is a personal perception, and repeated by many on this site and years ago on another site. Manipulating the process when you have no horse in the race is pure foolishness. You and others that do not like the process, which has served the airline industry for many years.

The NMB has a track record in this industry of not being neutral, and the Unions have failed to call them on it. When CAL Unions said they wanted to continue to talk and Lorenzo demanded to be released the NMB released them , when EAL workers requested continued mediation and Lorenzo demanded to be released the NMB released them, when AMFA was demanding a large increase to get back to old wage levels in real terms the NMB threatened to put them on ice-I believe that Mediator was none other that ex AIRCON President Larry Gibbons, current lead mediator at the NMB appointed underthe BushAdministration. Over the last twenty years Mediation has streched out from an average of a few months to an average of three years, bu only when labor is in a position to make gains. When a carrier is in a position to bust a union the NMB makes an exception and releases the parties right away like they did at Northwest in 2005.

You and others that do not like the process, which has served the airline industry for many years.

You got that right, so much for neutrality.