More Groups Wanting To Fire The TWU

[FWAAA]

Dave's not here, man.

 

[iluvaa]

Is this an indication that they have enough cards?  I can only hope you are right.  Let the members decide who will or who will not represent them.  Thx for the update hope it is all true....

probably not enough cards but trust me there is a plan B and C already set up, and both are viable plans. So just don't be shocked on Friday

 

[Vortilon]

Give me one major airline besides SWA that doesn't have the same story? AA, DAL, NWA, TWA, UAL, US. Multiple Unions including your own personal favorite all ramrodded and hammered into give backs, concessions and lost jobs. EVERY single Union on every one of those properties. 

The back and forth on the subject is ridiculous because except for Mr Moneymaker SWA we were all on the same sinking ships. (Some never found a life boat to survive though)

This is a timeline of airlines who have filed for bankruptcy protection. Also see list of defunct airlines for a list of airlines which are no longer operating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airline_bankruptcies_in_the_United_States

 
You offer more excuses for our current status.  We took larger paycuts, we lost more in benefits, and we still lag in getting back any of it 13 years later.  The airlines you listed that are still flying, their employees are paid better and have better benefits.  Yet, here we are months away from the so called industry averaging pay modification.  Even that will be somehow botched, or turned into a controversy.  It does nothing for bettering our lame benefits.  Just thinking about the mess your boy Jim little got us into makes me sick.  Yet here you are on this BB playing captain smart ass sticking up for all the bad decisions the  TWU leadership has made over the years.  Either you're on the TWU payroll or some sort of halftard.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

 
You offer more excuses for our current status.  We took larger paycuts, we lost more in benefits, and we still lag in getting back any of it 13 years later.  The airlines you listed that are still flying, their employees are paid better and have better benefits.  Yet, here we are months away from the so called industry averaging pay modification.  Even that will be somehow botched, or turned into a controversy.  It does nothing for bettering our lame benefits.  Just thinking about the mess your boy Jim little got us into makes me sick.  Yet here you are on this BB playing captain smart ass sticking up for all the bad decisions the  TWU leadership has made over the years.  Either you're on the TWU payroll or some sort of halftard.

Industry average pay with the worst benefits in the industry = Lousy contract.

 

[WeAAsles]

 
Why is it so hard for you to comprehend that your "The end of the story doesn't change."  chant means nothing.
 
You don't want to talk about anything in the middle or that can be debated precisely because that does bare on the "END" you keep trying to tout - try as you might, you cannot separate one from the other.
 

Moby-Dick; or, The Whale (1851) is a novel by Herman Melville considered an outstanding work of Romanticism and the American Renaissance. Ishmael narrates the monomaniacal quest of Ahab, captain of the whaler Pequod, for revenge on Moby Dick, a white whale which on a previous voyage destroyed Ahab's ship and severed his leg at the knee.

On the third day of the chase, Ahab sights Moby Dick at noon, and sharks appear as well. Ahab lowers his boat for a final time, leaving Starbuck again on board. Moby Dick breaches and destroys two boats. Fedallah's corpse, still entangled in the fouled lines, is lashed to the whale's back, and so Moby Dick turns out to be the hearse Fedallah prophesied. "Possessed by all the fallen angels" (Ch. 135), Ahab plants his harpoon in the whale's flank. Moby Dick smites the whaleboat, tossing its men into the sea. Only Ishmael survives. The whale now fatally attacks the Pequod. Ahab then realizes that the destroyed ship is the hearse made of American wood in Fedallah's prophesy. The whale returns to Ahab, who stabs at him again. The line loops around Ahab's neck, and as the stricken whale swims away, the captain is drawn with him out of sight.

"Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering whale; to the last I grapple with thee; from hell’s heart I stab at thee; for hate’s sake I spit my last breath at thee. Sink all coffins and all hearses to one common pool! And since neither can be mine, let me then tow to pieces, while still chasing thee, though tied to thee, thou damned whale! Thus, I give up the spear!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moby-Dick

The story of Captain Ahab really doesn't matter because still in the end he was dragged out to sea on the back of his obsession. 
 

Who's Dave?

David is the name given to me by my Mother. Actually David John. John after my Grandfather.

Dave for short.

 

[WeAAsles]

 
You offer more excuses for our current status.  We took larger paycuts, we lost more in benefits, and we still lag in getting back any of it 13 years later.  The airlines you listed that are still flying, their employees are paid better and have better benefits.  Yet, here we are months away from the so called industry averaging pay modification.  Even that will be somehow botched, or turned into a controversy.  It does nothing for bettering our lame benefits.  Just thinking about the mess your boy Jim little got us into makes me sick.  Yet here you are on this BB playing captain smart ass sticking up for all the bad decisions the  TWU leadership has made over the years.  Either you're on the TWU payroll or some sort of halftard.

And over and over and over and over and over year after year after year it's explained to you that you kept more jobs than the rest.

More jobs comes at a cost. It's a cost you obviously prefer didn't exist but it did and does.

Ignoring it doesn't change that story either.

 

[MetalMover]

And over and over and over and over and over year after year after year it's explained to you that you kept more jobs than the rest.

More jobs comes at a cost. It's a cost you obviously prefer didn't exist but it did and does.

Ignoring it doesn't change that story either.

And what did we get in return, WeAAsles? Did we get the best pay and benefits in the industry? Did you?

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

Moby-Dick; or, The Whale (1851) is a novel by Herman Melville considered an outstanding work of Romanticism and the American Renaissance. Ishmael narrates the monomaniacal quest of Ahab, captain of the whaler Pequod, for revenge on Moby Dick, a white whale which on a previous voyage destroyed Ahab's ship and severed his leg at the knee.

On the third day of the chase, Ahab sights Moby Dick at noon, and sharks appear as well. Ahab lowers his boat for a final time, leaving Starbuck again on board. Moby Dick breaches and destroys two boats. Fedallah's corpse, still entangled in the fouled lines, is lashed to the whale's back, and so Moby Dick turns out to be the hearse Fedallah prophesied. "Possessed by all the fallen angels" (Ch. 135), Ahab plants his harpoon in the whale's flank. Moby Dick smites the whaleboat, tossing its men into the sea. Only Ishmael survives. The whale now fatally attacks the Pequod. Ahab then realizes that the destroyed ship is the hearse made of American wood in Fedallah's prophesy. The whale returns to Ahab, who stabs at him again. The line loops around Ahab's neck, and as the stricken whale swims away, the captain is drawn with him out of sight.

"Towards thee I roll, thou all-destroying but unconquering whale; to the last I grapple with thee; from hell’s heart I stab at thee; for hate’s sake I spit my last breath at thee. Sink all coffins and all hearses to one common pool! And since neither can be mine, let me then tow to pieces, while still chasing thee, though tied to thee, thou damned whale! Thus, I give up the spear!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moby-Dick

The story of Captain Ahab really doesn't matter because still in the end he was dragged out to sea on the back of his obsession. 
 

David is the name given to me by my Mother. Actually David John. John after my Grandfather.

Dave for short.

 
Uh I hate to be the one to break it to you Dave, but the story of Captain Ahab is entirely the point - it explains how he ended up roped to the whale, and illustrates the destructive/costly nature of obsession.
 
Just as you cannot look solely on the end of the strike at NWA with any real understanding without knowing the story of what led up to it.

 

[Buck]

How is that possible? Were Mechanics making more than $36.00 per hour in pay and benefits back in 1946?

When you are on such a good roll don't do the human thing and say something stupid.....

 

[WeAAsles]

 
Uh I hate to be the one to break it to you Dave, but the story of Captain Ahab is entirely the point - it explains how he ended up roped to the whale, and illustrates the destructive/costly nature of obsession.
 
Just as you cannot look solely on the end of the strike at NWA with any real understanding without knowing the story of what led up to it.

Both comments are subjective. On the first one you guys feel you're obsession is the TWU and you're riding the back of the whale. For me I feel your obsession is AMFA and you could wind up riding the back of the whale. Either way it would be your destiny if you ever found your way to it. Not mine but I do find it interesting so why I comment about it on this open forum.

Second part I know the story all too well. Read it multiple times with multiple perspectives and anyone who comments on it is going to skew it to the way they feel the story goes. That too is always subjective and the reason very simply I don't want to get into it.

Nothing personal on that but it's a conversational merry go round that never ends. I just don't see the point in getting into another one of those endless debates that will still probably be going on even after I've turned to dust.  

 

[WeAAsles]

When you are on such a good roll don't do the human thing and say something stupid.....

So the original comment itself which I responded to is stupid then as well. Or else in 1946 you would have been making over $80.00 per hour and have now regressed to what you are currently making.

And yes I am well aware of the loss in purchasing power through inflation. But I also don't think that goes all the way back to 1946?

 

[Buck]

So the original comment itself which I responded to is stupid then as well. Or else in 1946 you would have been making over $80.00 per hour and have now regressed to what you are currently making.

And yes I am well aware of the loss in purchasing power through inflation. But I also don't think that goes all the way back to 1946?

N0, just the one about $36 in 1946....
 
and I called you human.

 

[WeAAsles]

And what did we get in return, WeAAsles? Did we get the best pay and benefits in the industry? Did you?

In overall total value compensation for the groups for a while after all the other airlines went through BK after our 03 concessions, yes.

Right now that's not the case because the industry has finally started to pay some of those losses back. When we get to that point we'll also be at least on par with the industry.

 

[WeAAsles]

N0, just the one about $36 in 1946....
 
and I called you human.

Read the original comment Buck. It was meant as reactionary statement that had no basis in reality. It was meant to stir emotion and nothing more.

And last time I checked I think I would be classified as a Homo Sapien or Homo Erectus. A member of the Hominin Clade.

 

[MetalMover]

In overall total value compensation for the groups for a while after all the other airlines went through BK after our 03 concessions, yes.

Right now that's not the case because the industry has finally started to pay some of those losses back. When we get to that point we'll also be at least on par with the industry
 

No matter what they give us, it will never make up for the losses we endured. It will never make up for those people who defaulted on some debt payments, the old cars that had to be driven beyond their useful life, the vacations that were put off....the tuition that couldn't be paid for.......
We at AA have given plenty back. With the help of the TWU, we gave them a BK contract without BK,,,,,The in BK we gave them even more.